What if Heydrich Doesn't Die?

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peter_suciu
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What if Heydrich Doesn't Die?

Post by peter_suciu » 16 Dec 2002 21:06

The Reich's Protector was a pretty powerful man. He was loyal, brutal and uncompromising. What if he didn't die in 1942?

He was a potential rival to Himmler on one hand and everything I've read about him suggests he was also much more rational than the rest of the Nazi leaders. At least as rational as a man who all but single handily created the final solution.

I see Heydrich coming to power with the Waffen SS and maybe making some differences in the East. I don't think he was much of a combat leader -- his experience was originally in the navy until he was casheried -- but Sepp Detrich wasn't exactly a great SS general, he was just surrounded by good officers. I see Heydrich as the same but even better.

I still think Germany would have lost WWII but the bodycount would be higher and I think Heydrich would have ended up at Nuremburg with the rest. But he might not have been the circus clown that was Goering.

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Schmauser
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Post by Schmauser » 16 Dec 2002 22:53

I don't think he would have been taken alive. He was smart enough to escape but the "big fish" hardly ever get away. So I would say he'd probably have killed himself. :)

~Regards Schmauser

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tyskaorden
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Post by tyskaorden » 17 Dec 2002 19:20

I think Heydrich would had replaced Himmler as Reichsfüher-SS about 1944 or so. He cleraly didn't want to be number two and thru his imense file record he could certanly pull som strings.

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Marcus Karlsson

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Sam H.
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Post by Sam H. » 17 Dec 2002 21:37

I think the final solution would have been even more horrible than it was (if that's possible) - he was certainly an effective leader, and not afaid to make tough choices.

I don't see him adding in the military adventures of Germany. Rather I see him as the architect of a number of inhuman ideas.

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Nagelfar
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Post by Nagelfar » 17 Dec 2002 22:43

I personally feel Heydrich was horribly overrated.

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Schmauser
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Post by Schmauser » 19 Dec 2002 00:52

Why do you think that Nagelfar? :)

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Mike K.
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Post by Mike K. » 25 Dec 2002 04:18

One more to be hanged at Nuremberg.

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Nagelfar
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Post by Nagelfar » 25 Dec 2002 06:29

Why do you think that Nagelfar?
He certainly wasnt the one to make the SS organization so far reaching, or set it up to be a catalyst for a future caste system. Himmler was the SS, and Heydrich was just another hand to be used for his vision. Heydrich basically flew some successful missions, got kicked out of the kriegsmarine, and ordered people rounded up & executed through collecting intelligence. Ones ability to be a pilot, doesnt necessarily make you specialized with the most abstract thinking it would take for a 'day-dreaming' personality that Himmler had to come up with all the things he did for the SS. Heydrich, to me, just had himself stretched thin over a period known to us in recorded history, and, with much different or much more given to him, he would have evaporated just as Himmler did when given command over a fighting force. he had his place certainly, but that doesnt mean we can speculate and turn him into a superman just because he fit the Nazi's view of what their superficial "superman" looked like externally. History was kind to him because he fit into is position for the time he did, but because he was so close in hierarchy to Himmler, doesnt mean he could expand to fit into the function Himmler gave to the reich as a right brained thinker. they were worlds apart as people, and the SS would have been unbalanced and for all we know could have capsized with Heydrich at the helm

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Gott
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Post by Gott » 26 Dec 2002 19:27

tyskaorden wrote:I think Heydrich would had replaced Himmler as Reichsfüher-SS about 1944 or so. He cleraly didn't want to be number two and thru his imense file record he could certanly pull som strings.

Best regards,
Marcus Karlsson
yeah, i think himmler would gradually lose power, as hitler never really considered himmler to be a friend. i would also say Heydrich would become the top guy in the SS at about 1944.

he would probably escape nuremburg... my personal prediction...

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Marcel1975
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Post by Marcel1975 » 30 Dec 2002 22:17

what if Heydrich survives and then when he sees that all is going wrong he uses his elite troops to eliminate other nazi leadership and seize power for himself?

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peter_suciu
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Post by peter_suciu » 30 Dec 2002 23:48

I would see Heydrich doing whatever it takes to save the Reich. Unlike Hitler, I think that if Heydrich was in power he would try and make peace.

He might do some kind of deal with the Soviets and then force the Allies to come to peace. Heydrich might have also wanted to save his own skin and might have made greater efforts to get out of Germany.

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Post by Kriegsmarine_Done » 06 Jan 2003 00:31

I think Heydrich would do all in he’s power to save the Reich and I also think that he could take Himmlers place in SS


Long live Reinhard Heydrich a Brilliant person
*that the English was so afraid off*

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GFM2000
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Re: What if Heydrich Doesn't Die?

Post by GFM2000 » 10 Jan 2003 08:58

peter_suciu wrote: I see Heydrich coming to power with the Waffen SS and maybe making some differences in the East. I don't think he was much of a combat leader -- his experience was originally in the navy until he was casheried -- but Sepp Detrich wasn't exactly a great SS general, he was just surrounded by good officers. I see Heydrich as the same but even better.
I doubt that Heydrich would have, in anyway, be involved with the Waffen SS. At his peak, Heydrich's military service was limited to flying personal combat missions as a pilot, and (AFAIK) did not hold any leadership positions during that stinct.

A comparison with Dietrich may not be appropriate, since Dietrich was trusted into the combat role since the Liebstandarte was transformed from a personal bodyguard into a combat regiment.

Heydrich seems to be more interested in gaining political influence in Germany, and German-occupied territory. I think it was Padfield that suggested that Heydrich was aiming to oust the position of Minister of Interior after the pacification of Bohemia. Himmler may remain Reichfuhrer SS, but Heydrich, as head of the RSHA, would now also be in charge of the entire security apparatus within the Third Reich.

I speculate too, that Heydrich would try and consolidate his power by becoming Inspector of concentration camps in 1943 when Eicke was killed. This is, of course, assuming Himmler is silly enough to permit him to do so.

And yes, this is one more body to hang at Nuremberg.
:D
Kriegsmarine_Done wrote: Long live Reinhard Heydrich a Brilliant person
What the ? 8O

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Chuck_jm
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Post by Chuck_jm » 28 Jan 2003 04:27

I´ll say he would have succeeded Himmler and hanged at Nuremberg or killed himself.

/Chuck

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If Heydrich wasn't assassinated

Post by Kullman » 31 Jan 2003 21:15

Heydrich would have remained 2nd to Himmler after his post in the Protectorate so he could survive a war that was lost by 1943. After the war, he would have smuggled Nazi gold to Mecca, where he would convert to Islam. He would further his war against the Jews by developing nerve gas with the gold he smuggled. He would have armed Egypt with these weopons, and they would have won the 1967 War. Good thing he was assassinated.

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