Zoomer wrote: ↑07 Jul 2020, 16:04
ljadw wrote: ↑04 Jul 2020, 15:26
Lebensraum, the breadbasket of Ukraine and the oil of the Caucasus would not help Germany to win the war against Britain and the USA .
And, if Germany won this war,the exploitation and colonisation of European Russia (= the territories west of the Urals ) would be impossible ,and,if possible, would destroy Germany's economy .
That's obvious.
The logical move for Hitler would be to create a triple alliance (Germany, USSR, Japan) in order to defeat the Anglo-Saxons. They could give Finland, half of Romania (up to the Carpathians) and guarantee free passage from the straits of Turkey and Denmark to the Soviets. Then, the axis would expand southwards. Why did they choose to go to war with a potential ally? Did they really think that they could defeat the Red Army at the border and the soviet state would collapse? I find this very hard to believe. Maybe this was wishful thinking from the german high command. But again, why? They really did not need to go to war with the USSR. It just doesn't make sense. Any opinions? Am I missing something?
As I can't reply to your PM, I will answer here.
Hitler's decision to attack the USSR was ,even with hindsight, well founded ,given Germany's catastrophic situation in the late summer of 1940 .
The longer the war lasted, the less chance Germany had to survive .
During his conferences of July 21 and 31 1940,Hitler argued the following
1 Britain continued the war because it expected an intervention from the USA/USSR.
2 It would take Germany several years to force Britain to surrender,and meanwhile the USSR /USA would intervene,US directly, USSR indirectly .
3 IF the SU would be eliminated, Japan would be in a much stronger position vis-á-vis the USA
4 A war with Japan would prevent the USA from intervening in Europe
5 This would force Britain to give up .
6 If Britain would give up ,US could/would not intervene
7 Only the quick elimination of the USSR could force Britain to give up
8 Time constraints dictated a short victorious campaign in the east
Source : Unternehmen Barbarossa ( by Walther Post P 159 )
I will add that Lebensraum,extermination of the Slavs/Jews were NOT the reason for Barbarossa, but that Barbarossa made this possible.
The USSR was useless as an ally against Britain and the USA, besides,it refused to enter the war,on the side of Germany AND on the side of Britain .
Of course, it was obvious ,already in 1940, that a successful Barbarossa, even if it resulted in the surrender of Britain before the USA intervened,would not help Germany .
Germany was already doomed in the late summer of 1940, but Hitler was searching desperately for an exit .
If Britain surrendered before Barbarossa, there was no need for Barbarossa and Germany could not occupy Western Europe and protect its border with the SU : it was too weak.
If Britain surrendered after a short/successful Barbarossa, this would only hasten Germany's collapse,as Germany was too weak to dominate Europe from the Pyrenees to the Urals.
Germany had also not the means to colonize and exploit the east ,besides it did not need the east : not the oil,not the grain .
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