Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

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pugsville
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Re: Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

Post by pugsville » 07 Sep 2018 06:33

Futurist wrote:
07 Sep 2018 03:14
The Red Army doesn't have to get permission from Poland and/or Romania before they cross their borders. Rather, they can simply invade one or both of these countries.
I just don;t see Stalin doing that. if the West are fighting Germany good form his point of view. if the Germans invaded either he would act but I just don;t see him acting unilateral by invading.

ljadw
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Re: Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

Post by ljadw » 07 Sep 2018 08:41

Futurist wrote:
07 Sep 2018 01:49
pugsville wrote:
06 Sep 2018 12:48
ljadw wrote:
06 Sep 2018 08:30
And,what would have been the outcome of the war in 1938 ? The Czechs would have been defeated in two weeks ,and liberated by the Soviets 6 years later .
A French/British DoW in 1938 would not have helped the Czechs, as the French/British DoW in 1939 did not help Poland .Poland was defeated in a few weeks, the 7,5 million Czechs would not last longer .That's why the Czechs agreed to Hitler's demands : the Czechs were doomed if they fought and doomed if they did not fight .Whatever they did, Hitler would be in Prague,Benesj would not be in Berlin .
I agree that the Czechs would have gone down if a few weeks, the only chance would have been Poland joining, but that was unlikely.

Britain and France might have been better off going to war in 1938, while they were not well prepared, neither were the Germans, and the Germans ability to conduct a successful war against France was much less in 1938 than it was in 1940. It's quite conceivable it could lead to a Anglo-French victory in 1941-42 without the Russians getting half of Europe.

Poland was equally doomed in 1939 and they fought. Humans are only semi rational at best.
The Soviets would have also fought had Czechoslovakia been invaded in 1938, no?
No : they could not and would not .

ljadw
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Re: Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

Post by ljadw » 07 Sep 2018 08:44

Futurist wrote:
07 Sep 2018 03:14
pugsville wrote:
07 Sep 2018 02:02
Futurist wrote:
07 Sep 2018 01:49
The Soviets would have also fought had Czechoslovakia been invaded in 1938, no?
Soviet interventionism was viewed as very problematic. No one was keen to get close to the soviets, and certainly the states in between Poland and Rumanian had very very firm views that the Red Army should never be allowed on their soil. So Britian and France were very reluctant to work with the soviets, and the extreme intransigence of states like Poland and Romania made any Soviet intervention difficult.

Stalin was quite happy to fight Germany as long as Britain and France were already fighting Germany seriously. Though there are problems with how that can come about.
The Red Army doesn't have to get permission from Poland and/or Romania before they cross their borders. Rather, they can simply invade one or both of these countries.
Both Poland and Romania had a treaty with France that obliged France to help them if they were attacked by the SU .The role of Poland and Romania in The Little Entente was to keep the SU out of Europe .

OpanaPointer
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Re: Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

Post by OpanaPointer » 07 Sep 2018 11:18

pugsville wrote:
07 Sep 2018 02:05
OpanaPointer wrote:
06 Sep 2018 23:18
So is that a yes or a no?
My current view is not immediately, if Britain decides against war i can't see Churchill returning in any cabinet capacity, once Britain is at war it's quite likely he could be appointed to the Admiralty or war related post and quite easily become PM , but sort of more likely the worse the war goes.. But I am reading about the internal British politics of this period right now so my view might well change.
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Gooner1
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Re: Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

Post by Gooner1 » 07 Sep 2018 15:11

pugsville wrote:
07 Sep 2018 02:02
Soviet interventionism was viewed as very problematic. No one was keen to get close to the soviets, and certainly the states in between Poland and Rumanian had very very firm views that the Red Army should never be allowed on their soil. So Britian and France were very reluctant to work with the soviets, and the extreme intransigence of states like Poland and Romania made any Soviet intervention difficult.
Romania and the Soviet Union did have something of a rapprochement in the 1930s though probably not to the extent that Romania would allow transit rights to the Red Army. Overflight rights to the Red Air Force OTOH may have been tolerated.

pugsville
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Re: Neville Chamberlain dies in 1937

Post by pugsville » 08 Sep 2018 03:59

Gooner1 wrote:
07 Sep 2018 15:11

Romania and the Soviet Union did have something of a rapprochement in the 1930s though probably not to the extent that Romania would allow transit rights to the Red Army. Overflight rights to the Red Air Force OTOH may have been tolerated.
To where? Czechoslovakian bases? I can see it being done, I can't see it making much of a difference, propaganda for the Soviets about what good world citizens they are maybe,

Romania is much more likely than Poland to allow transit of the Red Army. Poland it's almost inconceivable no matter what, Romania merely extremely unlikely. Maybe a small force but that's not enough to make much difference.

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