The case of U 585.

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tigre
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The case of U 585.

Post by tigre » 17 Jan 2019 18:31

Hello to all :D; something about it.............................

The case of U 585! - Third patrol.

U 585, under Kapitänleutnant Ernst-Bernward Lohse, sailed from Kirkenes on March 15, 1942 to operate against the Arctic convoys. The patrol had to end prematurely after suffering damage by an attack with depth charges (Wabo). After 10 days, she returned to Kirkenes on March 25, 1942 without sinking. Effectively on the night of March 24, 1942, U 585 was subjected to a chase and attack for 60 minutes by three ships at the accesses to the Bay of Kola in grid AC8911 and received some damage. Probably the pursuers were English minesweepers, who returned to Kola Bay after escorting the QP-9 convoy.

In this regard, the Commander of the U Boat concluded that:
1.) It was the first contact with the enemy of the boat.
2.) The boat was surprised by unfavorable visibility conditions. The attention of the guard could not prevent this. These conditions are normal at this time near the coast, so each submersible is very often in danger of similar surprises. From the 60 nautical miles of the coast, good weather was observed with a very good horizon and no snow on the surface.
3.) The U boat was probably saved from destruction by sailing to periscope depth, which was not suspected by the enemy.
4.) The full filling of the upper deck tubes caused a temporary weight on the bow and caused the ship to sink. In addition, a wave of air has come to the surface, which the enemy considered a sign of destruction of the submarine. On March 25, as I learned at the command post, a British intelligence report considered a submarine destroyed in the southern Barents Sea.
5.) The crew worked excellently. Nowhere were there disturbances. The depth control line had the submersible always firmly in the hand. The failures were solved calmly and adequately. The detonations of the second series of Wabo (depth charges) were particularly hard. According to all the former submariners on board, they had not experienced anything similar, therefore, the behavior of the crew is particularly recognizable.
6.) The incident has greatly strengthened the confidence of the crew in the boat and in themselves.

Sources: http://www.u-historia.com/uhistoria/his ... 5/u585.htm
http://www.ubootarchiv.de/ubootwiki/index.php/U_585
https://www.ebay.de/itm/Orig-Foto-U-Boo ... 0009.m1982

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
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igorr
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Re: The case of U 585.

Post by igorr » 18 Jan 2019 03:17

Looks like 24.3.42 there was DD GREMYASHCHIY and 5 british M/S.

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tigre
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Re: The case of U 585.

Post by tigre » 24 Jan 2019 16:40

Hello to all :D; something about it.............................

The case of U 585! - Fourth patrol.

In Kirkenes after an inspection it was verified that the U boat had not suffered seriously so after a quick repair U 585 sailed again at 22:00 hours on March 28, practically "pushed" to the sea to intercept the convoy PQ -13. Immediately after the war, it was believed that U 585 was sunk by the British destroyer HMS Fury, who launched only 3 depth charges on March 29 at 14:15 CET (Central European Time). In 1977, the French historian Claude Yuan discovered that the boat had made contact after this attack (at 14:32 CET) from a point further south. Faced with a request from Admiral Nordmeer, Lohse replied: "I am in Grid AC8259". The attack of HMS Fury was against U 378, which received no damage.

At 22:08 on March 29, U 585 received an order specifying to occupy a position at the southern end on line AC8535 - AC8335, and at 03:00 hours on March 30, act between meridians 34 and 35 ° 20'E. At this time, convoy PQ-13 was approaching Kola Bay. At 19:15 hours (18:15 CET), the destroyer "Gremyashchiy" escorting the convoy, despite the poor visibility, at 69 ° 36'N 34 ° 03 'E found a submarine about 8-10 cables and launched 9 large depth charges graduated at a depth of 25 to 75 meters and 8 small depths charges (15 meters) on a submerged submarine. After the bombing, a floating cork, pieces of wood and paper were seen at the submarine's dive site. All this took 1 minute 58 seconds.

The submersible survived. It can be said with a high degree of certainty that the attack was carried out against U 435, which suffered almost no damage. On March 30 at 18:16 hours in grid AC8866, suddenly found two steamers (8-10 thousand tons) at a distance of 1,000 m escorted by two destroyers. The destroyers immediately turned towards the submarine. There was no time left for a torpedo attack, so at 18:17 hours the U 435 made an emergency dive. The explosions of the first four depth charges were recorded at 18:19 hours, the next two at 18:22 hours approached, two more at 18:23 hours exploded "very close", at 18:24 hours were recorded 4 more explosions and at 18:27 hours one. Then, at 18:55 hours, the crew heard a series of explosions in the distance, another explosion was recorded at 19:16 hours, and at 19:33 hours two. At 20:00 the submersible was in the Grid AB8866, at 20:42 hours she surfaced. The distance between this point and the site of the "Gremyashchiy" attack is approximately 15 miles. However, the Russian ships did not carry out other attacks at this time, and there is no doubt that the U 435 fell under the depth charges of the Soviet destroyer.

Returning to U 585. According to Claude Yuan, the most probable cause of the loss of the submarine was a mine of the German barrier "Bantos A", torn from the anchor and taken to the line of the proposed route for U 585. In fact, there is no data to judge the cause of the ship's death. It could be a drifting mine or an accident due to improper repairs from March 26 to 28. It is possible that as a result of a navigation error, U 585 has reached the Bantos A barrier itself. In the previous campaign, in full pursuit of her objectives, she had approached this barrier. U 585 was ordered to return on April 3, but there was no response. That is to say, with a high degree of probability, he was already lost at this point and far from Kirkenes.

Summing up: U 585 was not sunk by either the Soviet destroyer "Gremyashchiy" or by the British HMS Fury. The possible options are an explosion of a mine (drifting or directly on the Bantos-A line) or an accident that caused the subs to sink.

Sources: http://www.u-historia.com/uhistoria/his ... 5/u585.htm
http://www.ubootarchiv.de/ubootwiki/index.php/U_585
https://www.e-reading.club/chapter.php/ ... -1945.html

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
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dgfred
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Re: The case of U 585.

Post by dgfred » 25 Jan 2019 17:06

Thanks t.

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tigre
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Re: The case of U 585.

Post by tigre » 31 Jan 2019 13:51

Hello to all :D; you're welcome dgfred :wink:. More.............................

The case of U 585! - Loss of the U boat.

The convoy PQ.13 consisted of 19 ships and an oceanic escort integrated by the cruiser Trinidad, the destroyers Eclipse, Fury, Lamerton, the trawlers A/S Blackfly, Paynter and 3 former Norwegian whalers Sulla, Sumba, Silja sailing from Iceland to Kola. From March 24 to 27 the PQ.13 was dispersed by a strong storm, the Minesweeper Sulla was lost. On March 27 in the morning, a BV-138 of the 2./KFlGr.406 sighted some ships of the PQ.13. On March 28, the U boats U 435, U 436, U 454, U 456, U 585 and U 589, as well as the 8th Destroyers flotilla (Kpt.z.S Pönitz) with Z 24, Z 25 and Z 26 were detached.

In a confusing battle hampered by a large blizzard, the cruiser Trinidad, first disabled the Z 26 and then gave the coup de grace with torpedoes but was damaged by the impact of an own torpedo that had a malfunction. The Z 24 and Z 25 saved 88 men from the sunken Z 26, eight other survivors of the Z 26 were rescued by the U 378. The U 585 (Kplt. Lohse) attempted to reach the damaged Trinidad (according to other sources this was the U 378 that was repelled by the HMS Fury) and then it was lost (probably March 30) due to a mine of the German barrier "Bantos".

In addition to Kapitänleutnant Ernst-Bernward Lohse, other officers on board were the IWO Oblt.z.S. Rolf Faulborn, IIWO Lt.z.S.d.R Dieter Bohmann, WO-Schüler Fähnr.z.S. Horst-Joachim Wasserstrass, LI OLt.ing Max Lang, OStrm Hubert Möltgen. In total 44 men perished in the action.

Sources: http://www.u-historia.com/uhistoria/his ... 5/u585.htm
http://www.ubootarchiv.de/ubootwiki/index.php/U_585
https://www.e-reading.club/chapter.php/ ... -1945.html
https://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/42-03.htm
https://uboot-recherche.de/en/u585-boot ... id=1&pid=1

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
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