The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

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The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Peter K » 29 May 2018 19:07

Here is what the Inquiry suggested pertaining to Polish borders after WW1:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Inquiry

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Map (Danzig, all of Upper Silesia and part of East Prussia were to be Polish):

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^^^
Gdańsk-Malbork-Iława-Działdowo-Mława-Warsaw railway line was to become Polish:

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As was the Masurian Lake District which provides a border which is easy to defend:

The impact of the glacier on the evolution of terrain in Warmia-Masuria

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There are words which carry the presage of defeat. Defence is such a word. What is the result of an even victorious defence? The next attempt of imposing it to that weaker, defender. The attacker, despite temporary setback, feels the master of situation.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Peter K » 29 May 2018 19:07

And what they suggested pertaining to Czechoslovak borders after WW1:

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There are words which carry the presage of defeat. Defence is such a word. What is the result of an even victorious defence? The next attempt of imposing it to that weaker, defender. The attacker, despite temporary setback, feels the master of situation.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by henryk » 29 May 2018 20:25

Also from your source:
The Inquiry suggested that, if it was possible for Russia to become a genuine federal and democratic state, the Baltic states (with the possible exception of Lithuania) and Ukraine should be encouraged to reunify with Russia due to their belief that this would best serve the economic interests of everyone involved.
Impartial academics?? Experts??

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Peter K » 29 May 2018 21:55

My source is this: https://archive.org/stream/MyDiaryAtCon ... /mode/2up/

There is nothing about reunification of Latvia and Estonia with Russia, wikipedia must be wrong:

https://archive.org/stream/MyDiaryAtCon ... 7/mode/2up - on page 223.
There are words which carry the presage of defeat. Defence is such a word. What is the result of an even victorious defence? The next attempt of imposing it to that weaker, defender. The attacker, despite temporary setback, feels the master of situation.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Futurist » 29 May 2018 23:33

Peter K wrote:My source is this: https://archive.org/stream/MyDiaryAtCon ... /mode/2up/

There is nothing about reunification of Latvia and Estonia with Russia, wikipedia must be wrong:

https://archive.org/stream/MyDiaryAtCon ... 7/mode/2up - on page 223.
Actually, Wikipedia is correct. Indeed, on page 219, it says this:

https://archive.org/stream/MyDiaryAtCon ... 1/mode/2up

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Futurist » 29 May 2018 23:36

henryk wrote:Also from your source:
The Inquiry suggested that, if it was possible for Russia to become a genuine federal and democratic state, the Baltic states (with the possible exception of Lithuania) and Ukraine should be encouraged to reunify with Russia due to their belief that this would best serve the economic interests of everyone involved.
Impartial academics?? Experts??
Some of the people involved in the Inquiry were academics who had a lot of knowledge. For instance, take a look at these three guys:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_Cary_Coolidge

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Homer_Haskins

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaiah_Bowman

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Futurist » 29 May 2018 23:39

@Peter K: I have a question for you--just how much would Poland have been hurt had Danzig been a free state for 20 years and then given to Germany after a plebiscite?

Basically, I want to see if the comparison between the Vistula River and the Colorado River is an apt one.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by henryk » 30 May 2018 19:27

Futurist wrote:
henryk wrote:Also from your source:
The Inquiry suggested that, if it was possible for Russia to become a genuine federal and democratic state, the Baltic states (with the possible exception of Lithuania) and Ukraine should be encouraged to reunify with Russia due to their belief that this would best serve the economic interests of everyone involved.
Impartial academics?? Experts??
Some of the people involved in the Inquiry were academics who had a lot of knowledge. For instance, take a look at these three guys:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_Cary_Coolidge

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Homer_Haskins

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaiah_Bowman
Coolidge, no apparent experise on Central and Eastern Europe:
Publications[edit]
The United States as a World Power (1908)[3]
The Origins of the Triple Alliance (1917)[3]
Ten Years of War and Peace (1927)[3]
Editor-in-Chief, Foreign Affairs, a journal of the Council on Foreign Relations.[3]
Haskins, no apparent experise on Centrel and Eastern Europe:
Works[edit]
The Yazoo Land Companies. New York: The Knickerbocker Press, 1891.
A History of Higher Education in Pennsylvania. Washington: Government Printing Office, 1902 (with William I. Hull).
The Normans in European History. Boston: Houghton, Mifflin Company, 1915.
Norman Institutions. Harvard University Press, 1918.
Some Problems of the Peace Conference. Harvard University Press, 1920 (with Robert Howard Lord).
The Rise of Universities. New York: Henry Holt and Company, 1923.
Studies in the History of Mediæval Science. Harvard University Press, 1924.
The Renaissance of the Twelfth Century. Harvard University Press, 1927.
Studies in Mediaeval Culture. New York: Frederick Ungar Publishing Co., 1958 (1st Pub. 1929).
Bowmanpparent experise on Centrel and Eastern Europe:
Some of his more notable works include:
Forest Physiography (1911)
Well-Drilling Methods (1911)
South America (1915)
The Andes of Southern Peru (1916)
The New World-Problems in Political Geography (1921). Many reprints.
Desert Trails of Atacama(1924).
The Pioneer Fringe (1931)
Main Editor of Limits of Land Settlement (1937)
Is that the best that Wilson could find?

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by crolick » 30 May 2018 19:29

Futurist wrote:just how much would Poland have been hurt had Danzig been a free state for 20 years and then given to Germany after a plebiscite?
From the perspective of time that would be the price for peace with Germany and reasonable solution.
From the perspective of the 30's that would be the betrayal of the Polish policy and I seriously doubt that anyone from the Gov would seriously consider such solution.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Futurist » 09 Apr 2019 03:37

crolick wrote:
30 May 2018 19:29
Futurist wrote:just how much would Poland have been hurt had Danzig been a free state for 20 years and then given to Germany after a plebiscite?
From the perspective of time that would be the price for peace with Germany and reasonable solution.
From the perspective of the 30's that would be the betrayal of the Polish policy and I seriously doubt that anyone from the Gov would seriously consider such solution.
Fair point.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by Futurist » 09 Apr 2019 03:37

henryk wrote:
30 May 2018 19:27
Futurist wrote:
henryk wrote:Also from your source:
The Inquiry suggested that, if it was possible for Russia to become a genuine federal and democratic state, the Baltic states (with the possible exception of Lithuania) and Ukraine should be encouraged to reunify with Russia due to their belief that this would best serve the economic interests of everyone involved.
Impartial academics?? Experts??
Some of the people involved in the Inquiry were academics who had a lot of knowledge. For instance, take a look at these three guys:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_Cary_Coolidge

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Homer_Haskins

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaiah_Bowman
Coolidge, no apparent experise on Central and Eastern Europe:
Publications[edit]
The United States as a World Power (1908)[3]
The Origins of the Triple Alliance (1917)[3]
Ten Years of War and Peace (1927)[3]
Editor-in-Chief, Foreign Affairs, a journal of the Council on Foreign Relations.[3]
Haskins, no apparent experise on Centrel and Eastern Europe:
Works[edit]
The Yazoo Land Companies. New York: The Knickerbocker Press, 1891.
A History of Higher Education in Pennsylvania. Washington: Government Printing Office, 1902 (with William I. Hull).
The Normans in European History. Boston: Houghton, Mifflin Company, 1915.
Norman Institutions. Harvard University Press, 1918.
Some Problems of the Peace Conference. Harvard University Press, 1920 (with Robert Howard Lord).
The Rise of Universities. New York: Henry Holt and Company, 1923.
Studies in the History of Mediæval Science. Harvard University Press, 1924.
The Renaissance of the Twelfth Century. Harvard University Press, 1927.
Studies in Mediaeval Culture. New York: Frederick Ungar Publishing Co., 1958 (1st Pub. 1929).
Bowmanpparent experise on Centrel and Eastern Europe:
Some of his more notable works include:
Forest Physiography (1911)
Well-Drilling Methods (1911)
South America (1915)
The Andes of Southern Peru (1916)
The New World-Problems in Political Geography (1921). Many reprints.
Desert Trails of Atacama(1924).
The Pioneer Fringe (1931)
Main Editor of Limits of Land Settlement (1937)
Is that the best that Wilson could find?
Well, I don't think that the US had very many experts on Eastern Europe back in 1919.

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Re: The Inquiry on Polish and Czechoslovak borders 1919

Post by henryk » 09 Apr 2019 19:10

Futurist wrote:
09 Apr 2019 03:37
henryk wrote:
30 May 2018 19:27
Futurist wrote:
henryk wrote:Also from your source:
The Inquiry suggested that, if it was possible for Russia to become a genuine federal and democratic state, the Baltic states (with the possible exception of Lithuania) and Ukraine should be encouraged to reunify with Russia due to their belief that this would best serve the economic interests of everyone involved.
Impartial academics?? Experts??
Well, I don't think that the US had very many experts on Eastern Europe back in 1919.
So the Inquiry was flawed and their conclusion about a democratic Russia untrustworthy.

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