What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

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wm
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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#61

Post by wm » 18 Sep 2018, 20:30

Steve wrote:
20 Aug 2018, 15:42
On March 12 1938 Rydz-Smigly had a conversation with Prime Minister Slawoj-Skladowski. Smigly said that assuming France and Britain would not defend Czechoslovakia then Poland’s neutrality in relation to Germanys actions should be offered at a price. The price would be “tangible benefits in Danzig”.
If France and Britain would not defend Czechoslovakia then Poland’s neutrality would be worth zero.
Slawoj-Skladowski was a man who remembered events imprecisely but frequently in a colorful way. He isn't a good source for anything. Some of his stories teeter on the brink of delusion, like that one he saved a million Russian Jews from deportation to the USSR from Poland, when in fact it was at best tens of thousands (if any).
He was the butt of a joke even in pre-war Poland (see the definition of Slawojka in a Polish-English dictionary).
Steve wrote:Poland did have a reason to join Germany during the Czechoslovakian crisis and that was the breakup of the country. The Polish leadership from Pilsudski on had no liking for Czechoslovakia which they considered pro Soviet.
That isn't a reason to join Germany, it's a reason to act against Czechoslovakia.
For internal political reasons, Poland was incapable to cooperate with Germany.
And that is shown in "Diplomat in Berlin" where they were concerned it was impossible to find a Polish intellectual willing to travel to Germany for any reason and the Germans could be offended by that.

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#62

Post by Futurist » 30 Jun 2020, 08:21

wm wrote:
18 Sep 2018, 20:30
like that one he saved a million Russian Jews from deportation to the USSR from Poland, when in fact it was at best tens of thousands (if any).
When exactly was this?


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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#63

Post by wm » 07 Jul 2020, 22:05

In the first years of existence of reconstituted Poland.

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#64

Post by Futurist » 07 Jul 2020, 23:27

Who wanted to deport them to Poland, and why?

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#65

Post by wm » 09 Jul 2020, 23:39

Pre-war Polish citizenship was determined by the place of birth. If you were born on the territory of the former Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth you were a Polish citizen.
But many "wandering" Jews, mostly peddlers, weren't able to prove that and faced deportation to the USSR. In the end, Slawoj-Skladowski granted them citizenship but later misremembered their number ( tens of thousands.)

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#66

Post by Futurist » 09 Jul 2020, 23:50

wm wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 23:39
Pre-war Polish citizenship was determined by the place of birth. If you were born on the territory of the former Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth you were a Polish citizen.
But many "wandering" Jews, mostly peddlers, weren't able to prove that and faced deportation to the USSR. In the end, Slawoj-Skladowski granted them citizenship but later misremembered their number ( tens of thousands.)
They weren't able to prove this due to the lack of birth records for everyone in this territory back then?

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#67

Post by gebhk » 10 Jul 2020, 12:16

They weren't able to prove this due to the lack of birth records for everyone in this territory back then?
I don't think that was unusual. I recall that one of my Grandfather's ancestor's (born somewhere around Bialystok) had only a vague notion of his age because his birth was not registered. His family was not peripatetic. Many people fell through the cracks, for a range of reasons./

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#68

Post by wm » 10 Jul 2020, 19:46

As I understand it they themselves didn't know where they were born. The procedure required two witnesses if documents weren't available but they didn't have even that.

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#69

Post by Futurist » 11 Jul 2020, 20:07

How exactly could they have two witnesses to their birth if they didn't even know where the heck they were born?

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#70

Post by Futurist » 11 Jul 2020, 20:07

gebhk wrote:
10 Jul 2020, 12:16
They weren't able to prove this due to the lack of birth records for everyone in this territory back then?
I don't think that was unusual. I recall that one of my Grandfather's ancestor's (born somewhere around Bialystok) had only a vague notion of his age because his birth was not registered. His family was not peripatetic. Many people fell through the cracks, for a range of reasons./
Roughly when was he born?

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#71

Post by gebhk » 11 Jul 2020, 23:26

Best guess between 1860 and 1880.

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#72

Post by Futurist » 11 Jul 2020, 23:47

gebhk wrote:
11 Jul 2020, 23:26
Best guess between 1860 and 1880.
Were both he and both of his parents literate?

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#73

Post by Sid Guttridge » 12 Jul 2020, 09:09

I have an ancestor in the first four British censuses who put down four different years of birth ranging over a span of five years. He was a farm labourer and apparently illiterate. Because the parish records still exist, I now have better information than he did.

Cheers,

Sid

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#74

Post by gebhk » 12 Jul 2020, 12:59

Were both he and both of his parents literate?
Sorry mate - no idea. :oops:

Sid - that is not an unusual situation either. Fact is that with most births taking place at home among illiterate folk who often had little idea what their bureaucratic responsibilities were or what was being recorded about them, this was not unusual. Official records of births (and deaths) cannot be considered entirely reliable either. Aside from common honest errors in recording and transcription there were (and still are!) potent pressures to falsify such records. It's just that in previous times it was less likely that such errors would be discovered quickly or at all....

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Re: What was Poland's response to Nazi Germany's occupation of Czechia?

#75

Post by wm » 12 Jul 2020, 19:25

Futurist wrote:
11 Jul 2020, 20:07
How exactly could they have two witnesses to their birth if they didn't even know where the heck they were born?
You could have shared with them a few zlotys - to improve their memory...

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