How would Hitler's policy towards Poland have been different had Danzig been outright given to Poland back in 1919?

[gebhk]

Alas I don't know. If I recall correctly, the matter was dealt with by a different committee.

[Futurist]

Makes sense. BTW, Poland got a pretty sweet deal with Upper Silesia (even though it failed to get all of it), didn't it?

[Sid Guttridge]

Hi Guys,

Danzig would probably make no difference, whether in Poland or Germany, because the "Polish Corridor" would still exist, separating it and East Prussia from the Reich.

Hitler would simply have to contrive another reason to attack Poland, as, indeed, he did.

Cheers,

Sid.

[Sid Guttridge]

Hi Guys,

What is all this bleating about Sudetenland and South Tyrol?

If you don't want to lose territory, don't start wars you then lose. In those circumstances, you can hardly expect to go unpunished.

The Versailles and related settlements were hybrids - part punishment for the Central Powers, part self determination for Allied-leaning minorities.

An unsympathetic Sid.

[gebhk]

BTW, couldn't Poland have claimed Danzig on historic grounds

Sorry Futurist, missed this one previously. The answer is that that is precisely what the Polish delegation did as well as arguing the case that the Corridor was of little use without a functional port facility. As I recall, Woodrow Wilson sat on the fence about the Danzig issue (understandably so, because allocating Danzig to Poland went against his principles of self determination but at the same time he saw the value of the pro arguments as well). The whole business was painfully protracted but, ultimately, it would appear that it was Lloyd George who was the main if not the only stumbling block and it would appear that he would have remained obdurate whatever arguments were put before him.

[Futurist]

Interesting; thank you, gebhk!

[wm]

Makes sense. BTW, Poland got a pretty sweet deal with Upper Silesia (even though it failed to get all of it), didn't it?

Poland only got about 50 percent of the territory that voted for Poland during the plebiscite.

[Futurist]

Makes sense. BTW, Poland got a pretty sweet deal with Upper Silesia (even though it failed to get all of it), didn't it?

Poland only got about 50 percent of the territory that voted for Poland during the plebiscite.

But it also got some territory that voted for Germany during the plebiscite, no?

BTW, do we know the German-Polish vote % in both the German and the Polish parts of Upper Silesia separately?

[wm]

Some small parts, nothing more. It was like this:

the yellow line shows the border. Green voted for Poland, red for Germany.

[Futurist]

Those small parts were relatively densely populated, no? I mean, most of the territory of Upper Silesia voted for Poland but a majority of its population (almost 60%) voted for Germany. So, the small German areas/pockets must have been pretty densely populated.

BTW, do you know what % of the voters in Polish Upper Silesia voted for Poland?

[Thumpalumpacus]

I don't think much would have changed. Indeed, given the fact that Hitler tended to justify his (heretofore noncombat) aggressions by appealing to grievances about Versailles, it seems to me it would have hardened his position, which was already pretty-well set in stone.

If indeed the Poles had changed the demographics of the city in the intervening twenty years, that would simply mean that Germany had a little more ethnic-cleansing on its plate, imo. It's not like they shrank from that sort of work, after all.

[Futurist]

It is quite interesting that before the British guarantee to Poland Hitler actually didn't challenge Poland's possession of the Polish Corridor, though.

[wm]

Hitler initially considered Poland to be a neutral (or maybe friendly) country - worthy of being offered a generous (according to Hitler) deal.
That changed when Poland disappointed him.
It was his usual tactics to up the ante as negotiations progressed, and he sensed weakness in his opponents.

[wm]

It should be mentioned that 19.3 percent of voters were people who didn't live in Upper Silesia anymore, but because they were born there they were eligible to vote.
Most of them were Germans, and that privilege distorted the plebiscite substantially.

[Futurist]

Hitler initially considered Poland to be a neutral (or maybe friendly) country - worthy of being offered a generous (according to Hitler) deal.
That changed when Poland disappointed him.
It was his usual tactics to up the ante as negotiations progressed, and he sensed weakness in his opponents.

So, in this scenario, Hitler's initial offer to Poland would have allowed them to permanently keep Danzig?