Hello Friends!
Now I study losses in tanks of Allies. I have no many remarkable books which are in the Europe. I would like to learn losses French armour in 1945. On divisions and battalions. Any will help me? I also require the help on losses of tanks of Canada in 1944-1945.
In advance many thanks!
Regards.
Alex.
French armour losses in 1945?
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Alex Yeliseenko
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Re: French armour losses in 1945?
You can find some information on French losses here - http://www.chars-francais.net/ - but in French.
Cheers
Hans
Cheers
Hans
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David Lehmann
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- Location: France
French tank casualties in 1940-1945:
1) Concerning the French tanks lost during May-June 1940:
According to "Survey of Allied tank casualties in World War II" (Alvin D. Coox and L. Van Loan Naisawald) - Operations Research Office, Johns Hopkins University, Fort Lesley J. McNair (1951) based on data provided by the SHAT (Service Historique de l'Armée) : "Notice relative aux destructions d'engins blindés au cours de la guerre 1939-1945" and "Fiche : Annexe à l'étude sur les pertes en chars au cours de la campagne 1939-1940 (SECRET), received by Office of the Army Attache, American Ambassy in Pairs, in reply to an Operations Research Office request of August 4, 1950. (Acknowledgment to William Schneck who provided a copy of the original unclassified US document)
The following data represent the losses of the tank battalions, the DCRs, the DLCs, the DLMs, the reconnaissance groups and the territorial units. Tanks hit but salvaged and repaired by the field echelons in a very short time were screened out. Tank losses for the indicated period of time by number and percentage were as follows:
FRENCH TANK CASUALTY DATA, 1939-1940
CAUSE ---------- # ---------- %
Artillery (field guns, PaK, FlaK and tanks) ---------- 1,669 ---------- 95.4
Mines ---------- 45 ---------- 2.6
Aircrafts ---------- 35 ---------- 2.0
TOTAL ---------- 1,749 (1)
(1) Including 151 obsolete tanks (Renault FT17 tanks).
There were also tanks which were abandoned, scuttled or set afire by their crews to avoid captured. [Personal note: the total number including breakdowns/damages and then abandoned tanks is probably closer to 2,000 French tanks]. No data exists as to those tanks repaired in factories and parks between May 10 and June 25 1940, or those salvaged on the battlefield, repaired and sent back into battle.
The same document states that from May 10 to June 25, 1940 4,071 tanks of all types were actually engaged and 3,413 of them were modern tanks.
It is striking that even with huge air superiority and omnipresent close air support only 35 French tanks were taken out by German aircrafts. Several French tanks were destroyed by AT mines, implying a French attack like in Montcornet or Abbeville.
It would have been interesting (but impossible) to know how many of the 1,669 tanks taken out by artillery have been actually destroyed by German tanks and not by AA / AT / field guns (or a combination of several means) [e.g. roughly all the Renault B1bis heavy tanks lost in combat were never taken out by German tanks but by 8.8cm FlaK, 10.5cm leFH and several by AT mines].
According to Thomas Jentz, 839 German tanks remained completely destroyed after the battles of May-June 1940. Beside these tanks we must list the 99 Panzerjäger I and 24 StuG IIIs but I have no information about their losses.
Of course the lower number of German tank losses compared to allied losses is also because the Germans list the tanks that were found to be irreparable after the campaign … while on the French side for example many tanks considered as lost are simply damaged but could never be repaired or simply recovered on the battlefield. The number of German tanks knocked out during the combats is higher than 839 but many of them have been later repaired.
2) Tunisian campaign (1943):
LOSSES: 39 French tanks
- 9 to mines (23.1%)
- 30 to gunfire (76.9%)
3) Italian campaign (1943-1944): definite information is lacking on this campaign
4) Western Europe, 1944-1945 (after the landing in France):
LOSSES:
- 549 light and medium tanks
- 95 tank destroyers
- 134 combat cars
No tank was put out of action by enemy air action.
The tanks immobilized by mines could be repaired in hours.
The "real" losses (definitely destroyed) were due to artillery and hollow charge weapons (Panzerfaust and Panzerschreck), but in very small proportions from the latter weapon.
Regards,
David
1) Concerning the French tanks lost during May-June 1940:
According to "Survey of Allied tank casualties in World War II" (Alvin D. Coox and L. Van Loan Naisawald) - Operations Research Office, Johns Hopkins University, Fort Lesley J. McNair (1951) based on data provided by the SHAT (Service Historique de l'Armée) : "Notice relative aux destructions d'engins blindés au cours de la guerre 1939-1945" and "Fiche : Annexe à l'étude sur les pertes en chars au cours de la campagne 1939-1940 (SECRET), received by Office of the Army Attache, American Ambassy in Pairs, in reply to an Operations Research Office request of August 4, 1950. (Acknowledgment to William Schneck who provided a copy of the original unclassified US document)
The following data represent the losses of the tank battalions, the DCRs, the DLCs, the DLMs, the reconnaissance groups and the territorial units. Tanks hit but salvaged and repaired by the field echelons in a very short time were screened out. Tank losses for the indicated period of time by number and percentage were as follows:
FRENCH TANK CASUALTY DATA, 1939-1940
CAUSE ---------- # ---------- %
Artillery (field guns, PaK, FlaK and tanks) ---------- 1,669 ---------- 95.4
Mines ---------- 45 ---------- 2.6
Aircrafts ---------- 35 ---------- 2.0
TOTAL ---------- 1,749 (1)
(1) Including 151 obsolete tanks (Renault FT17 tanks).
There were also tanks which were abandoned, scuttled or set afire by their crews to avoid captured. [Personal note: the total number including breakdowns/damages and then abandoned tanks is probably closer to 2,000 French tanks]. No data exists as to those tanks repaired in factories and parks between May 10 and June 25 1940, or those salvaged on the battlefield, repaired and sent back into battle.
The same document states that from May 10 to June 25, 1940 4,071 tanks of all types were actually engaged and 3,413 of them were modern tanks.
It is striking that even with huge air superiority and omnipresent close air support only 35 French tanks were taken out by German aircrafts. Several French tanks were destroyed by AT mines, implying a French attack like in Montcornet or Abbeville.
It would have been interesting (but impossible) to know how many of the 1,669 tanks taken out by artillery have been actually destroyed by German tanks and not by AA / AT / field guns (or a combination of several means) [e.g. roughly all the Renault B1bis heavy tanks lost in combat were never taken out by German tanks but by 8.8cm FlaK, 10.5cm leFH and several by AT mines].
According to Thomas Jentz, 839 German tanks remained completely destroyed after the battles of May-June 1940. Beside these tanks we must list the 99 Panzerjäger I and 24 StuG IIIs but I have no information about their losses.
Of course the lower number of German tank losses compared to allied losses is also because the Germans list the tanks that were found to be irreparable after the campaign … while on the French side for example many tanks considered as lost are simply damaged but could never be repaired or simply recovered on the battlefield. The number of German tanks knocked out during the combats is higher than 839 but many of them have been later repaired.
2) Tunisian campaign (1943):
LOSSES: 39 French tanks
- 9 to mines (23.1%)
- 30 to gunfire (76.9%)
3) Italian campaign (1943-1944): definite information is lacking on this campaign
4) Western Europe, 1944-1945 (after the landing in France):
LOSSES:
- 549 light and medium tanks
- 95 tank destroyers
- 134 combat cars
No tank was put out of action by enemy air action.
The tanks immobilized by mines could be repaired in hours.
The "real" losses (definitely destroyed) were due to artillery and hollow charge weapons (Panzerfaust and Panzerschreck), but in very small proportions from the latter weapon.
Regards,
David
This site is an excellent source on French vehicles and may be helpful.
http://www.chars-francais.net/
http://www.chars-francais.net/
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Alex Yeliseenko
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- Joined: 25 Jan 2006, 16:40
- Location: RUSSIA