Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

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Sid Guttridge
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Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#1

Post by Sid Guttridge » 26 Nov 2020, 11:31

Hi Guys,

Which were the worst days for US deaths in WWII?

There were 2,501 US deaths on D-Day and 2,403 at Pearl Harbour.

Were there worse days?

If so, what were they?

Thanks,

Sid.

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AnchorSteam
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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#2

Post by AnchorSteam » 04 Dec 2020, 07:39

If you are talking KIA Then those were probably the big ones, but there will be many that come surprisingly close .... such as the day at Bari when the LW bombed a ship full of poison gas. The Troopship that was sunk on Christmas Day in 1944 will also be a big one.

However, what about WIA and POWs? If you want to get into really big numbers, look into Bataan & Corregidor in 1942. I think the worst day in Europe was when 2/3rds of the 106th Division went "into the bag", a terrible way for the Battle of the Bulge to start off for the US Army.


Sid Guttridge
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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#3

Post by Sid Guttridge » 05 Dec 2020, 16:46

Hi Anchorstream,

Thanks for those suggestions. I was wondering about the Battle of the Bulge, but I have never seen US fatalities broken down day by day for it. Likewise for any of the more expensive Pacific island landings. It also occurred to me that perhaps there might have been a large number of fatalities in a major naval battle, but no battleships were lost after Pearl Harbour and the carriers lost seem to have been evacuated pretty efficiently.

I was particularly after fatalities as I was wondering how US daily Covid-19 death rates at present compared with the worst days in WWII. We are now apparently well past Pearl Harbour and D-Day.

Cheers,

Sid.

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#4

Post by Richard Anderson » 05 Dec 2020, 18:24

Sid Guttridge wrote:
26 Nov 2020, 11:31
Hi Guys,

Which were the worst days for US deaths in WWII?

There were 2,501 US deaths on D-Day and 2,403 at Pearl Harbour.

Were there worse days?

If so, what were they?

Thanks,

Sid.
Sid, US Army ground forces suffered a total of 4,252 known casualties (KIA, MIA, WIA) on 6 June 1944. I rather doubt that over half of those were killed or DOW. Incomplete figures for KIA and unreconciled MIA indicate about 1,400 died on 6 June, including Navy personnel of the NCDU and Beach battalions.

BTW, the 2,403 American dead at Pearl Harbor includes 68 civilians.

Cheers!
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Sid Guttridge
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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#5

Post by Sid Guttridge » 06 Dec 2020, 06:07

Hi Richard,

The figure of 2,501 US dead on D-Day comes from the National D-Day Memorial Foundation in the USA. It also gives 1,913 other Allied fatalities.

Cheers,

Sid

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#6

Post by Richard Anderson » 06 Dec 2020, 08:03

Sid Guttridge wrote:
06 Dec 2020, 06:07
Hi Richard,

The figure of 2,501 US dead on D-Day comes from the National D-Day Memorial Foundation in the USA. It also gives 1,913 other Allied fatalities.

Cheers,

Sid
The rather interesting page on Ms. Tuckwiller's ten-year search actually says 2,499. Nevertheless, it cannot be correct even, I suspect, if she included all USAAF and Navy deaths on D-Day.
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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#7

Post by Carl Schwamberger » 26 Dec 2020, 20:51

Four days vs a single day, the seizure of the Tarawa Atoll cost 1600+ dead. 644 died when the CVE Liscome Bay was sunk 23 November during the battle on Betio & Makin Islands.

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#8

Post by Thumpalumpacus » 27 Dec 2020, 01:12

For one single day of WWII, it looks like D-Day, at around 2500.

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#9

Post by Carl Schwamberger » 27 Dec 2020, 02:18

Sid Guttridge wrote:
05 Dec 2020, 16:46
... It also occurred to me that perhaps there might have been a large number of fatalities in a major naval battle, but no battleships were lost after Pearl Harbour and the carriers lost seem to have been evacuated pretty efficiently. ...
A quick check shows the assorted cruiser/battleship actions off Guadalcanal typically were under 400 killed per battle. Tho per capita of the crews involved the losses were severe.

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#10

Post by Cantankerous » 09 Jun 2023, 04:17

Richard Anderson wrote:
06 Dec 2020, 08:03
Sid Guttridge wrote:
06 Dec 2020, 06:07
Hi Richard,

The figure of 2,501 US dead on D-Day comes from the National D-Day Memorial Foundation in the USA. It also gives 1,913 other Allied fatalities.

Cheers,

Sid
The rather interesting page on Ms. Tuckwiller's ten-year search actually says 2,499. Nevertheless, it cannot be correct even, I suspect, if she included all USAAF and Navy deaths on D-Day.
The sinking of the USS Corry during the D-Day invasion left 24 men dead, and there was another US vessel sunk on D-Day, the USS PC-1261. How many people were killed when the USS PC-1261 was sunk?

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#11

Post by Richard Anderson » 09 Jun 2023, 05:21

Cantankerous wrote:
09 Jun 2023, 04:17
The sinking of the USS Corry during the D-Day invasion left 24 men dead, and there was another US vessel sunk on D-Day, the USS PC-1261. How many people were killed when the USS PC-1261 was sunk?
One.
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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#12

Post by rcocean » 09 Jun 2023, 17:10

The Official US history (based on contemporary Records) Cross-Channel Attack shows about 400 known KIA and 1000 MIA/POW for the 82nd and 101st, and 2000 KIA/WIA/POW for V Corps (the 1st and 29th Divisions). If you assume the normal 3-1 KIA/WIA ratio, and 1/2 the MIA/POW airborne losses were KIA, you still only get to 1400 killed. there's a detailed "US battle casualties in WW II" book which has an incredible amount of detail, which probably fine-tunes this numbers. And while there were thousands of US aircraft on D-Day, there was little or no air opposition. Navy losses were minimal. There's simply no way you can get to 2500. Its an obvious error.

I've noticed that non-miltary historians constantly get "Killed" and "casualties" or "losses" mixed up.
Last edited by rcocean on 09 Jun 2023, 17:15, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#13

Post by rcocean » 09 Jun 2023, 17:15

Pearl Harbor is still the deadliest day with 2400 KIA.

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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#14

Post by Richard Anderson » 09 Jun 2023, 17:58

rcocean wrote:
09 Jun 2023, 17:10
The Official US history (based on contemporary Records) Cross-Channel Attack shows about 400 known KIA and 1000 MIA/POW for the 82nd and 101st, and 2000 KIA/WIA/POW for V Corps (the 1st and 29th Divisions). If you assume the normal 3-1 KIA/WIA ratio, and 1/2 the MIA/POW airborne losses were KIA, you still only get to 1400 killed. there's a detailed "US battle casualties in WW II" book which has an incredible amount of detail, which probably fine-tunes this numbers. And while there were thousands of US aircraft on D-Day, there was little or no air opposition. Navy losses were minimal. There's simply no way you can get to 2500. Its an obvious error.
The losses of the 82d and 101st Airborne complicates things, since their precise casualties are not known, and I did not include them in my reply. The main problem is identifying when those airborne casualties were incurred since disorganization and the loss of key personnel meant that most casualty accounting was not done until weeks and months after the event. That said, the 82d may have suffered as many as 697 killed and died of wounds on D-Day and suffered at least 1,292 dead during the campaign, compared to the commonly accepted 457. Edit - A friend who is an expert of the casualties incurred by the 82d tells me the 697 figure may be exaggerated and is unsupported. The casualties of the 101st are less well accounted for but were at least 182 killed and died of wound and may have been close to 600 as well, while its casualties for the campaign included at least 982 dead rather than the commonly accepted 868.

Thus, if all casualties in the beach landings, airborne landings, and supporting Navy and Air Force operations are included, they may approach the total number lost at Pearl Harbor and are certainly at least the second highest after Pearl Harbor.
I've noticed that non-miltary historians constantly get "Killed" and "casualties" or "losses" mixed up.
Very true.
Last edited by Richard Anderson on 10 Jun 2023, 00:43, edited 1 time in total.
Richard C. Anderson Jr.

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Sid Guttridge
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Re: Worst days for US deaths in WWII?

#15

Post by Sid Guttridge » 09 Jun 2023, 18:38

Hi Richard,

There is also suspicion that several hundred deaths in two practice landings on the South Devon coast at Slapton in earlier months were kept back from public acknowledgement at the time in order to protect morale and were later added to the D-Day death tolls. Do you know if this was the case, or has been sorted out yet?

Cheers,

Sid.

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