Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

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Der Alte Fritz
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Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 28 Apr 2013 07:41

I am looking for details of the artillery bombardment for Operation Veritable - anyone got any sources or orders of battle or actual details?

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phylo_roadking
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by phylo_roadking » 04 May 2013 00:01

From the Canadian Official History - http://ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/Canada/C ... ry-18.html
As we have noted, the artillery support for Operation "VERITABLE" had been planned as a major battle-winning factor. The concentration of fire which fell on the German 84th Division that day was probably not equalled on a similar front during the entire war in the west. It was calculated that 1034 guns--one-third of them mediums, heavies and superheavies--were engaged in the bombardment. Seven divisional artilleries, five Army Groups Royal Artillery, and two anti-aircraft brigades struck this massive blow, which was designed to harass the enemy's headquarters and communications, silence his batteries and mortars and smash his troop positions, destroying his forces and demoralizing survivors. In five bombardments during the day an average weight of more than nine tons of shells was to burst on each of 268 targets. The cannonade was augmented by four divisional "Pepper Pot" groups, which swept the front continuously with the coordinated fire, at relatively short range, of all available tank guns, anti-tank guns, light antiaircraft guns, medium machine-guns and heavy mortars. Rocket salvoes from the 12 projectors of the 1st Canadian Rocket Battery saturated thirteen targets in and about the German forward positions.
Three sources are footnoted for some of the above details...

The History of the Brigadier Royal Artillery Branch of Headquarters First Canadian Army, 72-3.

Battlefield Tour, 19. "RA 30 Corps Operation Instruction No. 32", 3 Feb 45; "30 Corps Operation Instruction No. 45", 27 Jan 45, both on R.C.A. First Cdn Army file A/RCA/TS/VERITABLE/5. 21st Army Group report, 51.

W.D., 1st Rocket Bty., 8 Feb 45.
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Der Alte Fritz
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 04 May 2013 18:51

Good start but I am looking for the actual fire plan or something like:
ORS Report No.26" - Fire Support in Operation VERITABLE, Effect on Forward Defensive Position

thanks

Michael Dorosh
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Michael Dorosh » 30 May 2013 04:18

Der Alte Fritz wrote:Good start but I am looking for the actual fire plan or something like:
ORS Report No.26" - Fire Support in Operation VERITABLE, Effect on Forward Defensive Position

thanks
I have a British army report from after the war that may have the detail you are looking for.

Ian Hogg also has some detail in a book on my shelf.

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Der Alte Fritz
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 30 May 2013 07:49

I already have the Canadian Historical Account and the BAOR Battlefield Guide but if it is something other than these that would be interesting,
cheers

Michael Dorosh
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Michael Dorosh » 30 May 2013 13:22

Hogg, Ian. Great Land Battles of World War II (Doubleday & Company, Inc., Garden City, NY, 1987) ISBN 0385242409 has a simplified image of the initial fireplan. I was able to obtain a digital copy of a 1947(?) British Army artillery manual which discusses the VERITABLE fireplan in detail, and it turns out that Hogg based his simplified diagram in that book on the fireplan diagram in the manual. I have copies of both.

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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Brendan Esposito » 16 May 2016 23:44

I have found an 'Operation Veritable' artillery firing plan for R.A. 30 Corps. It is issued in conjunction with Task Tables 33a, 33b and 33c. It is marked 'Secret' and 'Index No.3'. It is dated 5th Feb 1945.

Is this of interest to anyone?

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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Brendan Esposito » 16 May 2016 23:50

I have found an 'Operation Veritable' artillery firing plan for R.A. 30 Corps. It is issued in conjunction with Task Tables 33a, 33b and 33c. It is marked 'Secret' and 'Index No.3'. It is dated 5th Feb 1945.

Is this of interest to anyone?

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Sheldrake
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Sheldrake » 17 May 2016 00:53

Brendan Esposito wrote:I have found an 'Operation Veritable' artillery firing plan for R.A. 30 Corps. It is issued in conjunction with Task Tables 33a, 33b and 33c. It is marked 'Secret' and 'Index No.3'. It is dated 5th Feb 1945.

Is this of interest to anyone?
I am always interested in this sort of thing. ;)

Brendan Esposito
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Brendan Esposito » 17 May 2016 05:48

The sheet appears to be a large tranparent overlay, to be used in conjunction with a map. It looks to have calculated trajectories with 'X' marks the spot at particular points which I would imagine correspond to particular co-ordinates on the map.

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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Carl Schwamberger » 21 May 2016 02:29

Brendan Esposito wrote:I have found an 'Operation Veritable' artillery firing plan for R.A. 30 Corps. It is issued in conjunction with Task Tables 33a, 33b and 33c. It is marked 'Secret' and 'Index No.3'. It is dated 5th Feb 1945.

Is this of interest to anyone?
I'd be very interested in a copy. Would pay postage & copy costs.

Wapen
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Wapen » 30 Dec 2018 19:22

I've got Terry Copp's version of "fire sp in op veritable" here. Juicy! Anyone doing any interesting research on Veritable? I've read all the general published accounts and now I'm digging into unit histories, war diarys etc. Any tips welcome. I'm really missing Axis side.

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Der Alte Fritz
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 31 Dec 2018 10:28

Interesting, where did you find that?
The details of this discussion were held over at RKKA forum:
https://forums.armchairgeneral.com/foru ... mbardments
as a comparison with Soviet artillery attacks.

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Der Alte Fritz
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Re: Operation Veritable - Feb 1945

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 31 Dec 2018 10:30

See here for an interesting site on artillery
http://nigelef.tripod.com/wt_of_fire.htm

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