A blunder that lead to thousands of deaths

[hauptmannn]

I watched the history channel on the pilot that bombed london. If the pilot had not bombed london there would not have been any attacks on cities. After 2 bombings on German soil, the Luftwaffe stayed clear away from british cities, but Churchill however, continued to attack german cities and therefore i assume the death of thousands of people was because of Churchill not taking into account that the germans stopped bombing london after the pilot bombed london by mistake. What do you think?

[kelty90]

"Churchill", by which i assume you mean the British, bombed Germany because there was no other way to hit back at their enemy. Certainly a blockade would work eventually, but there was no way other than aerial bombardment to hit back at Germany. Surely no one would expect a combatant nation NOT to fight as well as they were able?.
Given what the Germans had done, and were doing, in Poland there really is no cause for complaint. I might add that in the years following 1940, German policy towards civilians in countries that they occupied was so harsh that Allied aerial attacks pale into insignificance. "Big boys rules" I'm, afraid!. The Germans bit off more than they could chew, but at least they were more robust during the war than their apologists now, forever whining about how unfair the Allies fought.

[hauptmannn]

Even if the Germans treated the inhabitants of occupied territories badly it does not justify more unecessary deaths of german civilians, who were on the whole mostly innocent. And with the british bombing german cities the germans retaliated by a bombing run of around 240 bombers killing 2000 british civilians and later on, a bombing campaign known as the blitz. If Churchill noticed that the germans stopped bombing areas around london after one of their pilot's blunders and halted british bombers from attacking german cities, many lives on both sides would have been saved.

[Roger Griffiths]

In the 1930's, there was much interest in strategic bombing amongst all the powers. The idea was that by attacking civilians, it could lead to an early surrender by the enemy, and consequently save the sort of losses suffered by most of the participants in WWI.

However, none of the powers had strategic bombing forces at the beginning of WWII. The Luftwaffe was a tactical air force very much tied to the operations of the Army. It bombed the centre of Rotterdam (Not a military target) in 1940, as a means to get Holland to surrender. It succeeded. It bombed London by night as a result of losses in daylight actions during the Battle of Britain. But, it was not London per se or civilians which were the target. The docks were the target, London, then being the greatest port in the World. Subsequently, they were destroyed by the dockers strikes of the 1950's most efficiently. It was only in the Baedecker raids of 1944, that the Luftwaffe bombed British cultural sites with no military significance.

The RAF had a considerable bomber force at the beginning of WWII, but it's planes were not large load carriers or that long range. They also did not carry effective defensive armament and fighters could not accompany for lack of range. Losses from daylight operations were unsustainable (My fathers brother was a victim of this 10/11 August 1940). Also finding the target was not nearly good enough. So, RAF Bomber Command was reorganized and re-equipped to attack German cities with a view to levelling them. ACM Harris had maps of German cities divided up into bombing zones and the campaign was launched.

The Americans also produced and organized long range heavy bomber forces, but with their adequate defensive firepower could operate in daylight. From 1944, they could even take fighter escorts with them. They had more interest in specific strategic targets, and operating in daylight could find them more easily.

Overall, the civilian population has always been the ultimate target. This has been a truism since the beginning. In the Cold War, the targets for ICBM's was the civilian population, mainly concentrated in cities.

Roger

[tonyh]

It bombed the centre of Rotterdam (Not a military target) in 1940, as a means to get Holland to surrender. It succeeded.

The Luftwaffe actually bombed the port of Rotterdam, a legitimate strategic target (which the British and the Americans bombed later in 1943, causing far more damage incidentally). The resulting fire in Rotterdam was not by design, but rather by accident. The surrender document had already been signed by the Dutch, but the return call to the bombers didn't reach the whole group in time, so the attack itself had little to do with Holland's decision to surrender.

Tony

[bouldarie]

It bombed the centre of Rotterdam (Not a military target) in 1940, as a means to get Holland to surrender. It succeeded.

The Luftwaffe actually bombed the port of Rotterdam, a legitimate strategic target (which the British and the Americans bombed later in 1943, causing far more damage incidentally). The resulting fire in Rotterdam was not by design, but rather by accident. The surrender document had already been signed by the Dutch, but the return call to the bombers didn't reach the whole group in time, so the attack itself had little to do with Holland's decision to surrender.

Tony

[bouldarie]

revenge bombing was done on both sides Luwaffe bombed coventry with fire bombs. When opportunity presented itself Allies bombed dresden. both non military installations, but defeating public spirit all battles are not fought conventionally, whomever wins sets policy about warcrimes. There are still files sealed by 100 year act by Allies.who knows?

[hauptmannn]

I agree. The allies now should admit their crimes. The axis nations have been criticised for decades, now its the allies turn.

[redcoat]

I agree. The allies now should admit their crimes. The axis nations have been criticised for decades, now its the allies turn.

Seeing the Allies have never accused the German air raids on Allied cities of being war crimes, why should the Allied raids on German cities be any different.

[Thomhasj]

It bombed the centre of Rotterdam (Not a military target) in 1940, as a means to get Holland to surrender. It succeeded.

The Luftwaffe actually bombed the port of Rotterdam, a legitimate strategic target (which the British and the Americans bombed later in 1943, causing far more damage incidentally). The resulting fire in Rotterdam was not by design, but rather by accident. The surrender document had already been signed by the Dutch, but the return call to the bombers didn't reach the whole group in time, so the attack itself had little to do with Holland's decision to surrender.

Tony

If the bombardments were purely militaristic, why did the Germans threaten to do the same with other major cities like Utrecht, Den Haag and Amsterdam?? It was NOT a military bombardment, but a "Warschau-like" bombardment to try to break our resistance by destroying our cities and the families that lived there; a very cowardice manner to fight from the Germans.

[hauptmannn]

You better watch your language, there are many germans here as well as austrians. And please don't use slangs like this. they are rude and stupid.

[Thomhasj]

I'm sorry if I hurt someone in the process; my apologies - sometimes I just get carried away...

I fixed my post.

[Ebusitanus]

I agree. The allies now should admit their crimes. The axis nations have been criticised for decades, now its the allies turn.

Seeing the Allies have never accused the German air raids on Allied cities of being war crimes, why should the Allied raids on German cities be any different.

False, German Officers of the Luftwaffe were acused, condemned and executed for "civilian bombing" like the one at Belgrad.
Coventry was a retaliation bombing for a RAF attack on Munich on the 9th of November on the Nazi Holyday there to remember the Putsch.

[Orok]

In the 1930's, there was much interest in strategic bombing amongst all the powers. The idea was that by attacking civilians, it could lead to an early surrender by the enemy, and consequently save the sort of losses suffered by most of the participants in WWI.

However, none of the powers had strategic bombing forces at the beginning of WWII. The Luftwaffe was a tactical air force very much tied to the operations of the Army. ...

Nobody heard of Guernica?

[redcoat]

[quote="Ebusitanus
False, German Officers of the Luftwaffe were acused, condemned and executed for "civilian bombing" like the one at Belgrad.
.[/quote]
This raid took place after the Yugoslavian government had declared Belgrade an 'open city' (ie undefended). This was a direct violation of international law