British Order of Battle

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JonS
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by JonS » 24 Jun 2010 05:00

verdenpark wrote:Australia actually had 12 Infantry and 3 Armoured Divisions.
Those that saw action were:
3rd., 4th., 5th., and 11th. Militia Div.s.
6th., 7th., 8th., and 9th., A.I.F. Div.s.
1st. and 4th. Armoured Brigade groups.

10th. Div. was formed either very late 1940, or early 1941, and disbanded late 1942/43. I think(?) this was an A.I.F. Div. that was kept for home defence, but not sure. Anyone know?

All Armoured Divisions were disbanded by 1944, and replaced by the 4th. Armoured Brigade.
I take it there was also 1st, 2nd, and 12th Militia Divs?

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Andy H
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by Andy H » 25 Jun 2010 00:06

Hi JonS

Yes there were in answer to your query

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-con ... battle.htm

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Andy H

Larso
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by Larso » 06 Jul 2010 12:05

I will have to check but I didn't think the 4th saw action - unless it was that change of commander/change divisional number part, which is also new to me. The 1st Division was apparently mainly a training formation but I imagine it would've served a role in the advent of an invasion. The 8th was lost when Singapore fell, though one brigade's battalions were scattered elsewhere and were all captured seperately. I think the 12th was the designation of the troops supporting Darwin?? I don't remember much at all about the 10th. Some of these divisions only had 2 brigades. Brigades too could have 2 or 4 battalions, as well some divisions didn't have all the usual support - like Recon regts. I've spent a fair bit of time researching this sort of thing but I've found it very hard to get a clear picture on it all.

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verdenpark
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by verdenpark » 09 Jul 2010 13:11

There was something on the news about the 4th. Div. last last year, or early this year. From what I could discern from the story, the 4th. was responsible for the security of Cape York and the Torres Strait Islands. Apart from the constant air raids on the islands, they appartently saw action against Japanese ground force incurssions throughout their area of operations. How big these incurssions where I cannot say, but I am guessing that would be small recon. groups. I do know that Jap forces were active along the East coast as far South as Rockhampton. I was also told by someone who was in North Queensland at the time that a large Jap sub, in near perfect condition was found stuck in mud, on a river near Cairns in the mid 1980's. A big news story up there apparently.

Must say I did not know about the Div.s changing numbers when their G.O.C.s were changed either. I know the A.I.F. Div.s kept their numbers.

The 12th. Div. was in the N.T.

I have been looking on the W.W.2 Australian army for over twenty years, and have virtually nothing to show for it. Apart from a few unit histories (damn expensive to get now days), I only have vague mention of units, like the 10th. Div. in the references that I have.

It is very frustrating!
Those who live by the sword...... get shot.

Larso
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by Larso » 11 Jul 2010 05:23

Yes - I've shared your pain! All the books I could get hold of only talked in generalities about the army outside the AIF. Long's official history does better but it's hard to find. Eventually I got to the War Memorial and found one good reference that showed the details of the Australian divisions. I've read a lot about the impressive size of the army but the 10th for instance was only active for a few weeks and the 12th for about 6 months (someone who knows a bit about it has finally put some useful information on Wiki), though their composite units continued to serve as part of the regional defence.

I'd read that the 10th was to participate in the invasion of Japan but finding any details on this defied me for ten years. Thanks to those Wiki entries it appears it was to be resurrected just for that operation and to be constituted with veterans from the three AIF divisions.

We have a thread here somewhere that looks at in some detail the composition of the army at about Sept 1942. Some of my unit histories had reasonable detail on weapons and troop stats, and I've put what I could there. The army was looking reasonably strong at this point I have to say. With the US forces and the British divisions promised (including an armoured one) in the advent of a major invasion, Australia was far from defenceless.

ignacioosacar
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by ignacioosacar » 30 Aug 2010 23:51

Dear Forum,

What was the PAI Force ?

Was it Persia & Irak Force ?

What was its OB ?

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Andy H
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by Andy H » 05 Sep 2010 14:02

ignacioosacar wrote:Dear Forum,

What was the PAI Force ?

Was it Persia & Irak Force ?

What was its OB ?
Hi

Yes it was and if you scroll to the bottom within this link you will come across various OoB's
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqforce

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Andy H

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sample
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Re:

Post by sample » 27 Apr 2011 11:13

Andy H wrote: 59th-Orignally formed in September 1939 as a Motor Division but reorganised in the June of 1940 as a Infantry Division. The Division was placed in suspended animation on October 19th 1944

61st-Reorganised in August'45 as a Light Division-It had been earmarked for service in the Far East
With all respect, what was the organisation of a Light Division and also a Motor Division (from what i've read it had only 2 infantry brigades, but it did contained some other particular elements) ?

best regards,
M.

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Andy H
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Re: Re:

Post by Andy H » 10 May 2011 23:38

sample wrote:
Andy H wrote: 59th-Orignally formed in September 1939 as a Motor Division but reorganised in the June of 1940 as a Infantry Division. The Division was placed in suspended animation on October 19th 1944

61st-Reorganised in August'45 as a Light Division-It had been earmarked for service in the Far East
With all respect, what was the organisation of a Light Division and also a Motor Division (from what i've read it had only 2 infantry brigades, but it did contained some other particular elements) ?

best regards,
M.
Hi M

For the OoB of Mobile Division
http://niehorster.orbat.com/017_britain ... v_mot.html
The Mobile Division totalled some 10,136men (info from Jolsen)

I dont have a OoB for the proposed Light Division but I imagine that it could well be short a Brigade or a couple of Inf Btn's and various support arm services

Regards

Andy H

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sample
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Re: Re:

Post by sample » 11 May 2011 07:25

thank you very much Andy H for you answer

M.

Spontoon
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by Spontoon » 12 Aug 2011 17:09

I'm looking for information on British labour Divisions and Pioneer Battalions in 1940. Can anyone help?

gambadier
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by gambadier » 05 Apr 2015 09:12

The master source for British Army divisions is the two volume 'Orders of Battle - United Kingdom and Colonial Formations and Units in the Second World War 1939 - 1945', Lt Col HF Joslen, HMSO, 1960. This details the commanders, theatres, and all constituent units of all divisions and all dates of changes.

Its drawbacks are that it only covers manoeuvre divisions and brigades and excludes the Indian Army. That said it does list all British infantry and armoured units and from this is it possible to identify the UK infantry units in Indian divisions (basically in an Indian division 1/3 of the infantry and all the artillery was British, although this decreased as the war progressed). The second snag is it only includes divisional artillery units, and similarly other arms and services, apart from some periodic overviews.

YahsSoldr
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by YahsSoldr » 29 Apr 2015 12:03

2-4 Machine Gun Battalions came under Army command, and there was one Motor Brigade MGC shared between them.This firepower was in addition to the guns at Divisional level.

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sitalkes
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Re: British Order of Battle

Post by sitalkes » 05 Jun 2015 05:51

Hi, this is Powerpoint file showing the a British Order of Battle for Home Forces (Land, Sea, and Air) September 1940

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_JIB ... authuser=0

HenryCox
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British Order of Battle

Post by HenryCox » 23 Mar 2019 13:23

Nice rifle Chris,much better with a proper British stock on it. I like my Aussie with her thick waist but these British gal with their slim waist and smooth lines are really sweet.

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