The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Discussions on the Allies and the Neutral States in general and the countries that does not have sections of their own.
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iffig
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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by iffig » 13 Jul 2011 08:15

Some sources:

http://forum.virtualfighters.cz/viewtop ... 656b637c0b


say:

25mm SA-L Mle34 L/72 AT gun

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by The Edge » 13 Jul 2011 08:30

Ironmachine wrote:FM 24/29, 7.5mm?
Why should Chinese purchase AFV with
1) infantry LMG, with obvious drawbacks if placed inside armoured vehicle
2) MG caliber they didn't used?

If you somewhere found info about 7.5mm MG used in Chinese model armed-UE (I know one Chinese link), note that these vehicles were seized by the French in Indochina and re-armed with their stock model MGs - MAC 31 Riebel from the previous question.

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by The Edge » 13 Jul 2011 08:45

iffig wrote:Some sources:
http://forum.virtualfighters.cz/viewtop ... 656b637c0b
say:
25mm SA-L Mle34 L/72 AT gun
This source deals with French UE vehicles in Europe, not the Chinese-ordered, French-used model in Asia. :wink:
Btw, only way to mount 25mm ATG on UE is externally - nothing but the rifle-caliber MG would fit its small armoured superstructure.

Regardless how much I like to act more French then the De Gaulle (call me Antic :lol: ), I may point out:
(iffig) There are rather few French MG types, especially ones made for export :idea:
(Ironmachine) This MG type has strong "Spanish connection" :wink:
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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by Ironmachine » 13 Jul 2011 11:25

The Edge wrote:If you somewhere found info about 7.5mm MG used in Chinese model armed-UE (I know one Chinese link), note that these vehicles were seized by the French in Indochina and re-armed with their stock model MGs - MAC 31 Riebel from the previous question.
Actually, I found a link about French UEs armed with the FM 24/29 in casemates built for export orders to China, so I thought the weapon could be the same... not sure about the accuracy of the link, though.
http://members.multimania.co.uk/Indochi ... /afvs.html

Let's try again:M1914 Hotchkiss?

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by The Edge » 13 Jul 2011 12:32

Ironmachine wrote:
The Edge wrote:If you somewhere found info about 7.5mm MG used in Chinese model armed-UE (I know one Chinese link), note that these vehicles were seized by the French in Indochina and re-armed with their stock model MGs - MAC 31 Riebel from the previous question.
Actually, I found a link about French UEs armed with the FM 24/29 in casemates built for export orders to China, so I thought the weapon could be the same... not sure about the accuracy of the link, though.
http://members.multimania.co.uk/Indochi ... /afvs.html
It is quite possible that colonial troops lacked the adequate tank-destined MGs, so infantry LMG model had to be used as emergency solution. :roll:
Ironmachine wrote:Let's try again: M1914 Hotchkiss?
Very close - Chinese used this Hotchkiss model on their Renault FT-17 tanks and (from photos at "China" section) infantry MMG version was also used in numbers. :)
Mle 14 distinctions, when mounted at AFV (TKS in this case), are:
A - visible cooling discs
B - rather big bulge at gas-receiver
Compare this with the photo of more sleeky quiz-model.
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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by Ironmachine » 13 Jul 2011 21:35

Then perhaps Hotchkiss M1922?

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by The Edge » 14 Jul 2011 01:02

Well done – it is a tank-gun variant of Mle 22/23 Hotchkiss LMG. :D

Chinese used a lot of them (along Mle 14 MMGs), so they was a natural choice for a vehicle purchased from France (in their standard 7.92mm caliber).

This is one such gun that survived (coming from Peru)
http://www.naturabuy.fr/MITRAILLEUSE-HO ... 43111.html
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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by Ironmachine » 14 Jul 2011 16:34

Thanks, Edge.
A picture of soldiers in 1942. Which Army?
soldiers.jpg
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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by iffig » 14 Jul 2011 17:19

Hum! Hard to tell from that angle ....
Would say Swedish soldiers wearing 1937 helmets (the national insignia was only introduced in october 1942, so that would make an early 1942 picture).
Highly conjectural, nevertheless....

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by Ironmachine » 14 Jul 2011 20:25

No, not swedish. :(
But the helmet should be a good hint.
Regards.

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by The Edge » 14 Jul 2011 23:24

Den danske Brigade? :roll: (Danish brigade in Sweden)

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by iffig » 15 Jul 2011 06:51


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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by Ironmachine » 15 Jul 2011 07:18

No, they are not soldiers of the Danske Brigade.
And just to clarify the matter: as I said before, the helmet is a good hint, but it is not a Swedish 1937 helmet.

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by iffig » 15 Jul 2011 09:46

The helmet reminds me of the Soviet model 40. But that's only add to the confusion!
Soldiers do not look like Soviets, they do not salute like the Polish do (so no Poles in UdSSR) and in 1942 the Czechs were dressed from British battle-dress stocks (So not Czechs in the UdSSR).....

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Re: The official AHF Allied & Neutral Armies quiz thread

Post by Ironmachine » 15 Jul 2011 10:43

You are right: they are not Soviet, Polish or Czech.

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