Yugoslave artillery 1941

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ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 01 Dec 2013 01:06

Factory designations 4,7 cm vz. 38
Yugoslav designation 4,7 cm M38
Yugoslav official designation for 81 mm Brandt mortar was 81 mm M31
81 mm M 31/38 is the unofficial designation of mortars produced under license at the factory in Kragujevac.

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ain92
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ain92 » 01 Dec 2013 12:12

ltcolonel wrote:Factory designations 4,7 cm vz. 38
Yugoslav designation 4,7 cm M38
Yugoslav official designation for 81 mm Brandt mortar was 81 mm M31
81 mm M 31/38 is the unofficial designation of mortars produced under license at the factory in Kragujevac.
Thanks again! What was the difference of M.28 with the Skoda A5?
I'm also interested in "80 m/m prot.aeropl. top M.5/32l", known here as M.05/32. Are there any photos of such an artillery piece?
With best regards, Ilya.

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 01 Dec 2013 16:03

M.28 or M.38 ?

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 01 Dec 2013 16:09

Sturm78 wrote:Hi all,

A 8cm M05/28 or M05/32 AA gun:

Image from EBay
Sturm78
This is 8 cm M05/28
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by ltcolonel on 01 Dec 2013 23:09, edited 1 time in total.

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ain92
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ain92 » 01 Dec 2013 17:05

ltcolonel wrote:M.28 or M.38 ?
Of course it's a typo, I meant M.38.
With best regards, Ilya.

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MarkoZ
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by MarkoZ » 01 Dec 2013 17:19

Looks like three 15 mm aa machine guns at end of line of Mortars,

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MarkoZ
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by MarkoZ » 01 Dec 2013 17:20

ain92 wrote:Hello all.
I've recently found a good photo from the Dutch National Archive.
Image
Two Italian officers are examining captured Yugoslav artillery pieces, 47 mm Škoda anti-tank guns (could anyone remind, what was it official and factory designations?) and 81 mm Brandt mortars (M.31 or M.31/38?)
Thanks in advance.
In this pic !

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 01 Dec 2013 23:13

8 cm M 5/32 had same gun like M 5/28 but pedestal was different. The forum has a couple of photos just need to find them.

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 01 Dec 2013 23:33

Škoda during official talks use designation 4,7 cm vz.38. I do not know if this is a special designation for the gun 4.7 cm A5 for cavalry units or the Skoda had some other reason. In any case, 4.7 cm M38 was version for cavalry units of the gun 4,7 cm Skoda A5. I have seen the photographs and version for truck towing. In January 1941 it was ordered that in Kragujevac to July modernize 100 guns for truck towing. I do not know whether the guns with images from April 1941, the original Czechoslovak guns for truck towing or modernized in Yugoslavia in the spring 1941st.

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ain92
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ain92 » 02 Dec 2013 18:52

Hello again,
I found some information in Československé dělostřelectvo 1918 — 1939 by J. Janoušek, at page 77:
Vzhledem k nutnému časovému prědstihu v souboji s tankovou technikou byl souběžně od roku 1936 vyvíjen mohutnější 4,7centimetrový PT kanon označovaný A-5, ten prorážel pancíř o síle 32 millimetrů na vzdálenost 1500 metrů a 55 millimetrů na 1000 metrů. Kanon byl vyvíjen souběžně s pevnostním kanonem. Na polní lafetě byl odzkoušen v roce 1938 a také ihned zaveden do výzbroje jako vzor 38. Sériová výroba začala až v roce 1939 a děla byla exportována do Jugoslávie v počtu asi 300 kusů. Tam tyto kanony ukořistila italská armáda, která je poté použivala ve své výzbroji. Od ní je opět ukořistili jugoslávšti partyzáni.
Google translation after my edition:
Due to the necessary time to advance in the battle tank technology was concurrently developed since 1936 a mighty 4.7-cm AT cannon designated A-5, piercing through 32 mm armor at a distance of 1500 meters and 55 millimeters at 1000 meters. Kanon was developed in parallel with the fortification cannon. The field gun carriage was tested in 1938 and immediately put into service as a model 38. Serial production began in 1939 and the guns were exported to Yugoslavia, consisting of about 300 pieces. There were guns seized by the Italian army, which was then used in their armament. Since it was again captured by Yugoslav partisans.
It seems that the A5 was the predecessor for vz.38. Do you know if there was any difference in cushioning of motorized and cavalry versions of M.38?
ltcolonel wrote:The forum has a couple of photos just need to find them.
I've found two pictures here:
Image
Image
Is these the couple you were speaking about?
With best regards, Ilya.

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ain92
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A surviving 8 cm M.5/32l or M.5/28l in Italy

Post by ain92 » 08 Dec 2013 10:56

I've found out that an incomplete AA gun, possibly M.5/32l is remaining at a military cemetery in Redipuglia near Trieste (all photos clickable).
Image
Image
Image
Image
There's also a photo of the markings on its breech.
Last edited by ain92 on 08 Dec 2013 16:56, edited 1 time in total.
With best regards, Ilya.

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 08 Dec 2013 16:36

Ilya on the last photos (02 Dec and Today) guns are in position for the march. In this position, the guns of M 5/28 and M 5/32 are almost identical. Practically, the only difference was in the pedestal on the firing position.

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ain92
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ain92 » 15 Dec 2013 21:49

Hello again,
What do you know about 75-mm Krupp M.4 aka 7,5 cm F.K. 239(j)? Was it a captured Romanian piece? According to http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?p=1537928 there were 60 guns (including non-operational?) in 1943.
I've also found that firing tables for F.K. 239/1(j) existed (Heeresdruckvorschriften 119/149).
With best regards, Ilya.

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 16 Dec 2013 00:49

In Yugoslav service were two models of Krupp filed guns
75 mm M 4n (n for nemački or germans) and
75 mm M 4t (t for turski or turkish)
Both models captured Serbian troops in september, october and november 1918 by Bulgarian Army. Army of Kingdom Yugoslavia had probably around 240 Krupp guns both models.
Last edited by ltcolonel on 16 Dec 2013 01:16, edited 1 time in total.

ltcolonel
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Re: Yugoslave artillery 1941

Post by ltcolonel » 16 Dec 2013 01:13

Around 1925 to 1927th all Krupp guns were refurbished to use old Bulgarian HE shells and shrapnels (for Bulgarian Schneider guns 75 mm M 04).
Ammunition captured from Bulgarians was standard ammunition for the guns 75 mm M7 and M7A Schneider (ex Serbian), 75 mm M04 Schneider (ex Bulgarian) and Krupp 75 mm guns M04n and 75 mm M04t in Army Kingdom of Yugoslavia.

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