► Photothread: Allied Vehicles in German Service
Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
Hi all,
Two images of a rare versión of Tatra T29 heavy truck:
Images from EBay
Sturm78
Two images of a rare versión of Tatra T29 heavy truck:
Images from EBay
Sturm78
Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
Not too often photographed, an ex-British Bedford truck in multi-tone camouflage. I suspect the pattern may be Southern Europe?
Kerry.
Kerry.
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- Piotr Mikołajski
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- Location: Olsztyn, Poland / Allenstein, Ostpreußen
Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
I'm afraid here is field applied three colour camo and can't be identified as Southern Europe. Looking at soldier's uniform I would say that it was not very hot.
Best regards,
Piotr Mikołajski
Piotr Mikołajski
Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
Hi Piotr,
Thank you for your reply.
Yes, certainly field applied paint job, as most were. As to the uniform, Luftwaffe overalls, no shirt, could be hot, especially with the very deep shadows under the trees, bright sun. But yes, I made an assumption concerning the pattern, it could equally well be in any theatre of operations. I was hoping that someone might have seen a similar pattern applied and know where the picture might have been taken. I also thought that people might be interested in the paint job. As I said, it is very uncommon to see photos of captured British vehicles with camouflage paint.
Thanks again for your input,
Kerry.
Thank you for your reply.
Yes, certainly field applied paint job, as most were. As to the uniform, Luftwaffe overalls, no shirt, could be hot, especially with the very deep shadows under the trees, bright sun. But yes, I made an assumption concerning the pattern, it could equally well be in any theatre of operations. I was hoping that someone might have seen a similar pattern applied and know where the picture might have been taken. I also thought that people might be interested in the paint job. As I said, it is very uncommon to see photos of captured British vehicles with camouflage paint.
Thanks again for your input,
Kerry.
- Piotr Mikołajski
- Member
- Posts: 509
- Joined: 14 Mar 2011, 19:31
- Location: Olsztyn, Poland / Allenstein, Ostpreußen
Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
Indeed, I'm not sure if I ever saw British trucks with such camouflage. I would say this is 1944 because I don't remember in such dense patterns were applied in 1943.
Best regards,
Piotr Mikołajski
Piotr Mikołajski
Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
US Ford 39 or 40? Doesn't look like a an US made commercial pickup. Photo from eBay.de
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Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
Looks like an Aussie "Ute", (Australian 1/2 ton utility). I thought there had been some discussion regarding one of these in German hands recently on this thread but have gone back 20 pages and cannot find it. Was it in the vehicle identity thread? Anyhow "where did Jerry nick this one from?" Could it have come from Greece or Crete, as the surroundings do not look like a typical Arab village? I cannot think of anywhere else the Aussies faced the Germans except Greece and Crete outside of the North African desert.Jose85 wrote:US Ford 39 or 40? Doesn't look like a an US made commercial pickup. Photo from eBay.de
Clive
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Re: Beute- and Umbauwagen
Hi Jose & Clive:
Thank you again, Jose, for another unusual Ford.
And, Clive, another enigma it seems.
While it does not seem possible, due to the locale looking more like Russia/Ukraine etc. than anywhere else, I agree with you that the vehicle almost has to be a 1939/40 Aussie Ute. Probably 1940 as it seems to have the fixed windscreen and vent windows in the doors.
Other positive ID tips are the length and height of the cargo bed, very typical of this vehicle, the design and shape of the tilt/cover over the bed and the relationship of the rear fender/mudguard to the bed.
Some oddities that I can see are:
The side "mounted" spare wheel and tyre seem to me to not be a standard fitting and may be a field modification.
The headlamps seem to have been removed from their original enclosed location in the front wings/fenders and some other type of lamps have sort of been set into the opening. We saw this a few weeks ago on a beute Matford. The Ford style of moulding the headlamps into the wing/fender did not seem to lend itself to the typical black out strips.
The front wing/fender still has the white outline paint "blackout ID" and it may also be on the rear although the photo quality doesn't show that very well. I also cannot detect a Notek light on the truck and this and the white outline painting would normally indicate the vehicle was operated in a non-contested area that only required blackout lighting at night.
The sedan in the background looks to me to be French perhaps but I cannot positively ID it yet.
So, where do we go from here??????????
Let us assume it is an Aussie Ute. Who used them and where??
Australia......Primarily North Africa for this situation.
New Zealand.....Same as above.
South African Colonial Forces..... A little further East if I remember correctly but......
British Forces.....Usually taken over from the above as needed or as the opportunity presented itself (Read Clever Supply/Motor Pool Sergeants here).
Indian Forces?? Lots of similar vehicles from Ford and GM although I have no proof of a Ute being supplied to them.
To me, the locale may turn out to be the key to solving the riddle.
I cannot make a connection from North Africa to Russia. Persia to Russia, maybe considering Lend Lease to the Russians, but this vehicle was not on that "list" and is also too old.
I have no feeling for architecture other than admiring it. It may be that these thatch roofed buildings existed in Greece/Crete and you may have the key to the answer. Tusslamabad has been around on ebay.de for decades, maybe someone can ask him to research the photo further.
Bill
Thank you again, Jose, for another unusual Ford.
And, Clive, another enigma it seems.
While it does not seem possible, due to the locale looking more like Russia/Ukraine etc. than anywhere else, I agree with you that the vehicle almost has to be a 1939/40 Aussie Ute. Probably 1940 as it seems to have the fixed windscreen and vent windows in the doors.
Other positive ID tips are the length and height of the cargo bed, very typical of this vehicle, the design and shape of the tilt/cover over the bed and the relationship of the rear fender/mudguard to the bed.
Some oddities that I can see are:
The side "mounted" spare wheel and tyre seem to me to not be a standard fitting and may be a field modification.
The headlamps seem to have been removed from their original enclosed location in the front wings/fenders and some other type of lamps have sort of been set into the opening. We saw this a few weeks ago on a beute Matford. The Ford style of moulding the headlamps into the wing/fender did not seem to lend itself to the typical black out strips.
The front wing/fender still has the white outline paint "blackout ID" and it may also be on the rear although the photo quality doesn't show that very well. I also cannot detect a Notek light on the truck and this and the white outline painting would normally indicate the vehicle was operated in a non-contested area that only required blackout lighting at night.
The sedan in the background looks to me to be French perhaps but I cannot positively ID it yet.
So, where do we go from here??????????
Let us assume it is an Aussie Ute. Who used them and where??
Australia......Primarily North Africa for this situation.
New Zealand.....Same as above.
South African Colonial Forces..... A little further East if I remember correctly but......
British Forces.....Usually taken over from the above as needed or as the opportunity presented itself (Read Clever Supply/Motor Pool Sergeants here).
Indian Forces?? Lots of similar vehicles from Ford and GM although I have no proof of a Ute being supplied to them.
To me, the locale may turn out to be the key to solving the riddle.
I cannot make a connection from North Africa to Russia. Persia to Russia, maybe considering Lend Lease to the Russians, but this vehicle was not on that "list" and is also too old.
I have no feeling for architecture other than admiring it. It may be that these thatch roofed buildings existed in Greece/Crete and you may have the key to the answer. Tusslamabad has been around on ebay.de for decades, maybe someone can ask him to research the photo further.
Bill