So many upcoming 12 SS books!

Discussions on books and other reference material on the WW1, Inter-War or WW2 as well as the authors. Hosted by Andy H.
Michael Kenny
Member
Posts: 8251
Joined: 07 May 2002, 20:40
Location: Teesside

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#16

Post by Michael Kenny » 29 Nov 2020, 19:08

Cult Icon wrote:
29 Nov 2020, 18:16
This topic of 12th SS seems to drive the british biased rather mad

12th SS? A minor bump on the road to Berlin. Just let the bantams deal with them
B6009.jpg
https://youtu.be/UnmK5SYcW8Q?t=272

Tom from Cornwall
Member
Posts: 3211
Joined: 01 May 2006, 20:52
Location: UK

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#17

Post by Tom from Cornwall » 29 Nov 2020, 20:09

Cult Icon wrote:
29 Nov 2020, 18:16
Look above you and you will see that you are on "Axis history forum", maybe you and the other Allied biased should leave this place right now and never return.
Maybe I'm just being selfish, but I'm just hoping to see a bit more balance in the publication of German formation histories. I'd like to see some more publications of "standard" German army formations especially from the Italian campaign.

From the couple of pages that were posted up from the latest tome about SS-Panzer Regrt 12 there seems likely to be little more on offer than in Norbert Számvéber's book which I've got and includes the war diary. I'm not sure the old war stories of a few old boys that have probably been improved on over the years after a few beers is really that useful - even the author corrects the worst exaggeration, or if not corrects at least suggests that he knows how much exaggeration is involved.

I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised though. Most Allied publications seem to revolve around airborne formations or the same battles.

Regards

Tom


User avatar
krichter33
Member
Posts: 843
Joined: 22 Mar 2003, 12:37
Location: U.S.A.

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#18

Post by krichter33 » 30 Nov 2020, 10:56

Cazenave's books are excellent!!! I have the other two in French and they are amazing! Also I know Cazenave plans on releasing another one or two volumes on the division completing their entire history....AND, I have the knowledge that a certain publisher will be buying the rights and publishing in English all of the 12th SS books, including the ones not yet finished or released.

Michael Kenny
Member
Posts: 8251
Joined: 07 May 2002, 20:40
Location: Teesside

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#19

Post by Michael Kenny » 30 Nov 2020, 11:54

krichter33 wrote:
30 Nov 2020, 10:56
Cazenave's books are excellent!!!
Have you bothered to research this authors history with Heimdal?
It was, to say the least, 'colourful'.

User avatar
krichter33
Member
Posts: 843
Joined: 22 Mar 2003, 12:37
Location: U.S.A.

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#20

Post by krichter33 » 01 Dec 2020, 05:59

I know he did publish with Heimdal right? No I don't know where I would be able to "research" this history.

Tom from Cornwall
Member
Posts: 3211
Joined: 01 May 2006, 20:52
Location: UK

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#21

Post by Tom from Cornwall » 01 Dec 2020, 18:46

krichter33 wrote:
30 Nov 2020, 10:56
AND, I have the knowledge that a certain publisher will be buying the rights and publishing in English all of the 12th SS books, including the ones not yet finished or released.
AND? Why the capitals?

Can you confirm whether the author of the latest book on the unsuccessful HJ Division discusses the "take no prisoners" order that is revealed in the letter that has been posted up?

Regards

Tom

Michael Kenny
Member
Posts: 8251
Joined: 07 May 2002, 20:40
Location: Teesside

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#22

Post by Michael Kenny » 01 Dec 2020, 19:26

krichter33 wrote:
30 Nov 2020, 10:56
I have the knowledge that a certain publisher will be buying the rights and publishing in English all of the 12th SS books, including the ones not yet finished or released.
Good. I have long been looking for an account of the disaster that overtook SS Pz Rgt 12 during EPSOM. They lost a third of their tanks June 6-26th (say 3 weeks) but then only needed 6 days to lose a further third!
krichter33 wrote:
01 Dec 2020, 05:59
I know he did publish with Heimdal right? No I don't know where I would be able to "research" this history.
I just assumed you knew a bit about him by the way you promote him. His time at Heimdal was, how shall we put it.............tempestuous? Threats of legal action flying backwards and forwards and (for example) accusations that articles/photos were lifted from German publications and published (in French) as original research. The Agte method?

Mori
Member
Posts: 1632
Joined: 25 Oct 2014, 12:04
Location: Europe

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#23

Post by Mori » 01 Dec 2020, 19:48

Michael Kenny wrote:
01 Dec 2020, 19:26
krichter33 wrote:
30 Nov 2020, 10:56
I know he did publish with Heimdal right? No I don't know where I would be able to "research" this history.
I just assumed you knew a bit about him by the way you promote him. His time at Heimdal was, how shall we put it.............tempestuous? Threats of legal action flying backwards and forwards and (for example) accusations that articles/photos were lifted from German publications and published (in French) as original research. The Agte method?
Not to mention the "too much to the right" - tu put it midly - image of this publisher. No surprise authors who published at Heimdal never made it to mainstream publishers.

User avatar
krichter33
Member
Posts: 843
Joined: 22 Mar 2003, 12:37
Location: U.S.A.

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#24

Post by krichter33 » 01 Dec 2020, 22:31

I don't have any major argument with anyone here. I understand people's opinions on certain of these units. And I also agree that 12ss for example did make those blunderous night attacks, which is covered in great detail in Cazenave's book. I simply like these particular books because of their detail and layout. Are they biased? I'm sure they are. But I'm also sure there are plenty of Allied histories that are biased as well. I want more unit histories from the Army Panzer, and Infanterie divisions!!! Other than some of the WSS units, like Das Reich, I personally like the histories of Heer units, such as 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 7. 11. 24 Panzer, and different Infanterie, Jager, Gebirgsjager and Fallschirmjager divisions. I agree there is a lack of balance in the translated works between the WSS and the rest of the Wehrmacht. I would especially LOVE to see the 4. Panzer histories translated, or units that fought in North Africa and Italy as well. The Italian campaign is one of my favourite, yet I can't find many good German unit histories from this campaign. I buy a lot of the German and French language books, and translate them by scanning them and running them through an online translator. Then I put it in a Google Doc, so it's like an ebook. It's not the best, and I do have to tweak it here and there, but it works. Right now I'm busy translating and reading the 24. Panzer history. So, to finish up. I don't know Cazenave or any of these authors personally, and like I said I prefer nice dry Heer unit histories. There are soooo many good ones that I would love to read. I do like the U.S. Canadian, and British official histories, especially dealing with North Africa and Italy, because of their level of detail, and also they do provide a lot of great information from the Axis perspective as well...

User avatar
Westphalia1812
Member
Posts: 575
Joined: 03 Jul 2019, 21:01
Location: Germany

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#25

Post by Westphalia1812 » 20 Jun 2021, 01:24

After looking at the Italian campaign I cannot understand the hype of this formation anymore. One could find comparable defensive stands in Italy e.g. 26.PzDiv at Orsogna, 90.PzGrenDiv at Cassino or also 65.Inf.Div in 1944.

One of the most vicious fighting I have ever read about was not concerning 12th SS but rather 15.PzGrenDiv at Troina in 1943. I would be very interested in a modern divisional history of e.g. the 26.PzDiv or the 114.JgDiv or the 29.PzGrenDiv...
Last edited by Westphalia1812 on 20 Jun 2021, 02:14, edited 2 times in total.
I love myself way more than I love you

And I think about killing myself

So, best believe, I thought about killing you today

User avatar
Cult Icon
Member
Posts: 4472
Joined: 08 Apr 2014, 20:00

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#26

Post by Cult Icon » 20 Jun 2021, 01:32

Pascal. Kullmann. wrote:
20 Jun 2021, 01:24
After looking at the Italian Campaign I cannot understand the hype of this formation anymore. One could find comparable defensive stands in Italy e.g. 26.PzDiv at Orsogna, 90.PzGrenDiv at Cassino or also 65.Inf.Div in 1944.

One of the most vicious fighting I have ever read about was not concerning 12th SS but rather 15.PzGrenDiv at Troina in 1943. I would be very interested in a modern divisional history about the 26.PzDiv or the 114.JgDiv...
There were many "epic" defensive stands on the Eastern Front against high intensity Soviet offensives as well.

What makes 12 SS stand out is the extent that it is politicized by various self-interested parties (allied and german) regardless of the overall collection of epic defensive stands.

Larso
Member
Posts: 1974
Joined: 27 Apr 2003, 03:18
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: So many upcoming 12 SS books!

#27

Post by Larso » 03 Nov 2021, 10:16

So it appears that 'The 12th Hitlerjugend SS Panzer Division in Normandy' by Saunders and Hone was published in May? What are the thoughts of those who have read it?

Post Reply

Return to “Books & other Reference Material”