First atomic bomb was German !?!

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Schlappgug
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Schlappgug » 12 Apr 2022 10:28

@PunctuationHorror
Thanks for your words, no problem, I ignore stupid idiots trying to troll....these guys are just nuts, their problem.
These forum-troll-clowns try to destroy uncomfortable insights by ridiculing them....its the same in all forums.
Poor guys...
My Informations provided above are the newest stand of research in Germany about this topic.
These informations are just for those people who want to know and make their own conclusions.
One hint, you might look for a german bomb in the official WW2 files of German drop munition.
You will find a Bomb called SD 1400 „Esau“. Than you might google Abraham Esau and Manfred von Ardenne.
Prof. Esau was the boss of Dr. Manfred von Ardenne at the Reichspost Forschungsrat and one of the german key figures in nuclear and high frequency reserach.
We have found hints that this might be a forgotten link to the Navy / Luftwaffe (Marineflieger) Nuclear program.
The conventional TNT equiped version of this bomb was famous Fritz X that sunked the battleship Roma.
We are trying to find out what was the Esau version. We think it might be a nuclear radio guided glide bomb like the Fritz X.
Very few informations left.
Last edited by Schlappgug on 12 Apr 2022 11:11, edited 7 times in total.

Schlappgug
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Schlappgug » 12 Apr 2022 10:30

If you want to see the location where a german Esau precision glide bomb (or its nuclear warhead) might have been tested in October 1944
at BUG island Kriegsmarine base near Rugen island. Developing engineer of the head was Dr. Otto Haxel (Head of nuclear Kriegsmarine research centre Hexengrund near Gothenhafen), in collaboration with Prof. Abraham Esau and Dr. Manfred von Ardenne (Reichspost Forschungsrat), Siemens Halske Berlin -Arnstadt and Krupp Essen.
Photo taken 1953 Image
Last edited by Schlappgug on 12 Apr 2022 11:14, edited 6 times in total.

Schlappgug
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Schlappgug » 12 Apr 2022 10:32

Image

Schlappgug
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Schlappgug » 12 Apr 2022 10:36

Ever heard about the nuked allied convoy LW-143 ( sunk 18. March 1945 ) We think It was the first and only test of SD1400 "Esau" under real war circumstances!

Here the Story of Hans Ulrich von Krantz we found:

Convoy LW-143 left American ports on 12 March. It consisted of about 30 transport and 15-20 escort warships. After a few days underway, the convoy commander received word of a storm raging in the mid-Atlantic (there really was a storm, by the way) and took an alternate route.
Nobody ever heard from this convoy again, it disappeared.

We came across the miraculously preserved memoirs of an old American sailor. In it he gives a rather long and boring description of his combat journey (this sea wolf served on a heavy cruiser in the Atlantic throughout the war, so he didn't look the enemy in the eye). I've never seen a more boring read in my life - probably why no one bothered to read his memoirs to the end. And there, in the middle of a huge haystack, hid a real pearl.

At the end of March 1945, we were urgently sent to a rather remote area of the Atlantic. This was the so-called "reserve route" - if a storm or large detachments of German U-boats got in the way of the convoys, they followed this particular diversion. We rushed as if on fire, travelling at top speed, regardless of fuel consumption. All those on board wondered: what awaits us ahead that will make us rush into full speed? Two days later, we got an answer.

About two dozen ships were floating on the evening ocean. Or rather, no longer ships, but charred skeletons. One of them was recognisable as a destroyer, the other resembled a Liberty transport. Most of them sent plumes of smoke into the air.

We stood on deck, fascinated by the sight. None of us had ever seen anything like it! It was as if a huge fire had turned a convoy into a flock of "flying Dutchmen", gloomy and lifeless. However, we did not have to argue for long: The unit commander gave the order to drown the horrific ruins. Our destroyers got into battle formation and began firing torpedo after torpedo at the dead ships.

Not so dead, however: from the deck of one of them, apparently the least injured, a signal flare went up. Another showed a clumsy human figure trying to wave her hand. It looked somehow strange, so much so that no one dared to examine it through binoculars. Nevertheless, our admiral gave the order to drown everything that was on the surface of the water. Three hours later it was all over. We tried not to think about what it was and whether there were living people there. Subsequently, we never received an explanation for these strange phenomena.

The explanation is easy to find if we compare this story with the memories of an eyewitness to the American nuclear tests of 1948. Then the Yankees took some old ships to the deserted atoll and popped one of their (actually their) bombs. The picture after the explosion looked like this:

Abandoned ships were not very attractive even before the explosion, but after the tests they were just awful. Most of them were burning, the ones closer to the epicentre looked like charred fires. Strange that they floated at all. If there were people there, they would have no chance of escaping.

That was the final touch and reinforced my confidence in what I had long suspected: the Germans had used their tactical navy atomic bomb.
Maybe that was the maiden detonation of the SD1400 "Esau" delivered by a long range bomber or it was the first nuclear torpedo strike in history?
Last edited by Schlappgug on 12 Apr 2022 12:11, edited 11 times in total.

Sid Guttridge
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Sid Guttridge » 12 Apr 2022 10:54

Hi Schlappgug and punctuationhorror, etc.,

At present you are just using AHF as a a noticeboard and either blanking questioners completely, refusing to answer questions or using abusive language (remember your post #1210 , ".....defecating..... shit show..... diarrhea..... potty training..... shitting all over....."?)

This is a forum, not a soap box. It is designed for debate.

What you are currently producing is merely conspiracy theory, not history, and will remain so until you are prepared to debate it and defend it, thereby allowing the membership to tease out the hard facts from the waffle.

Cheers,

Sid.

.

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Palmesan
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Palmesan » 12 Apr 2022 13:57

Schlappgug, in his post # 1219, quotes his source as saying that convoy LW143 left American ports on 12 March 1945 and a few days later took an alternative route to avoid a storm raging in the Atlantic.
This is interesting as, according to a list of convoy codes used by the Allies during World War II, convoys using the LW designation were on the routes between Haifa, Palestine to Port Said, Egypt and, during Jun 1942 to Nov 1942, a further 3 convoys went from the east coast of the US to the South-West Pacific Area.

(Source: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Allied_convoy_codes_during_World_War_II)

Michael Kenny
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Michael Kenny » 12 Apr 2022 14:33

Palmesan wrote:
12 Apr 2022 13:57
Schlappgug, in his post # 1219, quotes his source as saying that convoy LW143 left American ports on 12 , convoys using the LW designation were on the routes between Haifa, Palestine to Port Said, Egypt and, during Jun 1942 to Nov 1942................
Even more silly claims in the source. The US Navy had more aircraft carriers than it officially admits!


https://coppershop.ru/en/need-to-know/t ... iha--.html
And here in the list of American escort aircraft carriers who died while escorting convoys, I stumble upon a previously unknown name. Light escort aircraft carrier "Sequoia", entered into the fleet in November 1944, on March 18, 1945, perishes, as indicated in the reference book, "from an attack by a German submarine." The most interesting thing is that according to other publications, including the official directories of the US Department of Defense, this ship is not visible at all. It seems that he did not exist at all!

So was Sequoia or not? To answer this question, I had to shovel a bunch of sources and, in addition to everything, fly to the United States, although I do not particularly like this country. As a result, I can give a completely clear answer: yes, "Sequoia" existed, but for some reason this fact is hushed up..............................Which German captain drowned her? An even more difficult question, because from the German side, the destruction of the aircraft carrier is not visible at all! And this is completely strange, because any submarine commander would gladly credit an aircraft carrier. The likelihood that someone was not sure of their success and was modest is negligible. Modesty was not one of the merits of the German submariners...….I moved on to the lists of other ships and found that on March 18, 1945, the US fleet lost another light cruiser, seven destroyers and a dozen anti-submarine ships of other classes! All of them were listed as sunk by submarines, although not a single German captain claimed responsibility for the death of these ships.


Confirming the 7 Destroyer/12 Escort losses for March 18 should be easy.....................
Last edited by Michael Kenny on 12 Apr 2022 14:56, edited 1 time in total.

Michael Kenny
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Michael Kenny » 12 Apr 2022 14:40

More:

To be honest, such a mass death of vessels under the Stars and Stripes flag puzzled me. Especially considering the almost complete absence of losses before and after March 18. Also, something else confused me on this list. Looking closer, I realized that: the list of sunken ships was actually a complete set of guards for a small convoy!

I picked up the list of American convoys faster than you read this line. Which convoy was en route on March 18? There were several of them, but they all arrived safely at the port of destination. And then I drew attention to the absence of number 143 in the list of LW series convoys. There is LW-142, LW-144 too, but for some reason 143 is not observed. I wonder why? Convoys left the States once every three days; The 142nd hit the road on March 9, the 144th on the 15th. Why was the 143rd canceled? Or no one canceled him and he calmly went to sea on March 12? So he was sailing on the 18th?

The more it got dark outside the window, the darker my suspicions became. Why is the truth about the 143rd convoy hidden? And most importantly, what is this truth?

Michael Kenny
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Michael Kenny » 12 Apr 2022 14:45

And the result:

This was the final touch, reinforcing my confidence in what I had already guessed for a long time: the Germans did use their atomic bomb. The story, most likely, unfolded in such a scenario.

Convoy LW-143 left US ports on March 12. It numbered about 30 transport and 15–20 escort warships. After a couple of days of travel, the convoy commander received a message about a storm raging in the center of the Atlantic (by the way, there really was a storm) and went on a backup route. Here the convoy spotted German submarines and transmitted information to the base.

On the morning of March 18, one of the heavy transport aircraft Junkers-390 took off from the German airfield. However, not this time it is not the equipment for the Antarctic base, but a much more terrible load. In his womb was one of the German atomic bombs. The pilot had direct radio communication with the submarine, which transmitted to him the latest data on the location of the convoy, after which he was ordered to wash away at maximum speed. After that, it was not difficult for an experienced pilot (perhaps one of the aces of the German bomber aviation was at the helm) to find the Americans.

Meanwhile, the radars of American ships recorded the rapid approach of a heavy aircraft. The convoy quickly assembled into a compact group to provide the best anti-aircraft fire density. This killed the sailors. The bomb dropped by the German pilot hit the exact center of the battle formation of the ships. What happened next is easy to imagine. A terrible explosion, an atomic mushroom over the Atlantic, burning convoy ships ...


You can see why the original poster of this farrago of nonsense edited it down and missed a lot of the detail out.
https://coppershop.ru/en/need-to-know/t ... iha--.html

Rob Stuart
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Rob Stuart » 12 Apr 2022 16:09

Michael Kenny wrote:
12 Apr 2022 14:33
Palmesan wrote:
12 Apr 2022 13:57
Schlappgug, in his post # 1219, quotes his source as saying that convoy LW143 left American ports on 12 , convoys using the LW designation were on the routes between Haifa, Palestine to Port Said, Egypt and, during Jun 1942 to Nov 1942................
Even more silly claims in the source. The US Navy had more aircraft carriers than it officially admits!


https://coppershop.ru/en/need-to-know/t ... iha--.html
And here in the list of American escort aircraft carriers who died while escorting convoys, I stumble upon a previously unknown name. Light escort aircraft carrier "Sequoia", entered into the fleet in November 1944, on March 18, 1945, perishes, as indicated in the reference book, "from an attack by a German submarine." The most interesting thing is that according to other publications, including the official directories of the US Department of Defense, this ship is not visible at all. It seems that he did not exist at all!

So was Sequoia or not? To answer this question, I had to shovel a bunch of sources and, in addition to everything, fly to the United States, although I do not particularly like this country. As a result, I can give a completely clear answer: yes, "Sequoia" existed, but for some reason this fact is hushed up..............................Which German captain drowned her? An even more difficult question, because from the German side, the destruction of the aircraft carrier is not visible at all! And this is completely strange, because any submarine commander would gladly credit an aircraft carrier. The likelihood that someone was not sure of their success and was modest is negligible. Modesty was not one of the merits of the German submariners...….I moved on to the lists of other ships and found that on March 18, 1945, the US fleet lost another light cruiser, seven destroyers and a dozen anti-submarine ships of other classes! All of them were listed as sunk by submarines, although not a single German captain claimed responsibility for the death of these ships.


Confirming the 7 Destroyer/12 Escort losses for March 18 should be easy.....................
The USS Sequoia was the presidential yacht - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Sequo ... ial_yacht)

The only CVE commissioned in November 1944 was the Commencement Bay, per the list at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U ... t_carriers

The entry in the US Navy chronology for activities in the Atlantic on 18 March 1945 at https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/US ... -1945.html gives the following as the only event:
Destroyer escorts Menges (DE-320), Mosley (DE-321), Pride (DE-323), and Lowe (DE-325) sink German submarine U-866, northwest Atlantic, 43°18'N, 61°08'W.

Richard Anderson
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Richard Anderson » 12 Apr 2022 16:40

Palmesan wrote:
12 Apr 2022 13:57
Schlappgug, in his post # 1219, quotes his source as saying that convoy LW143 left American ports on 12 March 1945 and a few days later took an alternative route to avoid a storm raging in the Atlantic.
This is interesting as, according to a list of convoy codes used by the Allies during World War II, convoys using the LW designation were on the routes between Haifa, Palestine to Port Said, Egypt and, during Jun 1942 to Nov 1942, a further 3 convoys went from the east coast of the US to the South-West Pacific Area.
Technically, LW "Levant West" and LE "Levant East" were not convoy codes but were route codes. Ships departing Haifa to Port Said and reverse were not normally formed as convoys, but typically sailed independently either with or without an escort.

The three actual "LW convoys" were:

LW100 departed Norfolk for Wellington 10 June 1942.
LW101 departed Norfolk for Wellington 6 July 1942.
LW102 departed Norfolk for Noumea 24 September 1942.
"Is all this pretentious pseudo intellectual citing of sources REALLY necessary? It gets in the way of a good, spirited debate, destroys the cadence." POD, 6 October 2018

Richard Anderson
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Richard Anderson » 12 Apr 2022 16:43

Rob Stuart wrote:
12 Apr 2022 16:09
The entry in the US Navy chronology for activities in the Atlantic on 18 March 1945 at https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/US ... -1945.html gives the following as the only event:
Obviously you don't understand Rob. The US Navy could not reveal that those ships and men were lost to a German atomic bomb, so the attack, sinkings, deaths, ship construction and naming, and the birth of the crew were all carefully concealed so there is no record of the event other than the records discovered by some random dude going to a country he doesn't like and easily finding the carefully concealed records...
"Is all this pretentious pseudo intellectual citing of sources REALLY necessary? It gets in the way of a good, spirited debate, destroys the cadence." POD, 6 October 2018

Richard Anderson
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Richard Anderson » 12 Apr 2022 16:45

It is probably impossible to find a more interesting group of lunatic posters than have congregated at this thread over the last seventeen years. Quite an accomplishment that AHF should be truly proud of.
"Is all this pretentious pseudo intellectual citing of sources REALLY necessary? It gets in the way of a good, spirited debate, destroys the cadence." POD, 6 October 2018

Rob Stuart
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Rob Stuart » 12 Apr 2022 17:02

Palmesan wrote:
12 Apr 2022 13:57
Schlappgug, in his post # 1219, quotes his source as saying that convoy LW143 left American ports on 12 March 1945 and a few days later took an alternative route to avoid a storm raging in the Atlantic.
This is interesting as, according to a list of convoy codes used by the Allies during World War II, convoys using the LW designation were on the routes between Haifa, Palestine to Port Said, Egypt and, during Jun 1942 to Nov 1942, a further 3 convoys went from the east coast of the US to the South-West Pacific Area.

(Source: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Allied_convoy_codes_during_World_War_II)
Info on uboat.net and convoyweb.org.uk indicate the same, as does the document at https://www.history.navy.mil/research/l ... -1945.html.

The eastbound convoys crossing the Atlantic in March 1945 were probably all in the SC, HX, UGF, UGS and CU series. None of the lists of these convoy series has any convoy departing the US on 12 March 1945.

Rob Stuart
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Re: First atomic bomb was German !?!

Post by Rob Stuart » 12 Apr 2022 17:14

Richard Anderson wrote:
12 Apr 2022 16:43
Rob Stuart wrote:
12 Apr 2022 16:09
The entry in the US Navy chronology for activities in the Atlantic on 18 March 1945 at https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/US ... -1945.html gives the following as the only event:
Obviously you don't understand Rob. The US Navy could not reveal that those ships and men were lost to a German atomic bomb, so the attack, sinkings, deaths, ship construction and naming, and the birth of the crew were all carefully concealed so there is no record of the event other than the records discovered by some random dude going to a country he doesn't like and easily finding the carefully concealed records...
Damn, I should have realized this. Let's call it "Anderson's Law: The bigger the disaster, the bigger the cover-up". Incidentally, do you know what happened with convoy PQ-17? There was a PQ-16 and a PQ-18, but I can find no record of any PQ-17. Was it annihilated? Did the entire convoy surrender? It's now 80 years in the past, it's high time for the UK end the cover-up and tell the truth!

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