Band of Brothers, episode 5.

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Caldric
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#16

Post by Caldric » 25 May 2003, 04:15

Martin Kirkegaard wrote:Hey Caldric,

What I wanted to point out with that example of the .50 cal was they will always exists, and people will always use those small errors to call a movie unrealistic. I find BoB one of the most realistic movies/series out there. What I hate the most is how people say it glorifies the American soldiers, and how the Americans never die. When the company was pulled off the line in late june the company had lost 65 men. Plus the lost a decent amount of men in the Battle of the Bulge. You see them cry, break down, give up - You never see them going rambo-like into a firefight.

You can hear and see in the documentary how many of the men including Winters in bothered about, what they've done during the war, and how it still hunts them.

Hi Martin,

I agree completely, I like you just do not understand the people who slam the film as glorifying anything, it sure as hell did not glorify war.

Fact is the US lost the least of all of the Major Powers in the war, they almost without exception had fewer casualties then the enemy in almost all of their engagements. I think a great deal of this is due to the fact that the US had plenty of time, we had time to build supplies, to wait for air power, to wait for good weather, and the commanders ability to fight when and where they chose with the exception of places like the Bulge.

I think the psychological aspects shown in BoB was the best ever done, the Lt. most especially. He slowly succumbed to the stress, or the young private that was just scared to death but finally went from scared to indifferent which would lead to his death.

It was the most powerful war movie I have ever seen, showing all aspects from coward to unsung hero, to just men doing something they did not enjoy. Is without a doubt the best war movie in history as far as I am concerned.

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#17

Post by Caldric » 25 May 2003, 04:18

Eightball wrote:Hello Caldric!

I managed to figure out the point of that first, young soldier Winters killed. Though 'twas not my point, neither do I have SS invicibility thoughts. I just thought it was quite extrodinary, if not silly, how one man standing in such an exposed position could do what he did without even getting hurt.

You'd think the natural reaction would be to defend themselves.
Well it happened, I am sure they were shocked, like "what the hell is that?" type of thing. I mean you know you just woke up you think the frontlines are miles away and all of sudden people start dying all around you. I see nothing silly about it myself, I seen winters go into bezerk mode and then US machine Guns simply cut them down like wheat. Stupid place to camp as far as I am concerned.


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#18

Post by Caldric » 25 May 2003, 04:21

Surfkorps wrote:If i had his address i'd write him and tell him how much i appreciated his story. :D
Yep, he was very articulate and intelligent when they interviewed him, I bet he was very successful in civilian life also. As a soldier you could only hope to get a commander like him, like the one old veteran said, their were too damn many bad commanders. Which they showed with Lt. Dike or whatever his name was.

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#19

Post by Aufklarung » 25 May 2003, 04:29

Stupid place to camp as far as I am concerned
Not entirely so. Protected berms all around the field. Good spot actually, IMHO. The problems lay in lack of or in-attention by the sentry(s). Winters and Easy Coys run and the suprise on sleeping men was entirely realistic to me. As has been said the book reads it differently.

regards
A :)

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#20

Post by CHRISCHA » 25 May 2003, 10:26

Sgt. Reese wrote, P.S. My guess on where the Germans where from would be the 9th or 10th SS Division.

were they that bad?

No, they weren't that bad.

Surprise is a wonderful thing in combat. As someone has stated, the film was slowed down to ensure people understood the situation.
If everything strange that happened was written down from previous wars, I'm sure none of us would believe them.

And I too would agree, read the book.
I hope people don't start ripping BoB as SPR was.

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#21

Post by KalaVelka » 25 May 2003, 12:01

Caldric, i have seen many of your posts before and i feel that your crusader against WSS and rumours about WSS, have come too far. Like in minus side. WSS wasnt invincible but they still know how to fight. If somebody defenses WSS in a situation which looks unrealistic or biased, that doesnt meen that he think that WSS were invicible. If you think that i am biased towards WSS, let me say stright that i think that you are little bit biased towards US. :|

ps. Sorry my bad english

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#22

Post by Eightball » 25 May 2003, 12:25

Caldric wrote:
Eightball wrote:Hello Caldric!

I managed to figure out the point of that first, young soldier Winters killed. Though 'twas not my point, neither do I have SS invicibility thoughts. I just thought it was quite extrodinary, if not silly, how one man standing in such an exposed position could do what he did without even getting hurt.

You'd think the natural reaction would be to defend themselves.
Well it happened, I am sure they were shocked, like "what the hell is that?" type of thing. I mean you know you just woke up you think the frontlines are miles away and all of sudden people start dying all around you. I see nothing silly about it myself, I seen winters go into bezerk mode and then US machine Guns simply cut them down like wheat. Stupid place to camp as far as I am concerned.
I'm not saying it didn't happen, I'm just a bit skeptical to the whole thing. By the time the second company arrives, they should've gotten a rough overview of the situation, and the fact that the second company starts running over the field of fire is beyond my skill of understanding.

Don't get me wrong though, I love BoB.

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#23

Post by Caldric » 25 May 2003, 21:00

KalaVelka wrote:Caldric, i have seen many of your posts before and i feel that your crusader against WSS and rumours about WSS, have come too far. Like in minus side. WSS wasnt invincible but they still know how to fight. If somebody defenses WSS in a situation which looks unrealistic or biased, that doesnt meen that he think that WSS were invicible. If you think that i am biased towards WSS, let me say stright that i think that you are little bit biased towards US. :|

ps. Sorry my bad english
Go read this, I think it high time the myth surrounding the SS is lifted don't you?

http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=22852


I am biased towards the US, there is little doubt of that, however the point of this thread is that it did not happen, well it did happen. Remember that our imagination is always stronger then what can be done in a movie, it will never be perfect.

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#24

Post by Eightball » 25 May 2003, 21:12

Caldric, read the post directly above your last one. Pay special attention to the first lines.

I never said it didn't happen, I was just being skeptical on how Hollywood presented the situation. I am sorry if I didn't make that more clear in my earlier posts.

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#25

Post by Caldric » 25 May 2003, 21:30

Eightball wrote:Caldric, read the post directly above your last one. Pay special attention to the first lines.

I never said it didn't happen, I was just being skeptical on how Hollywood presented the situation. I am sorry if I didn't make that more clear in my earlier posts.
I was not meaning you Eightball.

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#26

Post by Eightball » 26 May 2003, 00:30

Alright Caldric.

I am biased towards the US, there is little doubt of that, however the point of this thread is that it did not happen, well it did happen.

'Some replies' instead of 'thread' would have been correct in this case then.

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#27

Post by KalaVelka » 26 May 2003, 07:09

yep caldric i have looked that thread from the start and i i can say that W-SS got some of the best divisions of 20th century. There were also not-so-good units (antipartisan etc.), but 10 out of 38 were very good or even some were elite.

But you go too far in your Crusade. You should give the right credit to the elite SS divisions. But as i sayed not all were them. But now i must hurry to school for exams.

ps. sorry my bad english

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#28

Post by Caldric » 26 May 2003, 07:25

KalaVelka wrote:yep caldric i have looked that thread from the start and i i can say that W-SS got some of the best divisions of 20th century. There were also not-so-good units (antipartisan etc.), but 10 out of 38 were very good or even some were elite.

But you go too far in your Crusade. You should give the right credit to the elite SS divisions. But as i sayed not all were them. But now i must hurry to school for exams.

ps. sorry my bad english

I do give the credit to the better SS Divisions, such as the 1st 2nd and 5th, the 3rd I have reservations about, the 12th was very good. However the problem is most people think SS and consider all other armies in the world to be inferior, that is the point. If I did say all of the SS then I stand corrected and made a mistake for making such a statement.

Stop apologizing for your English! :D It is fine, it is very good and understand it easy. Beware of my compound, entirely to long, fragmented sentences. :D

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#29

Post by KalaVelka » 26 May 2003, 09:57

thx :)
I do give the credit to the better SS Divisions, such as the 1st 2nd and 5th, the 3rd I have reservations about, the 12th was very good.
Thats what i wanted to hear :)

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#30

Post by Tracer » 26 May 2003, 14:10

It's been said b4 and I'll say it again.. yeah read the book..

I just finished reading the chapter with the incident in question..

In the movie.. Winters runs up.. looks at the young german soldier.. he looks back.. Winters fires one shot from the hip.. and kills him.. then the rest went along with the book..

in the *book*.. Winters runs up.. throws a grenade at the german.. he realizes he forgot to remove the tape from the grip that he placed there for some reason.. the german was preping a potatoe masher to throw back.. Winters shoots him.. the rest went along with the movie..

the tape in question is a safety measure that Winters placed there.. not standard issue on a grenade..

In reading the book I'm able to follow along with the movie in my mind and see why certain things were portrayed in the movie as they were.. overall I was impressed with the translation from book to movie.. but I'm also still reading.. we'll see. ;)

-cheers

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