Admiral Horthy

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Gyenes
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Admiral Horthy

Post by Gyenes » 06 Mar 2004 20:14

I have read that Horthy was quite the polyglot. I know that he spoke Hungarian (native), German, Italian, French, Crotaian, but can anyone provide some of the others?

bundi
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Post by bundi » 07 Mar 2004 18:07

He also knew English and a little Spanish. He was an admiral of The Hungarian Naval Forces and he traveld much between 1890 and 1918.

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sylvieK4
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Post by sylvieK4 » 07 Mar 2004 20:32

Perhaps he also learned a little Portuguese. :wink: (since he lived his last years in Portugal).

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Gyenes
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Post by Gyenes » 08 Mar 2004 22:21

Yes he did retire to Portugal after the Soviets occupied Hungary. And I am assuming since he knew Italian he most likely ttok the time to learn a little spanish. Same goes for Serbian and Croatian. And I also just learned he spoke Slovak which means he could probably get by in czech. That sure is quite alot! I wonder how he got around to learning all those I know his father pushed him to learning German (his father probably taught him) and his mother spoke french.

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Post by Orok » 08 Mar 2004 22:47

Here's the Admiral's own account of his ability to understand Magyar:

[While taking vacation at home after traveling around the world with the navy} My first evening in Budapest I spent at the National Theatre. My seat was in the front row and there was nothing wrong with my hearing, yet I could scarcely understand a word. For three years, I had heard so little Hungarian that the sound of the language had become almost alien to me. It took me a while to attune my ears to it.


His account that he can speak Slovak:

[On the occassion of the reanexation of Kassa] I replied to his (Count John Esterházy's) speech first in Hungarian and then in Slovak, assuring our new Slovak speaking citizens that they would have no reason to regret the change of rulership.


His ability to speak Italian:

On the evening of May 20th, 1937 (while receiving Italian King in Budapest), more than a hundred guests, members of the government, officers and civil servants, were present at the state banquet held in the Marble Hall of the Palace. In the toast, which I gave in Italian, I described Their Majesties' Visit as "a feast to Hungarian hearts" and referred to the aid Italy had given us, aid "which had, to a considerable extent, made it possible for Hungary to become once more a factor in international politics".


Alll from his autobiography: The Annotated Memoirs of ADMIRAL MIKLÓS HORTHY Regent of Hungary, U. S. Edition: Robert Speller & Sons, Publishers, New York, NY, 1957.

Best Regards!

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Gyenes
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Post by Gyenes » 08 Mar 2004 23:04

I already found those several out. Though I respect your comments.
Peering over to a copy of Horthy's memoirs
A very good book isn't it?

Though I would say on the first quote mentioning his inability to understand his own native language is that he had been at sea touring the world and as he was in the Austro-Hungarian navy the language of command for the majority of units would most likely be German of which Horthy was fluent in.

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Orok
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Post by Orok » 08 Mar 2004 23:25

Gyenes wrote:I already found those several out. Though I respect your comments.
Peering over to a copy of Horthy's memoirs
A very good book isn't it?


Yes, a facinating read, although the admiral did not have too much archives to assist him when he was writing it, so there are quite some inaccuracy in his account of events, according to some commentators.

Gyenes wrote:Though I would say on the first quote mentioning his inability to understand his own native language is that he had been at sea touring the world and as he was in the Austro-Hungarian navy the language of command for the majority of units would most likely be German of which Horthy was fluent in.


You are absolutely right! I also read somewhere that his Magyar was always with some German accent in it!

Best regards!

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sylvieK4
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Post by sylvieK4 » 09 Mar 2004 19:49

If anyone is interested to read Horthy's memoirs, but haven't access to the book, you can download a copy of it for free as a pdf file through the Corvinus Library. Here is the direct link to the pdf file:

http://www.net.hu/corvinus/lib/horthy/horthy.pdf

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Gyenes
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Post by Gyenes » 10 Mar 2004 23:30

Thank you sylvieK4. I like how this is a new version (copyright 2000). The one I finished was copyright 1957...
And intrestingly enough I find in the Foreward of this edition (the one you have a link to) it lists he speaks 6 languages (Hunagrian, Craot, Italian,German, French, English) but no Slovak? Though it makes as Orok and I have concluded he does speak the language so what we have come to is that he speaks 7. Though more if you count Czech, and Serbian which I am sure he could understand having knowledge of Slovak and Croat.

Can anyone suggest any more books such as this? Preferably in English.

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commander
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Post by commander » 18 Apr 2004 16:23

Most Austro-Hungarian officers were quite polyglott, and since Horthy achieved a high position, he was just a good example of an ambitious officer of a mulit-ethnic country. Nevertheless, he was a coward and opportunist who betrayed his king....unfortunately :-(

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Post by Orok » 18 Apr 2004 17:33

commander wrote:Horthy ... was a coward and opportunist who betrayed his king....unfortunately :-(


Yes, but fortunately by doing this he saved a whole nation!

Thanks for the comments, but perhaps you can do better than hurling simplistic insults on complex historical figures. Or perhaps I am expecting too much from certain members of this forum? 8O

I would respectfully suggest you read some good books on the byzantine political, diplomatic and military situation prevailing in the post Great War Central-Eastern Europe.

Best Regards!

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commander
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Post by commander » 18 Apr 2004 18:53

Thank you very much indeed for that remark. I was not aware that I was supposed to analyze the "byzantine political, diplomatic and military situation" of 1919 resp. a "complex historical figure" on a short thread here.

The thing is that I just wanted to say that even a highly skilled and intelligent person (remember we were talking about his language skills originally) can fail as a human character. He lied in front of his legitimate king, and was interested in maintaining his personal privileges not only in 1919 but also 1944. Being a historian myself, I agree that it is not fair to judge about a person in a few sentences and it is hopeless to judge world history by moral values, but as private person I believe certain single actions show sometimes more of a man's heart than many kilograms of books.

Don't understand me wrong, I really love Hungary and have no idea how to have saved the country at this time. But I admire men like Colonel Lehár or Count Tamás Erdödy. They were true patriots!

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Post by Orok » 18 Apr 2004 19:17

commander wrote:Don't understand me wrong, I really love Hungary and have no idea how to have saved the country at this time. But I admire men like Colonel Lehár or Count Tamás Erdödy. They were true patriots!


Judging from your last paragraph I quoted above, you no doubt consider legitimists like Lehár as true patriots, even if they put the interests of the Habsburgs before those of the Hungarian nation, making Hungarians killing Hungarians, and even risking the total destruction of the Hungarian nation at the hands of the little entente and the French (and with it of course the Kingdom of Karl in the process). In my humble opinion, these people are certainly no "patriots" of any nation state, as we understand that word, they are humble servants of the House of Austria, honorable and noble in a medieval sense of these words! :lol:

I was not aware that I was supposed to analyze the "byzantine political, diplomatic and military situation" of 1919 resp. a "complex historical figure" on a short thread here.


But of course you are fully entitled to your own conclusion and opinions. What prompted my last post is your attitude as shown in your previous post and in the quote above. This is a serious research forum, if you can't or don't want to elaborate on your sweeping and insulting assertion, it's best not to assert it at the first place, in order not to mislead and confuse people who come here to learn from "historians" here! :lol:

Thank you for your PM and I personally don't like these childish game to try to "best" one's playmates. I think, as "historians", we ought to long ago grew out of this kind of amateurish mentality! :lol: I would very much appreciate it if you would stop this. :lol:

Since this is off topic I'll not post here any more on Karl and his would-be return to the Hungarian throne. If you are interested in this topic, you can always start a new thread on it in a relevant section of this forum.

Best Regards!

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commander
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Post by commander » 18 Apr 2004 19:45

Hello...? Who made Hungarians kill Hungarians? At the first time it was revolution and bolshevists fought against anti-bolshevists, and at the second time it was your favoured Horthy who sent students and other uninformed people to fight against legitimist units.

Great if you consider yourself "grown up", but your aggressive attitude does not sound very mature, either.

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