Terry Duncan wrote:
Don71 wrote:The reality was that 80 Million Germans were totaly in agreement with their political class, that this was a diktat peace from the Entente, the german word was Versailler Diktat, which accused only Germany for the outbrake of the war to the whole world.
The French had felt much the same about the Treaty of Frankfurt, was that any less a diktat though this time imposed by Germany? Not being happy with the result of a war you lost is the most common outcome, how was Versailles any different to pretty much any previous peace treaty where one side had been defeated?
You have already written in many of your posts that the Peace of Frankfurt and the Brest Brest-Litovsk were similar or identical to the Treaty of Versailles. You justify that by the fact that the respective populations felt that as a similar dictation or punishment.
But this comparison is rather ridiculous to crazy, if you look at the objective facts, the amount of reparations and look at the actual goal of the reparations.
Neither the Frankfurt Peace nor the Peace of Brest-Litovsk had an article 231 which imposed on a warring party the sole moral responsibility for the war.
At the Peace of Frankfurt, reparations of 5 billion francs were demanded, which equates to 1450 tons of gold, and this should put a brake on France's economic development over the next few years.
In addition, Elsas Lorraine was annexed, which was partly German-speaking.
The Brest Brest-Litovsk peace treaty required 6 billion gold marks as compensation, which was equivalent to 2100 tons of gold. No areas were annexed.
All the territorial cessions of the UdSSR were separate peoples (Finland, the Baltic, Poland, Byelorussia and the Ukraine), which themselves were annexed by the Russians in the last hundred years. You can find the confirmation yourself if you take a look at the map today.
The Treaty of Versailles demanded immediately 20 billion gold marks, equivalent to 7,000 tonnes of gold plus 90% of the German merchant fleet, which provided the basis for German exports.
In June 1920, at the Boulogne Conference, the Allies demanded 269 billion gold marks in 42 annual installments, the equivalent of 94150 tons of gold.
On January 29, 1921, the Allies in Paris again demanded 269 billion gold marks in 42 annual installments, of which 226 billion as immovable principal, and Germany had to give 12% of the value of its annual exports. On April 27, 1921 followed the London payment plan. The Reichstag rejected these demands and the Allies occupied, after they had rejected in London a proposal of Germany of 50 billion gold marks, on 8 March Ruhrort, Duisburg and Dusseldorf.
It came to a serious government crisis, which culminated on 4 May in the resignation of the government Fehrenbach. Fehrenbach had rejected the London payment plan as unacceptable and cleared the way for a successor government to sign the agreement.
On May 5, 1921, David Lloyd George handed over to the German Ambassador in London the new demands of the Allies. Germany should agree to repay and interest a total of 132 billion gold marks.
Although the amount of claims was not lowered - the 132 billion gold marks remained - but no more payment terms were determined and the annual payments that Germany had to pay, were reduced: first had to be paid 1 billion, 2.5 later Billions a year.
In 1929, the duration of the reparations payments in the Young Plan was set at 59 (ie until 1988). Overall, Germany should pay 112 billion gold marks to 1988 according to this plan
In two autumn 1931 reports, the Layton Report and the Beneduce Report, Germany's insolvency following the end of the Hoover moratorium was certified by international financial experts. These reports were the basis for the Lausanne conference in the summer of 1932, which abolished the German reparations obligations against a final payment of three billion gold marks (in foreign currency).
According to German sources, Germany paid a total of 67.7 billion gold marks reparations in the form of gold marks, foreign exchange, coal and capital goods (industrial plants, locomotives, zeppelins, ships, etc.), the equivalent of 23695 tonnes of Gold
Eberhard Kolb: Der Frieden von Versailles. Beck, München 2005
The Versaille Treaty and his reparation demands had clearly the goal to destroy the german economic base for more then a hundred years, with the demand of 269 billion gold marks or later 132/112 billion gold marks.
In addition, Germany was also forced to cede predominantly German-speaking areas through the Treaty of Versailles!
Comparing the Treaty of Versailles and its demands on Germany to the peace of Frankfurt or the peace treaty of Brest-Litosk lacks any foundation when confronted with the facts