MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Discussions on WW2 in the Pacific and the Sino-Japanese War.
steverodgers801
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by steverodgers801 » 01 Jun 2016 01:46

By the way, why do you think Nimitz refused to ever place his carriers under control of Mac

Delta Tank
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Delta Tank » 01 Jun 2016 01:52

King would not allow it. Why do you think Admiral King kept 7th Fleet under his command and not Under Admiral Nimitz?

Mike

steverodgers801
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by steverodgers801 » 01 Jun 2016 21:01

clueless question, If that is true why would he allow Nimitz control of the carriers and fast battleships.

Delta Tank
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Delta Tank » 02 Jun 2016 13:11

Steverodgers801,

I have no idea why the Chief of Naval Operations was commanding a fleet that was in the South West Pacific Theater.

Mike

OpanaPointer
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by OpanaPointer » 02 Jun 2016 13:54

Wiki speaketh thus:

The Seventh Fleet was formed on 15 March 1943 in Brisbane, Australia, during the Second World War, under the command of Admiral Arthur S. "Chips" Carpender. It served in the South West Pacific Area (SWPA) under General Douglas MacArthur. The Seventh Fleet commander also served as commander of Allied naval forces in the SWPA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_St ... enth_Fleet
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Delta Tank
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Delta Tank » 02 Jun 2016 14:02

This book speaketh thus:
located hereth: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... g#p1775869

I thought I would put in some information from the book entitled "Kinkaid of the Seventh Fleet" by Gerald E. Wheeler.

Page 346 Kinkaid knew when he arraived in Brisbane that he would be wearing two hats. One hat would be that of Seventh Fleet commander and therefore under Admiral King's direct command. His other hat was that of MacArthur's naval commander, formally Commander Allied Naval Forces, Southwest Pacific Area.

Page 348-349 In all "MacArthur's Navy" was a good-size command for a vice admiral, but Kinkaid had two bosses. His operations orders came from General MacArthur, who was close at hand to see that they wee carried out. But Seventh Fleet's personnel and material, including ships, came from Admiral King in Washington. When he created the Seventh Fleet in February 1943, King kept it under his personal command as COMINCH, rather than adding it to Admiral Nimitz's Pacific Fleet. It is significant that Admiral King wrote Kinkaid's fitness reports, not MacArthur or Nimitz. It also significant that all admirals were assigned to their commands by King. In short the Seventh Fleet commander had two very difficult bosses to keep happy with his work in the SWPA.

Mil-tech Bard
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Mil-tech Bard » 02 Jun 2016 17:07

OpanaPointer wrote:MacArthur was an ego with lots of braid.
There are very few flag officers that fail to meet that criteria.

Army Generals Patton, Mark Clark, USMC General H.M. Smith, USAAF Bomber Generals as a class before Schweinfert, Gen Kenney in the SWPA and General Clwood "Pete" Quesada, Admirals King and Turner are all shining examples of "ego bigger than brass or braid" from WW2.

OpanaPointer
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by OpanaPointer » 02 Jun 2016 17:47

Mil-tech Bard wrote:
OpanaPointer wrote:MacArthur was an ego with lots of braid.
There are very few flag officers that fail to meet that criteria.

Army Generals Patton, Mark Clark, USMC General H.M. Smith, USAAF Bomber Generals as a class before Schweinfert, Gen Kenney in the SWPA and General Clwood "Pete" Quesada, Admirals King and Turner are all shining examples of "ego bigger than brass or braid" from WW2.
Yeah, but very few who define the criteria.
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steverodgers801
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by steverodgers801 » 02 Jun 2016 19:10

Mike the main component of 7th fleet were the old battleships that were too slow to keep up with the carriers, but they were ideal for ground support operations. My assumption is that since most of the invasions would be under Mac in the Philippines they would be best used under his command. King retained control of the ships and could remove them at any time, but he allowed them to be used by Mac as he saw fit to support his operations.

Delta Tank
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Delta Tank » 03 Jun 2016 00:37

Steverodgers801,

The old battleships were in the 3d Fleet, they along with the amphibious fleet were transferred to 7th Fleet for this campaign/operation. The JCS approved this operation, therefore Admiral King had to support it. When the Navy lost the argument Philippines vs Formosa, King had no choice but support the campaign/operation.

Mike

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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by OpanaPointer » 03 Jun 2016 01:19

Have we read CNO's annual reports?
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Delta Tank
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Delta Tank » 03 Jun 2016 01:31

Do you have CNO Annual reports? If so, please post site. Do CNO reports shed any light on this subject that we are discussing?

Mike

OpanaPointer
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by OpanaPointer » 03 Jun 2016 12:01

Delta Tank wrote:Do you have CNO Annual reports? If so, please post site. Do CNO reports shed any light on this subject that we are discussing?

Mike
They're on Hyperwar. I haven't read them since I OCR'd them back in the '90s. But I would expect this topic to be covered to some extent given the general nature of the material.
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Delta Tank
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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by Delta Tank » 03 Jun 2016 15:42

OpanaPointer,

I went to Hyperwar and found them, I read the section dealing with the "Reoccupation of the Philippine Islands" and did not learn anything new. For everyone else they are located here: https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/US ... 2.html#III

Mike

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Re: MacArthur, Kinkaid, and Halsey!

Post by OpanaPointer » 04 Jun 2016 11:48

Delta Tank wrote:OpanaPointer,

I went to Hyperwar and found them, I read the section dealing with the "Reoccupation of the Philippine Islands" and did not learn anything new. For everyone else they are located here: https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/US ... 2.html#III

Mike
It was a possibility, that's why I suggested it. 8-)
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