German text

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lohengrin
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German text

#1

Post by lohengrin » 07 Apr 2017, 12:28

Hi all,

Once again I need your help and expertise:

I have found an old letter with the following text:

Eurer Hoheit, Prinz Georg!

Seine Königliche Hoheit, Kronprinz Wilhelm, bat mich, Ihnen Seinen Brief zu schicken, den ich hiermit beilege. Der hohe Herr (possibly, this section is smudged) würde Sie sehr gerne einmal wiedersehen, und er freut sich schon auf Ihren nächsten Besuch auf Schloss Oels Ende August. Ich habe mir erlaubt, für Sie bei dieser Gelegenheit ein Treffen mit Graf Strachwitz zu vereinbaren, der Ihnen bezüglich Ihres Eigentums und des Nachlasses Ihres Herrn Vater wird behilflich sein können.

Persönlich hoffe ich, dass Sie eine angenehme Reise zurück in die Sudeten (possibly, it is again smudged) hatten.

In vorzüglicher Hochachtung!

Signature

Can you please tell me, is this a grammatically correct text (I tried to read the handwriting)? The text is not dated – is the style of writing quite old (1900-1930) or post WW2?

All insights will be greatly appreciated!

Lohengrin

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kfbr392
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Re: German text

#2

Post by kfbr392 » 07 Apr 2017, 13:22

"Vater" should read "Vaters", otherwise perfect German.


lohengrin
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Re: German text

#3

Post by lohengrin » 07 Apr 2017, 18:50

kfbr392 wrote:"Vater" should read "Vaters", otherwise perfect German.
Thank you so much!!

I am glad that I deciphered it almost correctly... although looking at the letter the author written 100% "Vater" - the "s" is missing! you would think that a secretary in such an important job would know the grammar better! :D

Pardon my ignorance, but why is it "Vaters" instead of "Vater"?

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kfbr392
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Re: German text

#4

Post by kfbr392 » 07 Apr 2017, 20:35

"Nachlasses Ihres Herrn Vaters" means "your gentleman father's inheritance".
It is genitive case, which adds the s.

history1
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Re: German text

#5

Post by history1 » 08 Apr 2017, 08:49

lohengrin wrote:
kfbr392 wrote:"Vater" should read "Vaters", otherwise perfect German.
Thank you so much!!
[...] you would think that a secretary in such an important job would know the grammar better! :D
[...]
Hi Lohengrin,

keep in mind that kfbr392 explained the rules for nowadays German.
What today is valid wasn´t at the time! Languages change over the years. Already reading books from the WWII sounds weird for nowadays folks, and that´s only 70 years back.
Here´s a letter from the diplomat Ernst Freiherr von Teschenberg to his fiancé from 1870, sure a person with enormous education for the time. And though many expressions no one would use nowadays, and spelling errors when we read the text and compare it to modern German.
http://oesta.gv.at/site/cob__63239/curr ... fault.aspx
Transkription of the letter:
http://oesta.gv.at/DocView.axd?CobId=63242

Klabautermann
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Re: German text

#6

Post by Klabautermann » 08 Apr 2017, 16:24

There are indeed some details that make the language look old-fashioned. For example, in the first line it says Seinen instead of seinen. The capital first letter was in past times used to underline the importance of a certain person, in this case the Kronprinz.

lohengrin
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Re: German text

#7

Post by lohengrin » 09 Apr 2017, 22:36

history1 wrote:
lohengrin wrote:
kfbr392 wrote:"Vater" should read "Vaters", otherwise perfect German.
Thank you so much!!
[...] you would think that a secretary in such an important job would know the grammar better! :D
[...]
Hi Lohengrin,

keep in mind that kfbr392 explained the rules for nowadays German.
What today is valid wasn´t at the time! Languages change over the years. Already reading books from the WWII sounds weird for nowadays folks, and that´s only 70 years back.
Here´s a letter from the diplomat Ernst Freiherr von Teschenberg to his fiancé from 1870, sure a person with enormous education for the time. And though many expressions no one would use nowadays, and spelling errors when we read the text and compare it to modern German.
http://oesta.gv.at/site/cob__63239/curr ... fault.aspx
Transkription of the letter:
http://oesta.gv.at/DocView.axd?CobId=63242

Thank you for the providing links to this very interesting letter... I read these with great interest!

lohengrin
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Location: Los Angeles, USA

Re: German text

#8

Post by lohengrin » 09 Apr 2017, 22:37

Klabautermann wrote:There are indeed some details that make the language look old-fashioned. For example, in the first line it says Seinen instead of seinen. The capital first letter was in past times used to underline the importance of a certain person, in this case the Kronprinz.
Thank you for your assistance!

lohengrin
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Location: Los Angeles, USA

Re: German text

#9

Post by lohengrin » 09 Apr 2017, 22:38

kfbr392 wrote:"Nachlasses Ihres Herrn Vaters" means "your gentleman father's inheritance".
It is genitive case, which adds the s.
Thank you for the additional info!!

lohengrin
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Joined: 23 Oct 2002, 02:20
Location: Los Angeles, USA

Re: German text

#10

Post by lohengrin » 18 Jun 2017, 20:50

Hi,

Would you be able to clarify for me the following: The first line of the above text reads "Eurer Hoheit, Prinz Georg"... a German friend of mine argues that it is grammatically incorrect and the line must read "Euer Hoheit" ...

I am totally confused... Can anyone explain the difference to me and is there really a second significant grammatical error in the letter?

Thank you!!!

history1
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Re: German text

#11

Post by history1 » 20 Jun 2017, 14:22

I can´t agree with the claim of your German friend. "Eurer = your" as in "your highness" while "Euer = yours" as possessive pronoun.
Jm2c

lohengrin
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Re: German text

#12

Post by lohengrin » 22 Jun 2017, 20:00

Thank you!!
I also thought it was correct, with my limited German.
My friend wrote the following to explain... Auch heißt es nicht "Eurer Hoheit" sondern "Euer Hoheit" ist grammatikalisch falsch und ist von Karl Graf von Rohan nie verwendet worden."
I do not understand his argument or logic...

AliasDavid
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Re: German text

#13

Post by AliasDavid » 24 Jun 2017, 18:20

Duden allows e.g. Euer Majestät as well as Eure Majestät in the nominative case (http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Majestaet). In modern German however the second person plural feminine form of the possessive pronoun is eure for the nominative case and eurer for the dative case, which is used in your quote: Eurer Hoheit = To Your Highness.
UlrichH

lohengrin
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Re: German text

#14

Post by lohengrin » 28 Jun 2017, 23:37

AliasDavid wrote:Duden allows e.g. Euer Majestät as well as Eure Majestät in the nominative case (http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Majestaet). In modern German however the second person plural feminine form of the possessive pronoun is eure for the nominative case and eurer for the dative case, which is used in your quote: Eurer Hoheit = To Your Highness.
UlrichH

Dear Ulrich,

Many thanks for the kind help with this.

Much appreciated

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