Wilhelm Mohnke

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Harro
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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#16

Post by Harro » 17 Apr 2017, 10:58

I think Mohnke's main problem with the Leibstandarte was that he never became "one of the boys" - his stints with the division were too short for enlisted men and the other officers to built a relation. Then when he wasn't among the accused at Dachau (Malmédy Trial) he - like Poetschke, Sieber, Wiese, Kolletschny and the others who were killed in action - became a perfect scapegoat since he wasn't even around due to his incarceration in Russia. Seems he was indeed disliked by several LAH officers and I've heard the stories about Mohnke from AA LAH veterans during my Knittel research but in all their (often parroted) stories and opinions there is a huge foggy area that separates hearsay from actual facts making it extremely difficult to establish the truth.

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#17

Post by phillip burke » 17 Apr 2017, 14:11

Hello Seaburn, thanks,was not going to answer ,you ve done better job than me. Did you know that there s an english translation of Trois Jours en Enfer now for sale, found fairly cheap copy in amazons secondhand section,its not a hardcover and some of the translation a bit stilted but still much better than my atrocious attempt, think will re post later a better translation of the statement from Hubert Meyer that i did. Also Harro, that s really insightful but really fits what we know about him, he must have really stewed during his recovery from wounds in 1941,42,43.


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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#18

Post by j keenan » 17 Apr 2017, 14:23

Mohnke served from 33-4.41 LSSAH and had a good relashinship in the division winning both the EKI,II also the German Cross in gold
he then served as the commander of the Feldersatzabteilung LSSAH before been given the command of the
26 SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. winning the KC then the command of the LSSAH then a Kampfgruppe in Berlin.
Three officers don’t like Mohnke so what ?
There is no proof he was addicted to morphine ?
Vilified by members of the LSSAH where ?
Condemned by his own comrades for the murder of POWS why ? When most of the condemers were on charges for the same thing.
I have never denided Mohnke murdered POWs but not on his say so,just following orders.He was used as a scape goat by his fellow SS officers who believed him to have been killied in Berlin,which was uesed by numourious other trials of SS men as a defence a dead man did it.The English knew where Mohnke was when he was released by the Russians and yet never charged him for any of the crimes people keep trying to pin on him.Because the evidance does not point to Mohnke as neither does the ANGRY officer tag .As for Fontenay all the evidence point to H Meyer as been the angry officer that night.
As for the accusation of been a fan boy I just stick to the facts and present them it is up to the reader to decide what they want to take from them.In my opinion he was no better or worse than other men charged with same crimes,good luck with your book Gigi

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#19

Post by seaburn » 17 Apr 2017, 15:37

Hi 'Jennifergigi' when researching the Mohnke bio you have already touched base with people who have written about him but who you feel need to elaborate more. I would suggest you keep doing this so you can gather all the relevant information but I recommend that you never write something as fact that is just an opinion (however educated), at least not without stating 'while there is no evidence to support this allegation, it is my belief due to other factors......etc'.

In the case of poster JKeenan, you will see that he has only given his opinions here as there are no citations, therefore I would recommend you follow up on these and ask him for his sources as he appears to agree with many of your thoughts on Wilhelm Mohnke and if sources can be found, you would have a lot of good material to publish. I have put the questions that I would ask him if I was in your position as a reference for you. I know on the Fontenay thread he stated already for point 1. that it was Brigadeführer Fritz Witt who was culpable for ordering POWs execution (alas he gave no citations then despite numerous requests and therefore any investigative researcher worth their salt would have to totally disregard this assertion.) You will also see zero evidence produced by JK on the Fontenay thread to pin the blame on Hubert Meyer. But you may have more luck in getting this vital evidence now.

j keenan wrote:I have never denided Mohnke murdered POWs but not on his say so,just following orders
Evidence?
j keenan wrote: He was used as a scape goat by his fellow SS officers who believed him to have been killed in Berlin,which was used by numerous other trials of SS men as a defence a dead man did it.

Evidence ?
j keenan wrote: Because the evidence does not point to Mohnke as neither does the ANGRY officer tag .As for Fontenay all the evidence point to H Meyer as been the angry officer that night.


Evidence?
j keenan wrote:There is no proof he was addicted to morphine ?
Proof that those who alleged it were lying or incorrect?

For the Morphine allegation I attach the overheard conversation of Brigadeführer Kurt Meyer his CO in Normandy and someone who knew him for many years, this was not garnered in an interrogation in which Meyer had to defend himself, but in what he considered to be a private conversation. You will also find other evidence on the Fontenay thread to support this morphine addiction allegation.
WO_208_4364_0488-crop.JPG
WO208/4364

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#20

Post by j keenan » 17 Apr 2017, 15:39

To the original question what was the time frame given for Mohnke been at Dachau ?

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#21

Post by j keenan » 17 Apr 2017, 15:43

Meyer found Mohnke in the Balkans ? Makes no sense
Reread your own posts theres the evidence

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#22

Post by seaburn » 17 Apr 2017, 16:00

Meyer found Mohnke in the Balkans ? Makes no sense
Reread your own posts theres the evidence

I thought you were the LSSAH expert JK - Don't you understand that Meyer says Mohnke became a Morphine addict in the Balkans but then he refers to Mohnke's behaviour in Normany... how else would Meyer have discussed it with Fritz Kraemer !!??
Last edited by seaburn on 17 Apr 2017, 16:37, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#23

Post by Dutto1 » 17 Apr 2017, 16:30

j keenan wrote:Take everything Burke says as rubbish all of it,same with seaburn it's just there opinion make your own mind up and give the Knittle book a miss save your money buy Fischer's book.
Jamie,

I think you are being disrespectful to Seaburn. Seaburn has never written anything on AHF that has not been researched in a thorough and methodical manner.. Regarding Timo Worst's biography of Gustav Knittel, it is the best biography of a SS Officer available on the market today.

If you disagree with what Seaburn has to say about the war criminal Wilhelm Mohnke I suggest you back up your argument with sources instead of your personal opinions.

Regards,

Ron

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#24

Post by Harro » 17 Apr 2017, 16:32

j keenan wrote:Meyer found Mohnke in the Balkans ? Makes no sense
Reread your own posts theres the evidence
Meyer clearly talked about Mohnke's morphine induced state during the Normandy battles with the Balkans only relating to the fact that he had been using the stuff since 1941. It is because of such misinterpretations that I would still urge Jamie to provide primary sources so we can all conclude for ourselves what was actually written.

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#25

Post by Harro » 17 Apr 2017, 17:13

BTW, Mohnke was wounded in 1939 and 1941. After being hospitalised did he perhaps further recover from his injuries at ‘SS-Übungslager’ (SS training camp) Dachau? It was common practice for people had been severely wounded to serve there until they were fit for frontline service. The training facilities lay adjacent to the infamous concentration camp.

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#26

Post by j keenan » 18 Apr 2017, 14:02

seaburn wrote:
Meyer found Mohnke in the Balkans ? Makes no sense
Reread your own posts theres the evidence

I thought you were the LSSAH expert JK - Don't you understand that Meyer says Mohnke became a Morphine addict in the Balkans but then he refers to Mohnke's behaviour in Normany... how else would Meyer have discussed it with Fritz Kraemer !!??
I have never claimed to be an expert on the LSSAH
How could he become a morphine addict in the Balkans ?
Meyer's still makes no sense why would you leave someone in charge of a regiment then a division if he was always in such states.Did he always had a doctor on stand by to give him morphine ? very doubt full.
Last edited by j keenan on 18 Apr 2017, 14:21, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#27

Post by j keenan » 18 Apr 2017, 14:04

Harro wrote:
j keenan wrote:Meyer found Mohnke in the Balkans ? Makes no sense
Reread your own posts theres the evidence
Meyer clearly talked about Mohnke's morphine induced state during the Normandy battles with the Balkans only relating to the fact that he had been using the stuff since 1941. It is because of such misinterpretations that I would still urge Jamie to provide primary sources so we can all conclude for ourselves what was actually written.
There is nothing in Mohnke's file about addiction to morphine

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#28

Post by j keenan » 18 Apr 2017, 14:07

Dutto1 wrote:
j keenan wrote:Take everything Burke says as rubbish all of it,same with seaburn it's just there opinion make your own mind up and give the Knittle book a miss save your money buy Fischer's book.
Jamie,

I think you are being disrespectful to Seaburn. Seaburn has never written anything on AHF that has not been researched in a thorough and methodical manner.. Regarding Timo Worst's biography of Gustav Knittel, it is the best biography of a SS Officer available on the market today.

If you disagree with what Seaburn has to say about the war criminal Wilhelm Mohnke I suggest you back up your argument with sources instead of your personal opinions.

Regards,

Ron
Citing as evidence from the books you list prove nothing as most aren't worth the paper there printed on.
Your opinion on the Knittel book is yours I found a very poor book
Last edited by j keenan on 18 Apr 2017, 14:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: was Wilhelm Mohnke at Dachau Camp ever?

#29

Post by j keenan » 18 Apr 2017, 14:15

Harro wrote:
j keenan wrote:Meyer found Mohnke in the Balkans ? Makes no sense
Reread your own posts theres the evidence
Meyer clearly talked about Mohnke's morphine induced state during the Normandy battles with the Balkans only relating to the fact that he had been using the stuff since 1941. It is because of such misinterpretations that I would still urge Jamie to provide primary sources so we can all conclude for ourselves what was actually written.
Reread seaburn's posts
If all the combat units were killing pows in the HJ sectors in Normandy there must have been an order from above ? Or was Mohnke the first and the rest followed.
The angry officer can be who ever you want it to be in my opinion H Meyer fits the bill perfectly

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Mohnke,morphine,murder and mayhem.

#30

Post by phillip burke » 18 Apr 2017, 14:18

Hello all,well here we are back with that old chestnut Wilhelm Mohnke, awhile ago i did a pretty poor translation of a interview with Hubert Meyer and Georges Bernage. There is now an english version of Trois Jours en Enfer ( Three Days of Hell) published by Heimdal. From the section titled ''The investigation goes on,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Regarding the massacres in Audrieu and Le Mensil Patry,they followed the massacre of Panzer Lehr Division officers. But after the failure of the Canadian court of inquiry,we had to study the events from the very beginning to identify the people responsible for this massacre. At that time , we were working hard to publish Hitlerjugend album whose author Hubert Meyer ,had been chief of staff of this division and knew a lot of things,It was obvious that he would protect his men,as any senior officer would do-and like Gordon Brown did for some of his men when refusing some civillans testimonies.Any officer practices the espirit de corps and the historians have to ''read between the lines''.................................. Like i did with hundred of witnesses of the Battle of Normandy,soldiers and civilians, i took advantage of Hubert Meyers presence,who had corrected the translated copies of his book,to talk about the battle-his testimony was exceptionalbecause of his involvement during the summer of 1944.Naturally we evocated the massacres of Audrie abd Le Mesnil Patry and i asked who was responsible for them.To my great surprise ,he rapidly gave me the name of Wilhelm Mohnke.It is true that Mohnke was part of the first 144 members of the Leibstandartein 1933 and he quickly became a ''black sheep''.As soon as 1940 he had been involved in a war crime.Then ,in 1941,during the Balkans Campaign-Operation Marita-he had been badly wounded and removed from the front for several years;his fate was not following his comrades anymore-these ''Musketeers of the Reich' placed in the limelight of Nazi propaganda.Meanwhile ,being treated with morphine because of his serious wounds,Wilhelm Mohnke had become morphine addict.Yet in the spring of 1943,with the creation of the division Hitlerjugend,the Waffen SS needs officers and Wilhelm Mohnke has to go back to service,he is appointed to command SS-Panzergrenadier Regiment 26..................................................................................................................................................................................Bernard Siebken is hung although the discharging witnesses ,former members of the Hitlerjugend Division ,point at Wilhelm Mohnke for being responsible for the execution of two prisoners nearby 1./26 HQ and for those of June 11. The information given by Hubert Meyer become more explicit;Wilhelm Mohnke was not part of the ''Brothers in Arms'' ''Seraglio'' anymore;he had already been involved in a war crime commited in 1940 and he would be responsible for the war crimes Bernard Siebken was convicted and hung for-although the latter seems to have been an irreproachable officer.Moreover,according to Siegfried Rothemund,Fritz Witt,Kommandeur of the Hitlerjugend,would have had the intention to take sanctions against him,before being killed by shelling at his HQ in Verson on June 14.Wilhelm Mohnke is known for being guilty of war crimes...but he was neber sentenced by the Germans or Allies.However ,is Wilhelm Mohnke the only one responsible for all these executions that occured in several places?Was Hubert Meyer eagerness to answer a way to cover a second person?. Regarding the execution of three prisoners nearby Bernard Siebkens HQ on June 9 and three others on June 11,the events seem to be clear.Regarding the execution in Le Mesnil-Patry ,it must be more than probable.The prisoners are walked to the north,towards captivity.Then an officer arrives in his vehicle and makes the column stop.According to Hubert Meyer;s testimony,this man would be Wilhelm Mohnke,for his HQ was close by.He brutally intercepts this column promised to captivity.Hubert Meyer emphasizes his responsibility ;why should we doubt it...........................................................................

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