Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

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Mannheim
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Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by Mannheim » 15 Dec 2017 23:08

Anyone have any details on why Heinz Ziegler was sacked in 1945? I have read that he had "fallen out of favour" and Tony Le Tissier (in "The Race for the Reichstag") says that Weidling thought he was 'spent'.

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askropp
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Re: Sacking of Heinz Ziegler

Post by askropp » 24 Nov 2018 00:30

I don't understand. General der Artillerie Heinz Ziegler was not "sacked", and he had nothing to do with the Battle of Berlin. I suppose you are talking about SS-Brigadeführer Joachim Ziegler.
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by Mannheim » 24 Nov 2018 06:21

Yes, I think I am. So does anyone know why SS-Brigadeführer Joachim Ziegler was sacked?

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Dieter Zinke
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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by Dieter Zinke » 24 Nov 2018 11:36

According
Schulz/Zinke:. Die Generale der Waffen-SS und der Polizei, Band 6, Biblio-Verlag Bissendorf, 2012:

23.04.1945 Weidling receives the order from Hitler, the LVI. Panzerkorps along with Ziegler's Division to defend the Reichshauptstadt (Reich capital) moved to Berlin. Obviously, Ziegler deliberately brings Versorgungs- und schwere Kampfteile (supply and heavy combat parts), as well as the Nachrichten-Abteilung (news department), to the western districts of Berlin, which weakens the operational capability and puts him in contrast to Kampfkommandant General Weidling, the combat commander. However, his association is also torn apart by irrational orders from above. His intention is, on the one hand, to call into question the fighting power of the division and, on the other hand, to prepare it for an outbreak from Berlin to the west. In addition, he orders his divisional radio center to go to radio silence (Source: Mathias and Tieke)

25.04.1945 in the morning Ziegler was replaced by Weidling, who had made him the head of the defense section C (Neukölln) during the night, because of the refusal to relocate his battle group “Nordland” in the east of Berlin and attack there. Ziegler, “who looks forward to his replacement” (source: Kuby, in: DER SPIEGEL 22/1965, p. 97), hands over command at the Hasenheide to SS-Brigadeführer Dr. Krukenberg, to which he informs that he used only 70 men in the front line, the remaining troop was too exhausted. Anyway, the two Grenadier regiments were only to be considered weak battalions. Ziegler is placed under house arrest on the order of Weidling in the Reich Chancellery in the command post of combat commandant SS-Brigadeführer Mohnke, but managed by the latter loosely. [Erich Kuby reports in SPIEGEL 21/1965 (pp. 71f.) that Weidling had Ziegler arrested “in order to have him shot because he, in agreement with General Steiner and Himmler, tends to a one-sided capitulation to the Western powers”. Thomas Fischer (Fischer, p. 159), on the other hand, writes that Ziegler fell “in disgrace” because, at a meeting with Hitler, he made the suggestion to relocate all hawsers into the Grunewald and to prepare an outbreak]
28.04.1945 receives despite everything the oak leaves to the Knight's Cross
30.04.1945 after Hitler's suicide (around 3.50 pm) Mohnke rescinds Ziegler's house arrest (Source: Fischer, p. 170)

Sources:
Mathias, Karl-Heinz: Felix Steiner, General der Waffen-SS und seine europäischen Freiwilligen. DS-Verlag, Riesa 2002
Tieke, Wilhelm: Das Ende zwischen Oder und Elbe. Der Kampf um Berlin, Motorbuch Verlag Stuttgart 1981
Fischer, Thomas: Die Verteidigung der Reichskanzlei 1945 - Kampfkommandant Mohnke berichtet. Schild-Verlag, Zweibrücken 2007
DER SPIEGEL 21/1965
DER SPIEGEL 22/1965


Dieter Z.

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by Mannheim » 25 Nov 2018 22:46

Excellent! Just what I wanted, Dieter: thanks for the research! P.S. I'm guessing 'hawsers' as in "relocate all hawsers into the Grunewald" should be forces?

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by Dieter Zinke » 25 Nov 2018 23:35

It means "Troß" = baggage :milwink:

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by Mannheim » 26 Nov 2018 04:37

OK, Thanks!

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by steve248 » 26 Nov 2018 13:05

Dieter

The literal translation of "Nachrichten Abteilung" is typical quoted as "News Dept" when it should be "Signals Section"

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by askropp » 26 Nov 2018 15:41

Why only "section"? We are talking about batallions!
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by steve248 » 26 Nov 2018 18:51

Even a battalion had a Signals Section, large or small.

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by askropp » 26 Nov 2018 22:14

We are talking about SS-Nachrichtenabteilung 11, that is a battalion.
Er ist wieder da. Aber auch dieses Mal wird er nicht siegen!

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Re: Sacking of Joachim Ziegler

Post by steve248 » 27 Nov 2018 09:34

This is an explanation of a Wehrmacht Nachrichten Abteilung, and probably not that much different from the Waffen-SS Nachrichten Abteilung:

Die Nachrichtenabteilung einer Infanterie-Division der Wehrmacht
– Gliederung und Ausrüstung –

Soweit nichts Abweichendes befohlen war, hatte die Nachrichtenabteilung stets die Verbindung zu den unterstellten Truppen (Regimenter, Bataillone) und zum rechten Nachbarn herzustellen und zu halten. Die Verbindung zum Korps wurde durch die Nachrichtenabteilung des Korps hergestellt.

Die Nachrichtenabteilung besteht aus
1. Abteilungsstab
2. 1 Fernsprech-Kompanie (teilmot.) (1. Kp)
3. 1 Funk-Kompanie (mot) (2. Kp)
4. leichte Nachrichtenkolonne (mot)

1. Abteilungsstab
- Abteilungskommandeur, Adjudant, Leiter des Nachrichtendienstes (LdN), Technischer Inspektor, Führer Inst-Staffel, Stabsarzt, Zahlmeister, Stabspersonal

2. Fernsprech-Kompanie teilmot. (1. )
- Kompaniechef mit Kompanietrupp
- 5 Fernsprechzüge mit insgesamt
- 11 große Fernsprechtrupps (mot)
- 6 große Fernsprechtrupps (bespannt)
- 3 mittlere Fernsprechbetriebstrupps (mot)
- 2 kleine Fernsprechtrupps (mot)
- Gefechtstroß mit Kompaniefeldwebel, Feldküche, Waffen- und Geräteunteroffizier,
Verpflegungstroß, Gepäcktroß

Zur Ausstattung der Fernsprechkompanie gehörten außerdem noch 2 Trägerfrequenzgeräte, die eine Mehrfachnutzung von Leitungen möglich machten.

3. Funk - Kompanie (mot)
- Kompaniechef mit Kompanietrupp
- 4 Züge mit insgesamt
- 3 mittleren Funktrupps b (mot) mit 100 Watt Gerät
- 2 kleine Funktrupps c (mot) mit 30 Watt Gerät
- 8 kleine Funktrupps a (mot) mit 5 Watt Gerät
- 4 Tornister-Funktrupps b (mot) mit 5 Watt Gerät
- 4 Tornister-Funktrupps d (mot) mit 3 Watt Gerät
- 3 Horch- u. 1 Lauschtrupp, zusammengefaßt zu einem Nachrichten-Aufklärungs.Zug
- 1 Schlüsseltrupp mit ENIGMA II
- Gefechtstroß mit Kompaniefeldwebel, Feldküche, Waffen- und Geräteunteroffizier, Verpflegungstroß, Gepäcktroß,
-1 LKw mit Ladesatz D für Batterien.

Höchst-Reichweite der Funkgeräte – abhängig von Gelände, Wetter, Tageszeit, Antenne:
(Tastfunk / Sprechfunk):
100 W: 200 km / 70 km
30 W : 150 km / 50 km
5 W : 90 km / 30 km
5 W – Tornister: 25 km / 10 km
3 W – Tornister: 17 km / 4 km
5. leichte Nachrichtenkolonne (mot)
- Kolonnenführer
- 4 LKw, 1 Anhänger mit Ladesatz D

Fahrzeuge:
103 motorisierte Fahrzeuge, 32 Kräder, 7 bespannte Fahrzeuge, 52 Pferde.

more details from http://www.heinrich-schwenker.italodito ... ilung.html

As I said in my earlier post, large units would have large signals sections; smaller units would naturally have small signals sections.
By 1945 Ziegler's Nachrichten Abteilung might have had just a few signallers and associated technical staff, and like many units at this time seriously undermanned.

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