Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

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itaiv40
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Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by itaiv40 » 28 Jan 2020 17:09

Some of the Niemann photos are out. Looks like Erich Bauer sitting in the group photo with the beer and wine glasses. Any other IDs?

Source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... story.html
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itaiv40
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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by itaiv40 » 28 Jan 2020 17:23

In the photo of the men sitting on the canoe, USHMM is identifying the man on the left as Karl Pötzinger and the man on the right as Siegfried Graetschus.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Earldor » 28 Jan 2020 18:27

Does anyone recognize the collar tabs on the man sitting on the far right in the last picture? Which branch and what rank do they seem to denote?

Washington Post article also mentioned that Reichleitner is included in the bar scene. I'm guessing the man in the middle standing without his jacket.

Also, in the first picture (from Berlin) the man on the right, listening to the man in glasses, looks IMHO a bit like the Ukranian guard in this picture, labeled as Libodenko. Image

I know that Libodenko is pictured with Treblinka personnel and that Niemann was mainly in Belzec and Sobibor, but still.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by trespasser07 » 28 Jan 2020 21:14

When is book with the full album avaliable?
"We believe in what we do!" - written in Friedrich Rainer's Guestbook by Odilo Globocnik in April 1943.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Tom3277 » 28 Jan 2020 21:30

Hi,

Very interesting pictures, thanks.
Earldor wrote:
28 Jan 2020 18:27
Does anyone recognize the collar tabs on the man sitting on the far right in the last picture? Which branch and what rank do they seem to denote?
Hard to say, looks like a Bezirkszollkommissar or Zollamtmann of the Zollgrenzschutz.

This man with the Goldenes Parteiabzeichen looks a lot like Blankenburg (comparison picture from our book "Globocnik's Men in Italy").

Regards
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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Earldor » 28 Jan 2020 21:52

Tom3277 wrote:
28 Jan 2020 21:30
Hard to say, looks like a Bezirkszollkommissar or Zollamtmann of the Zollgrenzschutz
Thanks for the answer. In that case, it would seem that this man is a visitor to the camp.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Helmut0815 » 28 Jan 2020 22:44

The photograph of Niemann riding on a horse seems to be mirror inverted.

regards


Helmut

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Max Williams » 28 Jan 2020 23:46

I would say that is definitely Blankenburg.
It doesn't look like Erich Bauer to me.
The photo of [Niemann ?] on horseback is inverted.
The uniform of the man on the right might well be a Sonderdienst uniform, which would fit in.
These photos may well not have been taken at Sobibor camp. The shot of three sitting by the wire fence is definitely NOT a Sobibor camp photo. Not having seen the other images, I think these are from Trawniki and not Sobibor.
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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Earldor » 29 Jan 2020 03:36

Max Williams wrote:
28 Jan 2020 23:46
These photos may well not have been taken at Sobibor camp. The shot of three sitting by the wire fence is definitely NOT a Sobibor camp photo. Not having seen the other images, I think these are from Trawniki and not Sobibor.
Max.
Yes, some of the pictures aren't from Sobibor, but the patio picture is.

As you can see from the WaPo article linked in the first message, the top one is from a trip to Berlin. The horseback picture is from Sobibor. The drinking scene is from Sobibor. The one by the fence/canoe is identified as from a T4 center (According to BBC, Niemann had written Brandenburg behind the pic https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-51279900). Although, I suppose in theory that could be a reference to Totenkopfstandarte Brandenburg, although I don't know if Pötzinger belonged to it. Niemann and Graetschus did.

There's a photo in the WaPo article from Belzec, which shows one SS-man and several Trawniki men. If the picture is from early 1942, the SS-man in the picture could be Jirmann, who was one of the men responsible for Hiwi training (Oberhauser and Franz being the other two). But that's pure speculation, as the picture could be from late 1942 as well. I say Jirmann, because the man in my opinion doesn't look like the other two possibilities. Naturally, this is total speculation, and I guess we have to wait for USHMM to do more research on them.


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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Earldor » 29 Jan 2020 10:06

Max Williams wrote:
28 Jan 2020 23:46
These photos may well not have been taken at Sobibor camp. The shot of three sitting by the wire fence is definitely NOT a Sobibor camp photo. Not having seen the other images, I think these are from Trawniki and not Sobibor.
Max.
Yes, some of the pictures aren't from Sobibor, but the patio picture is.

As you can see from the WaPo article linked in the first message, the top one is from a trip to Berlin. The horseback picture is from Sobibor. The drinking scene is from Sobibor. The one by the fence/canoe is identified as from a T4 center (According to BBC, Niemann had written Brandenburg behind the pic https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-51279900). Although, I suppose in theory that could be a reference to Totenkopfstandarte Brandenburg, although I don't know if Pötzinger belonged to it. Niemann and Graetschus did.

There's a photo in the WaPo article from Belzec, which shows one SS-man and several Trawniki men. If the picture is from early 1942, the SS-man in the picture could be Jirmann, who was one of the men responsible for Hiwi training at the earliest stage (Oberhauser and Franz being the other two). But that's pure speculation, as the picture could be from late 1942 as well. I say Jirmann, because the man in my opinion doesn't look like the other two possibilities. Naturally, this is total speculation, and I guess we have to wait for USHMM to do more research on them.

Oh, and I'm basing my timing of the pictures on the snow and the fact that Belzec only operated until the end of 1942, and the 1005 operations ended in the spring and summer of 1943, with Niemann being in Sobibor at that stage.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Peter » 29 Jan 2020 10:55

Niemann (BDC)
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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Earldor » 29 Jan 2020 12:44

Max Williams wrote:
28 Jan 2020 23:46
These photos may well not have been taken at Sobibor camp. The shot of three sitting by the wire fence is definitely NOT a Sobibor camp photo. Not having seen the other images, I think these are from Trawniki and not Sobibor.
Max.
Yes, some of the pictures aren't from Sobibor, but the patio picture is.

As you can see from the WaPo article linked in the first message, the top one is from a trip to Berlin. The horseback picture is from Sobibor. The drinking scene is from Sobibor. The one by the fence/canoe is identified as from a T4 center (According to BBC, Niemann had written Brandenburg behind the pic https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-51279900). Although, I suppose in theory that could be a reference to Totenkopfstandarte Brandenburg, although I don't know if Pötzinger belonged to it. Niemann and Graetschus did.

There's a photo in the WaPo article from Belzec, which shows one SS-man and several Trawniki men. If the picture is from early 1942, the SS-man in the picture could be Jirmann, who was one of the men responsible for Hiwi training at the earliest stage (Oberhauser and Franz being the other two). But that's pure speculation, as the picture could be from late 1942 as well. I say Jirmann, because the man in my opinion doesn't look like the other two possibilities. Naturally, this is total speculation, and I guess we have to wait for USHMM to do more research on them.

Oh, and I'm basing my timing of the Belzec picture on the snow and the fact that the camp only operated until the end of 1942, and the 1005 operations ended in the spring and summer of 1943, with Niemann being in Sobibor at that stage.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by goofy » 29 Jan 2020 17:06

Did Blankenburg serve under the Globocnik in Trieste? Above posted photo of SA-Oberführer was taken during the parade in this city.

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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Max Williams » 29 Jan 2020 17:14

Yes, he was in Trieste attached to Abteilung R as a member of the staff of the Führerkanzlei.
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Re: Photos from Johann Niemann (Sobibor) collection

Post by Michael Miller » 29 Jan 2020 18:12

I'm probably wrong, but the man in the group photo, identified as Karl Pötzinger, looks to me more like this one (Kurt Franz).

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