HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

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Ludger
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HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#1

Post by Ludger » 23 Mar 2020, 17:39

Hi all of you,

at the moment I'm trying to compile the "HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd". And the details are very confusing to me. So I'm dependent on the specialized knowledge of our research experts. Here are my questions:

1. Was "HöSSPF Ukraine und Russland-Süd" built by fusion of "HSSPF Ukraine" and "HSSPF Rußland-Süd" or was it built by upgrading "HSSPF Rußland-Süd" because "HSSPF Schwarzes Meer" was added as well as the SSPF which originally had been envisioned for the "HSSPF Kaukasien"? At least the HöSSPF had covered the largest control area of Russia by absorbing "Schwarzes Meer" and "Kaukasien".

In his book "Allgemeine-SS" Mark Yerger states on page 44 with respect to HSSPF Rußland-Süd: "Created for the rear area of Heeresgruppe "B" during the invasion of Russia, this post was headquartered in Kiev. At a later time Prützmann retained both the HSSPF and the HöSSPF "Ukraine" posts. "Rußland-Süd" was the most extensive control area of the eastern area HSSPF. In addition to its originally subordinated SSPF, it absorbed the SSPF that would have been subordinated to the HSSPF "Kaukasien,"…"

2. Please correct me if I'm wrong. But if I understand Mr. Yerger correctly, there had been two different HSSPF namely "Ukraine" and "Rußland-Süd". That leads me to my next questions:

3. Which were the SSPF originally subordinated to "HSSPF Ukraine" and to "HSSPF Rußland-Süd" respectively?

4. Which were the SSPF originally subordinated to "HSSPF Schwarzes Meer"? Unfortunately Mr. Yerger doesn't list any (because there weren't any?).

Many thanks in advance for dealing with that problems. Any hint is highly appreciated.
Greetings from
Ludger

steve248
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#2

Post by steve248 » 23 Mar 2020, 19:02

According to Ruth Bettina Birn's book on the HSSPF, Jeckeln then Prützmann held the title "Der Höhere SS- und Polizeiführer beim Reichskommissar für die Ukraine" (in 1941 and to 1943).
On 29 Oct 1943, Prützmann's office was re-titled "Höchster SS- und Polizeiführer im Reichskommissariat Ukraine und Russland-Süd (Höchster SS- und Polizeiführer in Personalunion mit Höherem SS- und Polizeiführer Russland-Süd)".
Under his office were these SSPF: Wolhynien, Charkow, Dnjepropwtrowsk, Kiew, Nikolajew, Rostow, Shitomir, Simferopol, Stalino, Tschernigow.

It may will be that Prützmann felt slighted after a long career as HSSPF to see Karl Wolff appointed, on 23 Sept 1943 (four weeks earlier), "Der Höchste SS- und Polizeiführer beim Obebefehlshaber im Gebiet der Heeresgruppe B und Oberbefehlshaber Süd" and stationed in Verona, Italy. Wolff who had no police career and simply a lackey of Himmler. Yes you can bet your last dollar that Prützmann was more than "slighted".

When the forthcoming diaries of Himmler via Moscow become available to see who was visiting who in Sept-Oct 1943.

Out of interest, when I was trawling through the German Police Decodes at UK National Archives, following their declassification in 1997 or 1998, in the early days of Barbarossa the three HSSPFs in Russia (Nord, Mitte, Süd) were noted as HSSPF 101, 102 and 103 for their radio messages.


HM
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#3

Post by HM » 23 Mar 2020, 20:39

steve248 wrote:
23 Mar 2020, 19:02
Out of interest, when I was trawling through the German Police Decodes at UK National Archives, following their declassification in 1997 or 1998, in the early days of Barbarossa the three HSSPFs in Russia (Nord, Mitte, Süd) were noted as HSSPF 101, 102 and 103 for their radio messages.
Steve is right. For those who are interested:

On the 26th of June the 3 HSSPF reported to the "Befehlshaber des Rückwärtigen Heeresgebietes"(Berück)
Berück 101: Prützmann
Berück 102: von dem Bach
Berück 103: Jeckeln

HM.

policeman51
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#4

Post by policeman51 » 24 Mar 2020, 19:14

The Reichskommissariat Ukraine was projected to compose of 14 Generalbezirke, Wolhynien, Shitomir, Kiew, Tschernigow, Nikolajew, Charkow, Taurien, Dnjepropetrowsk, Woronesh, Stalino, Rostow, Saratow, Stalingrad and Wolgadeutscher.

The only Generalbezirke that were fully formed under civil adminstration, were Wolhynien, Shitomir, Nikolajew, Dnjepropetrowsk, Kiew (west of Dnyper),
Tschernigow, Charkow and Stalino were only partially formed under civil administration and military administration because of the fluctuation of the front lines.

HSSPF Kaukasus was projected with personnel in place, but never physically formed. This area that was to be Reichskommissariat Kaukasus was still under Heeresgruppe "A" military administration, which consisted of various Feldkommandanturen, Ortskommandanturen I and II.

This is very basic information that has come to mind. I have more in my documents, but will take time to gather together.

Peter
Last edited by policeman51 on 24 Mar 2020, 21:23, edited 1 time in total.

policeman51
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#5

Post by policeman51 » 24 Mar 2020, 21:20

Der Reichsführer-SS Feld-Kommandostelle, den 22.10.1943

An den
SS-Obergruppenführer und
General der Polizei

Hans Prützmann
(SS-Nr. 3 002)

Ich ernenne Sie, unter Beibehaltung Ihrer Dienststellung als Höherer SS- und Polizeiführer bei der Heeresgruppe Russland-Süd, zum
Höchsten SS- und Polizeiführer im Reichskommissariat Ukraine.


Der Reichsführer-SS
gez. H. Himmler.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Der Reichsführer-SS Feld-Kommandostelle, den 22.10.1943


An den
SS-Brigadeführer und
Generalmajor der Polizei

Ludwig von Alvensleben
(SS-Nr. 177 002)

Ich ernenne Sie, unter Beibehaltung Ihrer Dienststellung als SS- und Polizeiführer Krim,
zum
Höheren SS- und Polizeiführer im Gebiet der Heeresgruppe A.


Der Reichsführer-SS
gez. H. Himmler.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Der Reichsführer-SS Feldkommandostelle, den 25.XII.1943

SS-Obergruppenführer und
General der Polizei

Richard Hildebrandt
(SS-Nr. 7 088)

Für die Dauer der Erkrankung des SS-Gruppenführer und Generalleutnants der Polizei v. Alvensleben,
beauftrage ich Sie vertretungsweise mit der Wahrnehmung der Geschäfte des Höheren-SS und Polizeiführers im Gebiet der Heeresgruppe A und des SS- und Polizeiführer Krim.


Der Reichsführer-SS
gez. H. Himmler.



---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ludger
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#6

Post by Ludger » 25 Mar 2020, 12:41

Whow!! Great and interesting infos!!
Thanks a lot gentlemen for all your comments. I think it's getting a bit clearer now, even though there are still some interrogation marks to be reset.

@steve248
According to my information the SSPF you've listed all came from Ukraine and not from Russland-Süd.

@policeman51
In the listing of the Generalbezirk "fully formed under civil administration" the Generalbezirk Krim/Taurien seated Melitopol is missing (Generalkommissar was Alfred Frauenfeldsince 01.09.1942).

So if I understand all of your information correctly and combine this with other sources then …
… there had been a HSSPF Russland-Süd
  • Prützmann 01.11.1941 – Sep. 1944 and HöSSPF Ukraine in personal union since 29.10.1943
… there had been a HSSPF with Heeresgruppe A
  • v. Alvensleben 22.10.1943 – 11.02.1944 and SSPF Nikolajew in personal union
  • I guess it conforms to "HSSPF Ukraine" as HGr. A was in the area of the Krim together with 3. rumänische Armee and AOK 17 at that time
… there had been a HSSPF Schwarzes Meer (even though only projected for a short time)
  • v. Alvensleben 29.10. – 25.12.1943
  • He never took office due to illness; deputy was Richard Hildebrandt before returning to SS-RuSHA
My remaining questions:
Yerger states "Rußland-Süd" was the most extensive control area of the eastern area HSSPF. In addition to its originally subordinated SSPF, it absorbed the SSPF that would have been subordinated to the HSSPF "Kaukasien,"…" So which were the SSPF originally subordinated to HSSPF Russland-Süd?
Which were the SSPF designated to be subordinated to HSSPF Schwarzes Meer?

Thanks in advance!!
Greetings from
Ludger

steve248
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#7

Post by steve248 » 25 Mar 2020, 20:09

HSSPF Schwarzes Meer was based on SSPF Nikolajew and no others.
von Alvensleben was ill in mid Nov 1943 and absent from post.
Hildebrandt listed as HSSPF in various documents and held the post during the retreat, latterly in Kronstadt (Rumania) in Aug 1944 when appointed HSSPF für rumänisch-Siebenbürgen.
Rather than dismiss my earlier post quoting R B Birn why don't you accept her research on SSPF?
As regards the SSPF subordinated to HSSPF Kaukasien, six were designated but only three took the field: Nordkaukasien, Kuban and Rostow. Three others remained academic: Bergvölker, Azerbaijan, and Georgia.
Jürgen Stroop claims he was designated SSPF Georgien.
I wrote to Mark Yerger many years ago pointing out several errors in his writings about HSSPF Kaukasien and Russland-Süd. No reply.

policeman51
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#8

Post by policeman51 » 26 Mar 2020, 18:26

HSSPF A, was deployed in the area of Army Group South in 1941, he was also responsible for the Reich Commissioner for Ukraine after the establishment of the civil administration; it was renamed in 1942 to HSSPF Russia-South and - after an HSSPF Black Sea was deployed in the area of Army Group A in November 1943 - in March 1944 in HSSPF Russia-South and Supreme SS and Police Leader Ukraine. The HSSPF headquarters were moved from Rovno to Kiev in February 1942. In March 1944, after the withdrawal of the front, his location was in Lemberg, and on March 18, 1944, the order to dissolve Höchster SS-und Polizeiführer Ukraine und HSSPF Rußland-Süd was ordered, except for Kampfgruppe Prützmann a combat group to be formed from the remnants.

Reorganization of the Army Area South

With effect from 1.8.1942 the Army Region Süd is assumed in the Army Area A and Army Area B.
Border western border Rayon Petrikowka - west and north boundary Zarithchanka - northern border Kotowka western border Satschopilowka - west and north boundary Karlowka - northern border Berestowenka - northern and eastern borders Staroworowka - northern border Alexeyevka - Balakleja.

For military area A includes the areas of
SS-u.PF. Dnjepropetrovsk (east of the Dnieper)
SS-u.PF. Stalino
SS-u.PF. Rostov (so far already in army area)

For Army Area B includes the areas of
SS-u.PF. Charkow
SS-u.PF. Tschernigow
SS-u.PF. Kiew (east of the Dnieper).

Mit Wirkung vom 1.8.1942 wird das Heeresgebiet Süd in das Heeregebiet A und Heeresgebiet B unterstellt.
Grenze Westgrenze Rayon Petrikowka - West-und Nordgrenze Zarithchanka - Nordgrenze Kotowka Westgrenze Satschopilowka - West-und Nordgrenze Karlowka - Nordgrenze Berestowenka - Nord- und Ostgrenze Staroworowka - Nordgrenze Alexejewka - Balakleja.
Zum Heeresgebiet A gehören die Bereiche der
SS-u.PF. Dnjepropetrowsk (ostwärts der Dnjepr),
SS-u.PF. Stalino
SS-u.PF. Rostow (soweit schon im Heeresgebiet)

Zum Heeresgebiet B gehören die Bereiche der
SS-u.PF. Charkow
SS-u.PF. Tschernigow
SS-u.PF. Kiew (ostwärts des Dnjepr).

I hope this helps you understand a bit more.
It gets complicated because the constantly changing frontlines, and the projected Generalbezirke never really got off the ground because of this.
With German thoroughness, they had already planned to divide up European Russia into 4 Reichskommissariat, Ostland, Ukraine, Moskau and Kaukasien. Even before the territories were conquered, personnel were already in place on paper, ready to go, in conjunction with the military administration.

policeman51
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#9

Post by policeman51 » 26 Mar 2020, 18:40

The HSSPF Black Sea, was subordinate to the Supreme SSPF Ukraine, received Fp.Nr.44330 in Nov. 1943, the post was dissolved a year later after the collapse of the southern front. His seat was based in Nikolayev, with SSPF Simperopol/Taurien, became SSPF Krim from 14.10.1942, with SSPF Nikolajew being subordinate to him.

policeman51
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#10

Post by policeman51 » 26 Mar 2020, 19:02

More information from my files.



Abschrift

Tgb.Nr. 2103/43 geh.v.9.10.43

Der Reichsführer-SS Feldkommandostelle, den 6. Okt. 1943
Trg.Nr. I2107/43 Ads-g-
RF/En


Geheim!

Die Neugliederung des Gebietes des bisherigen Höheren SS- und Polizeiführers Ukraine - Russland-Süd, die durch die Frontverlegung hervorgerufen ist, hat ein Anzahl Veränderungen mit sich gebracht. Die heutige Gliederung ist folgende :

1.) Der bisherige Höhere SS- und Polizeiführer Ukraine führt die Dienstbezeichnung
"Der Höchste SS- und Polizeiführer im Reichskommissariat Ukraine". Der Höchste SS- und Polizeiführer der Ukraine ist SS-Obergruppenführer und General der Polizei Prützmann. Er ist in einer Person Höherer SS- und Polizeiführer bei der Heeresgruppe Russland-Süd.

2.) Unter ihm wird die Kommandostelle eines Höheren SS- und Polizeiführers im Gebiet der Heeresgruppe A eingerichtet. Höherer SS- und Polizeiführer ist der SS-Brigadeführer und Generalmajor der Polizei von Alvensleben.

3.) SS- und Polizeiführer sind folgende :

a.) Luzk - SS-Brigadeführer Günther,
b.) Shitomir - SS-Brigadeführer Diehm,
c.) Kiew - SS-Gruppenführer und Generalleutnant der Polizei Hennicke,
d.) Kriwoirog - SS-Brigadeführer Schäfer,
e.) Nikolajew - anstelle des SS-Brigadeführer und Generalmajor der Polizei Zimmermann, SS-Brigadeführer und Generalleutnant der Polizei Rudolf Weiss, der seinen Dienst sofort anzutreten hat.
f.) Krim - in Vertretung des SS-Brigadeführer und Generalmajor der Polizei von Alvensleben, der diese Stelle in Personalunion behält, SS-Oberführer Roch.

4.) SS-Brigadeführer und Generalmajor der Polizei Wappenhans wird dem Höchsten SS- und Polizeführer in der Ukraine bis auf Weiteres als Kampfgruppen-Kommandeur zur Verfügung gestellt.

gez. Himmler



The reorganization of the area of the current Superior SS and Police Leader Ukraine - Russia-South, which is caused by the shifting frontline has brought about a number of changes within the territory of the HSSPF Ukraine.

Today's arrangement is the following:

1.) Previous Superior SS and Police Leader Ukraine will implement the service designation
' Supreme SS and Police Leader in the Reichs Commissioner's Office Ukraine '. Supreme SS and Police Leader of the Ukraine is a SS-Obergruppenführer and General of the Police Hans Prützmann. He is also in person a Superior SS and Police Leader with the Army Group of Russland-Süd.

2.) Under him the command post of a Superior SS and Police Leader is set-up in the area of the Army Group A. The Superior SS and Police Leader is the SS-Brigadeführer and Major- general of the Police of Ludolf von Alvensleben.

3.) SS and Police Leaders are the following:

a.) Luzk - SS-Brigadeführer Günther,
b.) Shitomir - SS-Brigadeführer Diehm,
c.) Kiev - SS-Gruppenführer and Lieutenant-General of Police Hennicke,
d.) Kriwoirog - SS-Brigadeführer Schäfer,
e.) Nikolajew - In stead of the SS-Brigadeführer and Major-General of Police Zimmermann, SS SS-Brigadeführer and Lieutenant-General of Police Rudolf Weiss, in which he has to begin his service immediately.
f.) Krim - stand-in for SS-Brigadeführer and Major-General of Police of Ludolf von Alvensleben, which keeps this position in personnel union with HSSPF Army Group A, SS-Oberführer Roch.

4.) SS Brigadeführer and Major-General of Police Wappenhans is put at the disposal to the Superior SS- and Police Leader in the Ukraine for future combat group commander.


Peter

Ludger
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#11

Post by Ludger » 26 Mar 2020, 19:04

Whow Peter, that's really great. Thanks a lot for that.
Now I've got to "digest" this completely new information.
Greetings from
Ludger

policeman51
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#12

Post by policeman51 » 27 Mar 2020, 18:31

Glad to be of help, Ludger. I will keep digging for more information and post as necessary.

Peter

Ludger
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#13

Post by Ludger » 27 Mar 2020, 19:02

Thanks a lot in advance!!
Greetings from
Ludger

smetanin albert
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#14

Post by smetanin albert » 30 Mar 2020, 15:19

Add Info :
Leiter Standortverwaltung Kiew(b.HSSPF) - Erich Alexnat(1941-1943)
God created the Internet, but devil created Darknet.

smetanin albert
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Re: HöSSPF Ukraine und Rußland-Süd

#15

Post by smetanin albert » 08 Apr 2020, 07:47

from SSO Alvensleben
Attachments
0138.jpg
SSO
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