Best fighting allies

Discussions on all aspects of the smaller Axis nations in Europe and Asia. Hosted by G. Trifkovic.
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houndie
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Post by houndie » 02 Sep 2002 18:45

People, people, let's stick to allies, not the french, the estonians (god bless those fighters), the latvians nor Holland, as they were occupied and couldn't be called allied. They were allied to Germany as much as North-Dakota is allied to America.

I'd say the Hungarians, because we are of same blood (as with the Finnish).
War is a matter of vital importance to the state. Hence, it is imperative that it be studied thoroughly - sun tzu
The truth of world war should be documented and it should not be treated as nazi propaganda.

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Andy
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Post by Andy » 02 Sep 2002 21:13

The Japanese. And why aren't very many people mentioning them? They were the best fighters and most important German ally.

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Andy H
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Post by Andy H » 03 Sep 2002 21:50

Thanks GvD

Now I can look at that area more closely

:D Andy from the Shire

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GLADIVM
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Post by GLADIVM » 11 Sep 2002 05:43

Von Rundsted had this to say about germany allies :

"italians terrible people " :(
" romanians their officers and NCO are beyond description" :(
" hungarians they only want to go home as quickly as possible : :(
Of course Rundsted was unfair and spiteful of Germany allies , which were requested to to make the same functions of the german units without considering that their equipment was of much lower quality and in some cases as tanks or AT guns almost not existent and surely not effective against soviet armour .
Almost all Axis soldier fought well and resisted the first onslaught of soviet attacks but without effective AT guns , once soviet tanks broke their lines were was little they could do and often panic ensued .
All troops that have no proper defence agianst tanks are in a hopeless situation and will run after their lines are broken ,is a simple human reaction , this happend several times also in german units if they had no effective weapons .
In my view all Axis soldiers were brave but their equipment and leadership was not of highest quality and also they were requested to perform tasks well beyond their capability .
Making a rate of which one was the best or the worst is I believe unfair to all the soldiers that fought and died and all fronts

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Hadrian
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Post by Hadrian » 13 Nov 2002 10:29

All the German Allies fought well. Japanese should be the first as determination (Bushido Code :) ) and as fidelity, they fought even after the Germany surrendered :cry: . Romanians should be mentioned, they had a revenge in mind for the ocupation of Basarabia and Bucovina :x . We must to mention the lack of modern equipment (at Stalingrad the 25 and 37 mm AT canons and their crews were literaly crushed under the tracks of the T34s). Whenewer they got modern equipment they did their job with honor. After the Soviet ocupied Romania, they asked for certain elite units to be disbanded, such as the montain troups and the Romania Mare (Great Romania) division, because they feared of their loyalty.

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Napoli
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Post by Napoli » 14 Nov 2002 02:51

GLADIVM wrote:Von Rundsted had this to say about germany allies :

"italians terrible people " :(
" romanians their officers and NCO are beyond description" :(
" hungarians they only want to go home as quickly as possible : :(
Of course Rundsted was unfair and spiteful of Germany allies , which were requested to to make the same functions of the german units without considering that their equipment was of much lower quality and in some cases as tanks or AT guns almost not existent and surely not effective against soviet armour .
Almost all Axis soldier fought well and resisted the first onslaught of soviet attacks but without effective AT guns , once soviet tanks broke their lines were was little they could do and often panic ensued .
All troops that have no proper defence agianst tanks are in a hopeless situation and will run after their lines are broken ,is a simple human reaction , this happend several times also in german units if they had no effective weapons .
In my view all Axis soldiers were brave but their equipment and leadership was not of highest quality and also they were requested to perform tasks well beyond their capability .
Making a rate of which one was the best or the worst is I believe unfair to all the soldiers that fought and died and all fronts
This would be my oppion also, well written. Most Axis Allies never really had time to biuld up their arsenals to the point of both Germany and Japan so would have constantly been playing catch up to them in order to play on a level playing field.
One should also consider the reasoning to joining in the first place. Troop morale soon becomes sapped when your being sent to invade someone who in your mind has no real reason to be invaded.
Although some Italian unit fought well, as a whole they were a disapointment in a lot of respects always trying to catch up with technology being used by oponents. Brave they were in most respects to the point of defending to the last shell before bayoneting to the death and holding lines that German troops had long retreated from, but this was modern warfare that dictated modern methods and equipment be used.
Andy, maybe check out the Carabinieri troops for some info :wink:

JLEES
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Japanese

Post by JLEES » 14 Nov 2002 22:56

Andy,
I mentioned the Japanese April 26, but no one commented back. It's obvious they were the best allies Nazi-Germany had in the war; the others were distant second place.
James

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marauder4155
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Post by marauder4155 » 15 Nov 2002 19:36

I agree with Andy and JLEES. the Japanese were the most important allies the Germans have.

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Oleg Grigoryev
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Post by Oleg Grigoryev » 15 Nov 2002 22:19

marauder4155 wrote:I agree with Andy and JLEES. the Japanese were the most important allies the Germans have.
according to German reports Spaniards looted most of the Novgord churches despite the warnings written in both German and Spanish. Rsocamp in his report from 1942 for instance says that church of St. Mikhail - the only one working in the Soviet time in the city, was well preserved by Soviets and contained very valuable collections of historically important artifacts - Spaniards blew the door of the church with hand grenade and stall all the icons as well as silverware – in general form this report you can get the impression that “blue division” was a bunch looters that could not be controlled. – once again these are German reports.

Ovidius
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Post by Ovidius » 15 Nov 2002 23:13

oleg wrote:
marauder4155 wrote:I agree with Andy and JLEES. the Japanese were the most important allies the Germans have.
according to German reports Spaniards looted most of the Novgord churches despite the warnings written in both German and Spanish. Rsocamp in his report from 1942 for instance says that church of St. Mikhail - the only one working in the Soviet time in the city, was well preserved by Soviets and contained very valuable collections of historically important artifacts - Spaniards blew the door of the church with hand grenade and stall all the icons as well as silverware – in general form this report you can get the impression that “blue division” was a bunch looters that could not be controlled. – once again these are German reports.
According to reports from plenty of places, the Russians did the same wherever they went, plus other crimes, and not only with churches, but you still claim they were good warriors :mrgreen:

~Ovidius

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Oleg Grigoryev
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Post by Oleg Grigoryev » 15 Nov 2002 23:56

Ovidius wrote:
oleg wrote:
marauder4155 wrote:I agree with Andy and JLEES. the Japanese were the most important allies the Germans have.
according to German reports Spaniards looted most of the Novgord churches despite the warnings written in both German and Spanish. Rsocamp in his report from 1942 for instance says that church of St. Mikhail - the only one working in the Soviet time in the city, was well preserved by Soviets and contained very valuable collections of historically important artifacts - Spaniards blew the door of the church with hand grenade and stall all the icons as well as silverware – in general form this report you can get the impression that “blue division” was a bunch looters that could not be controlled. – once again these are German reports.
According to reports from plenty of places, the Russians did the same wherever they went, plus other crimes, and not only with churches, but you still claim they were good warriors :mrgreen:

~Ovidius
Makes one wonder where did they get the idea does not it? :wink: oh and my my idea on qulities of Russian solder is mainly based on the outcome of the war. IF you can point some error in my logic I'll be eternally grateful:)

julian
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Post by julian » 16 Nov 2002 14:02

I would have to disagree in regard to the japanese being the best ally, whilst the Japanese troops may have had the best potential as soldiers compared to Germany's other alllies, the support Germany received from Japan was negligible. Japan, from its entrance into the war, was primarily concerned with the asia-pacific theatre of war, she may have provided significant support for Germany if the decision to open a front against the Soviets had been made. The United States had long made the decision to concentrate on the European theatre and leave the Pacific theatre at a bare minimum for men and equipment, thus the advent of the Japanese into the war was not of great assistance to the Germans. Japan would have mainly provided moral support, and perhaps also, the hope that if Japan's offensive was successful enough, the United States would be forced to divert greater resources to the Pacific and away from Europe and the supply of the Soviets.

Cheers

julian

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Andy H
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Post by Andy H » 16 Nov 2002 14:30

Japn was Germanys most IMPORTANT ally in world sense of WW2, whilst on a European basis the arguement/thread has been gone over many times.

Japan was important to Germany in not what it did directly to help Germany but by what it did indirectly. Just imagine that the USA hadn't come to blows with Japan, the amount of material that could have been directed against Germany-Landing craft being a prime example.

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Daniel L
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Post by Daniel L » 16 Nov 2002 17:26

I'd say the Hungarians, because we are of same blood (as with the Finnish).
Why does that make them better fighters?

regards

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Juha Tompuri
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Post by Juha Tompuri » 16 Nov 2002 22:53

How did Germany benefit from the japanese enter to their side? Before it they were fighting against SU and UK, after 7th Dec also USA. Nice allies.

Juha

P.S. wasn`t the original question about the best allies, not about the war effort?

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