Japanese are particpating in WW reenactment

[Ebusitanus]

Now these are hilarious...a great way to combine airsoft with a tactical reenactment were people will actually take their "hits".

http://www2.117.ne.jp/~kgc/photo.m02w.htm

No matter how accurate their stuff are, they will still look like japanese people with german uniforms, not like wehrmacht or ss.

We see this type of "farbiness" also amongst us trying to reenact Japanese WW2.

http://www.geocities.com/pop401k/index

These guys are from Virginia I believe

[nihil]

OMG! Thats even worse!

[craigob]

http://www2.117.ne.jp/~kgc/photo.of1.htm

[Unki Hans]

PLEASE! Don't mess up the history trip. The Japs in the SS uniforms is SO wrong on so many levels. These people are "FARB" mongers! Do it right. There is an historical context where an Asian can dress in a "Nazi" uniform, but not as a rank and file SS soldier. I have seen several photos of Japanese leaison officers attached to the Whermacht. Try researching and producing that as an impression. It would be a favor to the rest of us.
Unki Hans

[Mak Los Mien Schnitzel]

Oh my god,

I'm Chinese and that was real , real scary to ME. Someone please tell me I don't look that bad in MY pictures

[J. Penn]

I'm not as bothered by these pictures as many of you are. I have a problem with some of your reactions, though.

These guys have an interest in the German WW2 military. And they wear the uniforms and gear so they can have an idea of what it was like for the fighting force they admire.

Should they not be allowed to do this because of their race???

Calling them "farbs" because their faces aren't European isn't fair at all. A race can't be changed like an item of clothing. Criticising them for their inaccuracies is fair but criticising them for their race really is not!

[Mak Los Mien Schnitzel]

Mr Penn,

I am chinese and my impression is a Thai Soldaten attached to the 29th Panzer Grenadier Division. Later transferred to 352nd Inf Regiment in defence of Normandy. You can't get more wierd than that.

Before I am taken the wrong way,

1) I am referring to the 4 guys in SS uniforms. I don't know if I speak for the others, but of course it is farby! Algermaine SS officers were the epitomy of the political superior race policy, no way a Japanese would have been allowed to wear that uniform, waffen SS, yes, there were many foreign voulinteers!

2) I am not saying that they should not be allowed to wear what they want. This is a free world, but as I have learned on many occasions, people have a right to also say, hey, that's not historically correct... "it's farby" for short.

I might look strange in a Wehrmacht tunic but at least I have an historical basis in which to do so. There were scores of asians defending the shores of normandy from the allied landings. I'm not so bothered about the Japanese re-enacting pics (even though some look a bit ... err... broad, to be waffen SS )

As for the race card...Why, for instance don't they get Denzel Washington to do Roosevelt in "Pearl Harbour", because it's inaccurate, and race has everything to do with it. Why don't they get Meg Ryan to be Winston Churchill? Because, she may be able to act her socks off but...shes the wrong sex. Would you be bothered seeing Jet li as Patton, even in a reenactment, of course you would!

Being racist per-sey, does not even come into the issue, how could I be?

Oh, by the way, to those Japanese guys again, I think anyone who dresses like Himler has more than just an "interest in German WW2 military" its getting a bit political don't you think?

[J. Penn]

Oh, by the way, to those Japanese guys again, I think anyone who dresses like Himler has more than just an "interest in German WW2 military" its getting a bit political don't you think?

Yes it is, and I suppose the visual impression will never be perfect, Japanese in allgemeine uniforms could never look as the actual individuals did. That inaccuracy may be described as "farb" but the word and its usage is a put-down, and I consider it unfair to use for reasons of someone's race since they can't help the fact.

I find something enheartening about people from a radically different culture emulating another from an entire world away, even if it is also connected to a set of political beliefs I don't agree with. While it wouldn't make any sense at all in a movie or live reenactment performance, I say more power to 'em.

[Unki Hans]

Hey Guys,
Let me weigh in on the race aspect of the hobby. This hobby is all about the ACCURATE visual and functional portrayal of this period in history. I am all for an "all inclusive" policy of participation, as anyone with an interest in the subject matter should be able to find a spot to do his or her "thing" in the hobby.
Where the lines that are drawn, and they must exist, should be predicated upon Historical and Visual accuracy! No one seems to mind that a given item of German insignia is reproduced in Japan, as long as it looks just like the original. We discriminate here based upon the visual quality. By the same token we must require the same standard of the human participants. Hobby wide there are standards of authenticity to be met and, as in the case of the Japanese SS guys, that standard was trashed. They failed to achive an acceptable level of authenticity. That is a flat out fact. This does not mean that they should be banned from participating. Only that they should self restrict their personal impressions to what they can pull off under the accuracy requirements. If one can document that there were Asians of any nationality, serving in the German forces, let them go for it. But you just can't "make it up" based upon ones personal desires. That does a diservice to every reenactor who is busting their backs, and wallets to get it right.
Sure FARB is a disparaging term, and rightly so. When I use it, I make certain that it is deserved. With application of the term one can hope that the "social" preasure from ones peers will result in modifyed behavior and a "raising of the bar" for the individual. For years the reenacting community has cut as much slack as it could to participants without compromising authenticity standards. Women freely participate in combatant rolls, providing they can cammo. their feminine aspects and put on a "butch" look. I am good with this, but not every one can pull it off and meet the standard. For these individuals, they must find another aspect of the hobby to put their efforts into. This is not an unreasonable requirement.
So as the "Peace Nazis" say... "You kids play nice or we'll burn your freaking huts down!" I hope to hear more from you all on this subject. Have a good one!
Unki Hans

[Ebusitanus]

Amen to that Hans.
The problem about the reenactment hobby is that its own nature goes against farbiness. This is not a stamp collector club, this is trying to look "right", from the haircut to the correct heel irons of your jackboots.
I agree also on Mak´s view on how to portray something with a bit of research. There is plenty of room for that and individual and group cases to be found. No need to look "silly".
Most of us wanting to do reenactment do actually put a great weight on the visually correct apearance of our peers and it would certainly hurt my eyes to see a black Rommel or white Zulu warriors. Why do we have always to go on the "race" thing is beyond me...Like that implies we hate other races or such crap.

[Siegfried Wilhelm]

Believe it or not, I've always had a hankering to reenact Japanese for many years...Lt. Hiroo Onoda is a hero of mine, but I've kept that urge way in the backround as I know it would be rather silly as I am 6'2" and pretty noticably white. My buddies kid me when I mention it, calling me "Sumo Jap". So I know that, as much as I may think about it--can't do it, even though there was in fact some pretty big Japanese soldiers--but rare.
However; as for folks stretching things a bit in order to 'live your dreams', I would ask what about those who have some physical defects--missing an arm let's say. I'd imagine it would be time to do an officer or something. And how about guys like me who, while still quite physically fit, I am pushing those years pretty hard--no way I could pass for a Landser...officer time for me too. So in order to do that I make sure I am proficient in those things that an officer should know like map reading, protocol, tactics, commo proceedure and all the rest. And make sure I have a nice officer quality uniform and bearing. I do not want to spoil anyone's 'time-trip'. I might as an antique combat soldier.
But I would think if everyone around agrees that an 'inappropriate' impression is OK (i.e. all participants were the worng race), then what the hell? I've had a great time fighting Indians in the 18th and 19th centuries who, for the most part, were as white as I am.
I would be much more concerned about real farbness that can be helped than I would about things that cannot. In other words I would much rather reenact with some kick-ass authentic Japanese or black SS than I would some of the total jerks I see that are 'racially pure'...and that's about all.
What's in the head is more important than a lot of other things.

SW~

[Unki Hans]

I can't help but agree with Siegfried on all of his points as presented. Let me delineate here. One must ask him or her self, if the reenacting situation warents the highest levels of authenticity. I would choose to employ the higest levels in any situation where the public is present, so as not to deminish the value of the presentation to others. At the other end of the spectrum, if the reenacting situation is closed to the public and it is an "informal" tactical, or a training event, one should be able to cut a bunch of slack. There is room enough in the realm of this hobby to include oppertunity for anyone to suit up and feel the experience of the chosen perspective. Siegfried, if you want to do Japanesse, good on you! I know a guy in my own area that has formed his own Jap Infantry unit. They do a good job being historically accurate. Most of them are white guys who admire the Japaneese soldier. I am all for them, and they know what is the appropriate occasion for presentation of this impression. They simply exercise good judgement and consideration when choosing to do it.
As for people with disbilities. The 11th. Pz. out of Chicago has a member who lost both of his legs in an industrial accident. He used his insurance money to get kitted out to reenact. He walks around the living history encampment on his prostetics talking to the public, then you should see their faces when he gets evaced from the public battles with two bloody stumps! What a wonderfully creative way to use his "disability" to an advantage. It really surprises the public, scares the snot out of them. The point is that he does everything he is capable of , and does it well with out compromising authenticity.
Now to the old guys. As one moves through time, ya just can't help getting old! The only way around it in reenacting is to redefine your impression as this occurs. If you start the hobby in your 20's and you are fit. Front line impressions are cool. No problem pulling them off. If you are in your 50's High rank rear echalon, or support troops is a better choice. Just use your common sense and let the historical facts be your guiding standard.
Thats all for now, every one take care and have a great holiday.
Unki Hans.