spys who helped the allies win the war

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waffen
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spys who helped the allies win the war

Post by waffen » 25 Nov 2002 07:43

during the war how much is now known of men and women in favour,or close too,leading members of reich,who were spys,i have been told,the reich bank who did all of the ss banking was sold out by himmlers freind,the head of this bank gave the us airforce vital fuel dump targets.

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Post by Mark V » 25 Nov 2002 18:00

Most famous was ofcourse Sorge, but i think the most important was the source of information for Rudolf Roessler "Lucy" inside the OKW.

There is speculation was that source which is called "Werther" really just one man or a spy ring. He had access to such wide variety of extremely critical information that there has been doubts, could one man gather all that information. If he was one man he was IMHO without a doubt the most important spy during WW2. And his identity is still a mystery !! Maybe because there is some speculations did even Soviets know who he was ?? I have heard some very vague claims that it was some cavalry major ??

Roessler did mention also other agents from which he got information: Teddy, Anna, and Olga.

As an example IIRC "Werther" did reveal the German attack plan for 1942 summer offensive in very high detail.

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Daniel L
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Post by Daniel L » 25 Nov 2002 18:11

Yes, Rössler was important. Can anyone remember that butler or whatever he was down in the middle east?

regards

coldam
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Post by coldam » 25 Nov 2002 19:22

hi,
the valet of the British Ambassador to Turkey,
was a spy for the Reich.
Elyeza Bazna, codename 'Cicero'.
The Germans paid for his
genuine
very valuable information
with
counterfeit
Pound-Sterling bills

...peter

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Richard Murphy
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Post by Richard Murphy » 25 Nov 2002 20:05

Some time ago, browsing through my local second hand book shop, I cam across a book by a fellow named Sandor Rado called "Codename Dora", I casually flicked through it and noticed familiar names; "Lucy" "Werther" etc! Looking a little closer, I find Rado to have been head of the spy ring that "Lucy" (Rudolf Roessler) reported to! Here is what he has to say on the "Werther" business;

"The infomation Lucy passed on to us reached him from a variety of government departments in Germany. To help Central keep track of where the information came from I gave these sources suitably allusive codenames.
"Werther", for example, was the Oberkommando der Wehrmacht or German army high command*-to spike all speculations to the effect that the name referred to a particular officer of the German general staff whose doctoral thesis had been on Goethe's great work, The Sufferings of Young Werther. Wilhelm von Schramm's statement that "Werther was an invention of Roessler's is likewise without foundation.

Source "Codename Dora" Abelard-Shulman Ltd, 1977

So "Werther" was not a single man, but simply the code for any infomation that came out of OKH (Similar names were used for OKL, the Foreign Office etc.). Bormann was not directly involved in military decisions, and the infomation Lucy/Rado supplied was far too detailed to have been available to the latter day party chief. It seems to me far more likely that the sources were numerous clerks/cleaners/secretaries etc either willingly or through negligence.

*Rado is actually refering to OKH, as is made clear later in the text.

Regards from the Park,

Rich

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Daniel L
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Post by Daniel L » 25 Nov 2002 20:27

Thanks coldam!

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Post by Mark V » 26 Nov 2002 16:57

>>> So "Werther" was not a single man, but simply the code for any infomation that came out of OKH

Richard Murphy,

I guess i have to accept that just by looking where you live... :P Or is there several of them ??

Well, at least until more information comes around.

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Matt Gibbs
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Erikkson

Post by Matt Gibbs » 26 Nov 2002 22:14

How about the Swede who worked on behalf of the allies bringing back info on the german oil production etc. I have read a book about him called The Counterfiet Traitor, long out of print no doubt. He fed back info that helped the strategic bombing of the oil producing areas and visited many of the plants to broker deals to buy oil.
I will post some more info if there is an interest...

Regards

Matt Gibbs

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Post by Mark V » 26 Nov 2002 22:54

On the German side we should not forget Simon Koedel.

He was very special because he did spy on behalf of Abwehr in the United States during both world wars (during WW1 also in Britain). He was sleeper in the US between wars and was activated in 30s to continue his work - and he was again very successfull. Especially his information about maritime transportation was very valuable to Kriegsmarine.

A real career spy.

But this is off-topic... :D

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Matt Gibbs
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Another

Post by Matt Gibbs » 28 Nov 2002 09:23

Another european who worked in occupied terretory was Olaf Olksen who wrote a book about his experiences. He operated a network and a radio station sending convoy shipping data to the allies.
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Matt Gibbs

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Walter Schellenberg
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Post by Walter Schellenberg » 28 Nov 2002 10:28

A-54, Alias Paul Thummel, was an Abwehr officer, who was highly suspectedby Heydrich and the SD to pass extremely sensitive military information to the enemy, specially the Czech resistence.
It is not without defficulty that Heydrich managed to arrest him (a record 4 times), and had to release him every time because he was aclose frined of Himmler and Bormann.

But Heydirch had no doubts: Paul Thummel was the man who informed the Allies and the Czech so well about military infomration.

So he arrested him once again, later on, and despactched him to a concentration camp, despite Himmler's protests.

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Re: spys who helped the allies win the war

Post by Linkagain » 29 Oct 2021 22:44

In Erick Erickson author of "The Counterfeit traitor" he makes several claims:
1) That one of his spy contacts was a young german woman who was later executed by firing Squad by the SS...and that a witness was Heibrich HImmler...[Yet the only documented time of Himmler seeing a actual execution was 100 Jews killed near Minsk by Paul Blobel SS Formation]
2) Theat erickson was forced to flee Germany when he was forced tokill a competier who was about to denounce him to the Gestapo {In the movie version of the book Erickson is denounced by a member of the Hitler YOuth to a gestapo agent..whom Erickson knocks out before escaping...]

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