Images of Paris under occupation

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Vikki
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Vikki » 01 Jun 2014 07:36

Loïc wrote:a Auvergnat is someone from Auvergne like La Fayette but also, seen from Paris, the archetype of the poor provincial peasant of France, all the opposite of the Parisian like a farmer of Oklahoma or the from Dakotas for a New Yorker if you want, it is a double derision
Webdragon2013 wrote:Correct me if Im wrong, but the Germans had absolutely nothing to do with this anti-Semitic measure.
This was purely a measure by the conservative French State, which seeked to identify all undesirables (Non-whites, communists, and Jews), and which they did on their own accord.
were are in the northern occupied zone in june 1942 so the Germans had absolutely everything to do with it, the yellow star wasn't at all introduced in the southern free zone
Webdragon2013 wrote:This is why I also thought that the yellow star IN FRANCE was a French state affair, considering the antisemitism of the Maurras ideology and of the revolution nationale.

For example the statute on Jews was a purely French thing, which the state did without German sponsoring.
And this was in all free territories and colonies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statutes_on_Jews

Loïc,

I think that Webdragon2013 may be referring to the French government ordering Jews to wear the yellow star -- in the Zone Occupée -- even before the Germans demanded it. This is true, isn't it?

~Vikki

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Maxschnauzer
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 21 Jun 2014 07:14

To commemorate the 74th anniversary of the fall of Paris this week two photos by Robert Doisneau:
Robert Doisneau – Marching band, occupied Paris, 1940s.jpg
Robert Doisneau – Queue in occupied Paris.jpg
Source http://3.bp.blogspot.com/
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Max

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Loïc
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Loïc » 21 Jun 2014 12:56

no sorry Vikki, just the opposite : as the Northern occupied zone was under german direct rule and the southern "free" zone was controled by Pétain's regime under indirect german rule, so that is why the yellow star introduced by a german "ordinance" (the 8th) you can see it here in the northern occupied zone and not in the southern zone, and even after november 1942 when the germans invaded and occupied it

the yellow star ordered by Pétain in the northern occupied zone directly controled by german authorities and not in his own free zone would be historically illogical : this kind of measure coming from his regime would be enforced first of all for the southern free zone, for both zones after german agreement but not at all especially and only for the northern occupied zone(s)

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Loïc

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Maxschnauzer
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 26 Jun 2014 03:30

Canine Power: A milk vendor with her dog powered cart.
dog cart.jpg
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 26 Jun 2014 07:06

Loïc wrote:no sorry Vikki, just the opposite : as the Northern occupied zone was under german direct rule and the southern "free" zone was controled by Pétain's regime under indirect german rule, so that is why the yellow star introduced by a german "ordinance" (the 8th) you can see it here in the northern occupied zone and not in the southern zone, and even after november 1942 when the germans invaded and occupied it

the yellow star ordered by Pétain in the northern occupied zone directly controled by german authorities and not in his own free zone would be historically illogical : this kind of measure coming from his regime would be enforced first of all for the southern free zone, for both zones after german agreement but not at all especially and only for the northern occupied zone(s)

Regards
Loïc
Loïc,
Your commentary on the different situation of the Jews in the occupied territory as opposed to the Vichy regime is quite informative. Were Jews obligated to register in the southern zone as they were as shown here in Paris, even without the yellow star being required?
7391021_f520.jpg
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Max

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Maxschnauzer
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 02 Aug 2014 11:37

Nice photo of a Brasserie for German soldiers:
Source: eBay
Brasserie.JPG
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 09 Aug 2014 11:55

Place de la Concorde:
$_57 (1).JPG
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Prosper Vandenbroucke
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Prosper Vandenbroucke » 09 Aug 2014 23:00

Maxschnauzer wrote: Canine Power: A milk vendor with her dog powered cart.
dog cart.jpg
I don't think that this picture shows a street in Paris.
Tramways or trolley's doesn't exist anymore in Paris since 1937:
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=58248
A guess it's a Belgian city (Brussels, Antwerp, Ghent............) or an other city in France but not a street in Paris.
Kindly regards
Prosper

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Max
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Max » 10 Aug 2014 07:41

Prosper Vandenbroucke wrote:
Maxschnauzer wrote: Canine Power: A milk vendor with her dog powered cart.
dog cart.jpg
I don't think that this picture shows a street in Paris.
Tramways or trolley's doesn't exist anymore in Paris since 1937:
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=58248
A guess it's a Belgian city (Brussels, Antwerp, Ghent............) or an other city in France but not a street in Paris.
Kindly regards
Prosper
I thought that perhaps what we see is not a tramcar but is a Municipal bus from the Paris Transport Authority (RATP) which look very similar at the back end. [see pics]
But, on closer inspection I think you are correct.
I see some of the overhead pantograph and the tram rails behind the woman Image
Image
Image
http://austinhealy.hubpages.com/hub/Lif ... art-2-1941#

You will find similar Belgian trams here
http://www.mikesbuspages.com/europeansystems.htm
Greetings from the Wide Brown.

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Maxschnauzer
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 10 Aug 2014 10:45

Hello Prosper and Max,
You may be right. I have seen pics from this source mis-identified before but usually in regards to the date. There are definitely trolley rails there. THanks for your comments.
Cheers,
Max

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Annelie
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Annelie » 10 Aug 2014 13:10

Tramways or trolley's doesn't exist anymore in Paris since 1937:
would it be possible that even though the tramways or trolley aren't used anymore after 1937
that the tracks were still there?

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Prosper Vandenbroucke
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Prosper Vandenbroucke » 10 Aug 2014 19:12

Annelie wrote:
Tramways or trolley's doesn't exist anymore in Paris since 1937:
would it be possible that even though the tramways or trolley aren't used anymore after 1937
that the tracks were still there?
Yes of course, but on this picture you can see a tramcar in the background.
It look's to me that it is an typical Brussels tramcar but I am not sure at all. I can not decifer the numberplate of the tramcar, neither the inscriptions on the windows on the other side of the street.
Sorry for my poor english
Kindly regards
Prosper

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Maxschnauzer
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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 11 Aug 2014 00:17

I was hoping the number plate of the Mercedes 170 might provide a clue. The first letter appears to be a Z which would indicate Zivilverwaltung i.e. Civil Administration. Unfornunately the second character looks like neither a B nor an F for either Zivilverwaltung Belgien und Nordfrankreich (ZB) or Zivilverwaltung in Frankreich (ZF). So no joy there. :(
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Max

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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Bill Murray » 11 Aug 2014 00:50

HI Max:

I cannot comment to the Paris photo vis a vis tram or is it Belgium or some other country, but regarding the post regarding the ambulance in Place de Concord, I believe the truck is a 1936 Ford, country of origin not known just yet.

Bill

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Re: Images of Paris under occupation

Post by Maxschnauzer » 11 Aug 2014 02:05

Bill Murray wrote:HI Max:

I cannot comment to the Paris photo vis a vis tram or is it Belgium or some other country, but regarding the post regarding the ambulance in Place de Concord, I believe the truck is a 1936 Ford, country of origin not known just yet.

Bill
Thank you, Bill. Personally I can'ttell the differencebetween the '36 American and '37 German Ford V-8 trucks!
Cheers,
Max

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