Crime rate in the Reich

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Lagami
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Crime rate in the Reich

#1

Post by Lagami » 11 Feb 2016, 23:15

Hey,

are there any documentations about the crime rate during the third reich? For some reason I can not find any documentation about it.
But I have heard that it was 100% safe to walk the streets of the third reich during nighttime. Unfortunately couldn't find any reliable source on someone saying that either though.

Did people stop commiting crime out of fear of being "deported" together with the Jews?

Futurist
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#2

Post by Futurist » 12 Feb 2016, 00:26

I have some crime data for 1880s Germany, but I am unsure as to whether or not you are interested in this data. (Also, though, I unfortunately don't have crime data for the Third Reich. :()


Lagami
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#3

Post by Lagami » 12 Feb 2016, 01:39

Futurist wrote:I have some crime data for 1880s Germany, but I am unsure as to whether or not you are interested in this data. (Also, though, I unfortunately don't have crime data for the Third Reich. :()
1880 is way too early unfortunately, but thanks for the offer!

Right before Hitlers reign and during Hitlers reign is what is in my interest.
Obviously to compare these and see if Hitlers politics did in fact decrease Germanys crime rate.

GregSingh
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#4

Post by GregSingh » 12 Feb 2016, 07:04

Lagami wrote: But I have heard that it was 100% safe to walk the streets of the third reich during nighttime.
Not during blackouts! :D
There was significant jump in numbers of personal injuries and car accidents at night in larger towns when blackouts were introduced!

Now seriously here are numbers for you.
Germany Crime stats.jpg
Germany's Crime stats 1900-1940

Lagami
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#5

Post by Lagami » 12 Feb 2016, 07:13

Thanks a lot @GregSnigh! :D

So there actually was a somewhat significant reduction of crime rates only one year after Hitler came to power.
And also there was a another big reduction from 1938 on. How is the reduction in 1938-1940 explained? The war started there. Did the crime rate decrease because people had to go to war and the main "population" of people who were actually in Germany and not on the front lines did decrease? Then it would be obvious since the crime rate will obviously be reduced if the population does also decrease.

Also, do you have any information on where this document comes from?

Knouterer
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#6

Post by Knouterer » 12 Feb 2016, 10:54

Of course, the many crimes committed by the regime itself, such as killing off the mentally handicapped, just to mention one thing, do not appear in the statistics.

At the same time, the Nazis introduced new "crimes" such as "Rassenschande" (sexual intercourse between Aryans and Jews or other inferior species) which were not crimes before, making statistical comparisons rather meaningless I would say.
"The true spirit of conversation consists in building on another man's observation, not overturning it." Edward George Bulwer-Lytton

Knouterer
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#7

Post by Knouterer » 12 Feb 2016, 11:03

Lagami wrote:But I have heard that it was 100% safe to walk the streets of the third reich during nighttime.
Unless the SA, or perhaps the Hitler Youth, had some reason to dislike you. Some people also never tire of saying that in Mussolini's Italy "the trains ran on time".
"The true spirit of conversation consists in building on another man's observation, not overturning it." Edward George Bulwer-Lytton

Knouterer
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#8

Post by Knouterer » 12 Feb 2016, 11:06

Lagami wrote:So there actually was a somewhat significant reduction of crime rates only one year after Hitler came to power.
How many people do you think were beaten up in the streets, and thrown into concentration camps, without any judicial process, and without any of it appearing in the statistics, in the year after Hitler came to power?
"The true spirit of conversation consists in building on another man's observation, not overturning it." Edward George Bulwer-Lytton

Futurist
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#9

Post by Futurist » 12 Feb 2016, 11:13

Knouterer wrote:
Lagami wrote:So there actually was a somewhat significant reduction of crime rates only one year after Hitler came to power.
How many people do you think were beaten up in the streets, and thrown into concentration camps, without any judicial process, and without any of it appearing in the statistics, in the year after Hitler came to power?
Wouldn't that have been legal and thus wouldn't considered crime in Nazi Germany, though?

GregSingh
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#10

Post by GregSingh » 13 Feb 2016, 05:09

Lagami wrote:Also, do you have any information on where this document comes from?
Statistisches Handbuch von Deutschland 1928 - 1944

Lagami
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#11

Post by Lagami » 13 Feb 2016, 22:42

Knouterer wrote:
Lagami wrote:So there actually was a somewhat significant reduction of crime rates only one year after Hitler came to power.
How many people do you think were beaten up in the streets, and thrown into concentration camps, without any judicial process, and without any of it appearing in the statistics, in the year after Hitler came to power?
Of course that happened. But I am looking at the "casual crimes", crimes that did not happen out of political motivation. These were crimes that did not happen before or after Hitlers time (at least not in such a great scale) so in my opinion you can't include these when comparing the crime rate to other time eras.
If you exclude these it indeed seems like Hitler got people to think twice about commiting a crime.

I guess that's just because they did fear the consequences of commiting a crime though. Fear of being sent to a concentration camp etc.
On the other hand it also could be because of the sense of unity Hitler created in Germany though.

James A Pratt III
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#12

Post by James A Pratt III » 13 Feb 2016, 23:35

I have read that regular crime went up in Germany as the war went on.

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Sheldrake
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#13

Post by Sheldrake » 14 Feb 2016, 03:28

Lagami wrote:Hey,

are there any documentations about the crime rate during the third reich? For some reason I can not find any documentation about it.
But I have heard that it was 100% safe to walk the streets of the third reich during nighttime. Unfortunately couldn't find any reliable source on someone saying that either though.

Did people stop commiting crime out of fear of being "deported" together with the Jews?
There are some good reasons why it is hard to find statistics on crime in Nazi Germany.

That is what happens when the criminals take charge. Hitler, a convicted criminal, seized power supported by SA thugs and proceeds to change the law to give himself total power. The SS murdered the leadership of the SA and it was open season on religious minorities and any political opposition.

When murder, theft and arson are state sponsored, how do you define criminal behaviour?

GregSingh
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#14

Post by GregSingh » 14 Feb 2016, 05:51

That's why there are no reliable data for war years, beyond 1940.

In a totalitarian state (does not apply only to Nazi Germany of course) most crimes perpetrated by the regime and it's sympathizers are not considered to be crimes and are not reported, any activity against a state is considered to be "criminal".

Apart from "political crimes" these categories increased significantly during war years in Germany - desertion and looting.

GregSingh
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Re: Crime rate in the Reich

#15

Post by GregSingh » 14 Jan 2017, 03:38

Quite unique crime statistics from a police report called Polizeiliche Kriminalstatistik für das 2.Vierteljahr 1944 sent from Dr.Kalterbrunner to Reichsmarschall Göring dated 18th of December 1944. It compares 1943 to first half of 1944, with detailed numbers for 2nd quarters of 1943 and 1944.

Here are the numbers for homicides and infanticides.
homicides-infanticides.jpg
Homicides and infanticides 1943-44
Detailed numbers for each Kriminalpolizeileitstelle (24 of them) are quite interesting.

For 2nd quarter of 1943, top 5 for homicides were:
Kattowitz - 54
Berlin - 42
Posen - 32
München - 30
Königsberg - 27

For 2nd quarter of 1944, top 5 for homicides were:
Kattowitz - 79
Königsberg - 58
Danzig - 49
Wien - 42
Berlin - 35

There was significant jump of homicides in 17 Kriminalpolizeileitstellen, lower numbers were noted in 7 of them.

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