Are there any estimates for how popular the Anschluss was in Austria

[BarKokhba]

After the Anschluss, Jews, Roma (Gypsies) and the 70,000 Austrians arrested and imprisoned or deported by the Nazis could not vote in Hitler's plebiscite, but- if it had been held, could Jews have voted in Schuchnigg's referendum or were they banned? Facts only here, not weird opinions, please.

[michael mills]

All Austrian citizens over 24 were eligible to vote in Schuschnigg's proposed referendum, so Jews were not banned as such.

In addition, members of Schuschnigg's party aged under 24 were also eligible to vote.

It is estimated that some 400,000 Austrian citizens of voting age were excluded from voting in the post-Anschluss referendum held under provisional German rule. That included all Jewish voters, probably up to 150,000 persons, plus members of the Communist and Social Democratic Parties.

[BarKokhba]

Thank you Michael. I couldn't find that info anywhere.

[ljadw]

All Austrian citizens over 24 were eligible to vote in Schuschnigg's proposed referendum, so Jews were not banned as such.

In addition, members of Schuschnigg's party aged under 24 were also eligible to vote.

It is estimated that some 400,000 Austrian citizens of voting age were excluded from voting in the post-Anschluss referendum held under provisional German rule. That included all Jewish voters, probably up to 150,000 persons, plus members of the Communist and Social Democratic Parties.

Hm : as these parties were forbidden by the Schusnigg regime, how could the nazis know who were the members of these parties ?

Other point is that the number of Jews (children included) was less than 170000, thus 150000 Jewish voters was to high . And even if there were 150000 Jewish voters, 250000 members of the Socialist and Communist parties is also to high .

And, renner exhorted the socialists to vote yes in the referendum, that would indicate that the socialists could vote .

[michael mills]

Other point is that the number of Jews (children included) was less than 170000, thus 150000 Jewish voters was to high

I thought there were 200,000 Jews in Austria, that is why I guesstimated 150,000 Jewish voters, 75% of the total, to exclude children and teenagers.

And, Renner exhorted the socialists to vote yes in the referendum, that would indicate that the socialists could vote .

Perhaps he was urging persons who had voted for the Social Democratic Party in the last elections to vote in favour of Anschluss. The number of persons who usually voted for the Social Democratic Party would have been many times higher than the number of Party members, perhaps well over one million.

Schuschnigg had re-legalised the Social Democratic Party before his proposed referendum, so it is possible that lists of Party members existed.

[ljadw]

The 200000 ( maybe including non Austrian jews ) is probably a later nazi figure,including 1/2 and 1/4 Jews (mischlinge ) for which there were no figures at the moment of the plebiscit.

"Das austrofaschistische Herrschaftssystem" gives on P 471 the following numbers for Austrian Jews :

1923 : 201000

1934 : 191000 +

1938 :>17000 of whom 91 % in Vienna .

[michael mills]

I must have been thinking of the 1923 figure.

[Sarge3525]

The popular opinion these days is that Austria was a willing nazi collaborator. It's what I also believed.
However historical records show a much more nuanced picture. The Nazis really were known for creating much theatre to enhance the propaganda effect of whatever they were doing. In all things: For example they put good looking troops first in parades, so that photos would create an appearance of great looking troops. For VIP guarding (IE: Berghof), they also selected most good looking SS to impress guests and for picture purposes.

Anyhow, the propaganda, pictures, etc...Show a jubilant population.
The referendum shows 99.7% approval, similar to another nazi election (1933 federal election). The facts show that there was massive pressure at the vote booths by nazis. For example there was no anonymity. And in remote villages where Nazi officials were not present, the voting was much more shared between approve/disapprove, with some outright disapproving.

So what is the conclusion? I think the reality is probably 50/50 population approved/disapproved of Anschluss, mostly depending on national affiliation. If you read Mein Kampf and other German historical writing, you would know that Austria at that time was very split nation, with much of border and rural villages considering themselves German, and in the East people considering themselves more eastern or just Austrian, reflecting ethnic distribution of Austria.

But Nazis probably tipped the polling in their favor with massive indirect pressure (oppressive polling booth athmosphere, etc).
But I would say, majority of Austria at this time (apart from Vienna) considers themselves German, just 50% probably want to stay independent.

Also to consider is that the German Army had invaded and occupied the country whilst they were having the referendum. So in the mind of Austrians, they surely have in mind, that if they vote NO on the referendum, then what? Hitler will peacefully leave? Its quite clear Austria becomes a "protectorate" like Czechoslovakia, with a nice Gauleiter like Heydrich running things for them. I think many Austrians voted common sense for the situation aswell. Austria was bullied...No better way to make a people vote than under the gun.

Also notable is the behaviour of Austrians after the war. Already in 1945, with the war going on, there were independence movement growing. In Vienna some Nazi officials fled hunted by citizens. This shows that there was nowhere near as much adherence to being a Reich citizen than people believe.

[michael mills]

Immediately after the First World War, when the Habsburg Empire had collapsed, a clear majority of ethnic Germans living in Bohemia and the Austrian provinces wanted to join Germany, but were prevented from doing so under the treaties imposed by the victorious Allies.

Furthermore, Austria was badly hit by the Great Depression and throughout the 1930s remained in a very bad economic state with high unemployment, compared with Germany which had recovered and basically achieved full employment. Thus, there was a lot of incentive for most Austrians to support unification with Germany.

To be sure, Germany was now a dictatorship, but Austria was also had a dictatorial Government established by Dollfuss, which had brutally suppressed a Socialist uprising. If Austrians were going to live under a dictatorship, they might as well join Germany, which would fulfil their post-war aim.

The unification with Germany was opposed mainly by the surviving elements of the Socialist Left and by extreme clerical elements. There is no reason to believe that unification was not supported by a majority of the Austrian population, even if not 90%. The actions of Austrians in 1945 are not indicative of the popular mood in 1938, since in 1945 the Reich was a sinking ship, so it is no wonder that many Austrians wanted to jump overboard in order to save themselves. That attitude was supported by the Allied proclamation that Austria would be treated as the first victim of German aggression, and not as part of Germany.

[pugsville]

IThere is no reason to believe that unification was not supported by a majority of the Austrian population, even if not 90%. .

90% based on what? there also NO reason to put the figure at 90%.

[Knouterer]

The ballot paper itself suggested a preferred outcome, with a big circle in the middle for "Yes" and a much smaller one off to one side for "No". Just in case anyone was still confused, the official propaganda - more like official instructions - told people: "HERE is where you put the cross".

Reportedly, many people showed their marked ballots to Nazi officials standing by the voting booths before handing them in, so they could not be suspected of voting the "wrong" way.

A free and fair election looks different, I would say. Under the circumstances, the referendum outcome, by itself, tells us precisely nothing about what the majority really wanted.

[Sid Guttridge]

Austrian public opinion was changeable. Immediately after the disaster of WWI a clear majority probably wanted union with Germany. However, during the 1920s self confidence began to return.

When the Austria Nazis asassinated the state President in 1934 their attempted coup achieved little traction over most of the country and was quickly suppressed.

By 1938 Germany was again putting pressure on Austria so the state president called for a plebiscite to establish the settled will of the population regarding union with Germany once and for all. However, it was phrased in such a way that it was likely to result in a popular assertion of Austrian independence.

Hitler therefore invaded to prevent it taking place and then promptly called his own plebiscite, which was worded in such a way as to make a pro-Anschluss vote likely. However, to make absolutely sure, the ballot paper was rigged (see previous post by Knouterer), the process was under close Nazi supervision and most ballot papers were not marked in secret.

One has to ask why, if Austrian public opinion was so decidely in favour of Anschluss in 1938, did the Nazis go to such extreme meassures to ensure the "right" result?

For what it is worth, I supect the Austrian public would have voted for Anschluss anyway in 1938. However, it would not have been as dramatically pro-union as the earlier League of Nations-sponsored Saarland plebiscite, which, I think, gained 90% approval for return to Germany. The Nazis therefore had to rig the Austrian Anschluss so that it was of a higher order of magnitude.

Incidentally, they rigged the Sudeten plebiscite in exactly the same ways later in the year, probably for much the same reason - prestige demanded that it had to be even more spectacularly pro-union than its predecessors in Austria and the Saarland. With results approaching 100% and virtually impossible to improve upon, the Nazis did not even bother to conduct plebiscites in other areas later absorbed into the Reich, even where, as in Danzig, a result in their favour was probably a foregone conclusion.

Cheers,

Sid.

[michael mills]

The best indication of the popularity of the unification with Germany is how Austrians acted after it occurred.

In general, Austrians were loyal to Germany throughout the war, except at the very end where it was that Germany was going to be comprehensively defeated. There was no real resistance, even from the large numbers who had previously been supporters of Leftist parties.

Those two factors suggest that the majority of Austrians were satisfied with their status as a part of Germany.

And sometimes a formality such as a referendum is not needed to obtain a reasonably accurate impression of the will of the people. In 1944 the French people were not given the opportunity to vote on whether or not they wished to remain under German occupation, but their preference was fairly clear.

[pugsville]

The best indication of the popularity of the unification with Germany is how Austrians acted after it occurred.

In general, Austrians were loyal to Germany throughout the war, except at the very end where it was that Germany was going to be comprehensively defeated. There was no real resistance, even from the large numbers who had previously been supporters of Leftist parties.

Those two factors suggest that the majority of Austrians were satisfied with their status as a part of Germany.

And sometimes a formality such as a referendum is not needed to obtain a reasonably accurate impression of the will of the people. In 1944 the French people were not given the opportunity to vote on whether or not they wished to remain under German occupation, but their preference was fairly clear.

Really when any action against the Anschluss was likely to have highly probable negative consequences. You don't think that the Brutal mruderous nature of the regime was pretty obvious by than, and many who might have opposed it were somewhat shy about voicing on the entirely reasonable fear that the regime would take swift action?

You are simply assuming something without any evidence what so ever.

[ljadw]

If there were free elections, 95 % of the Austrians would have supported the Anschluss .