Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

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Futurist
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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by Futurist » 11 Nov 2021 02:40

wm wrote:
07 Nov 2021 23:16
They were, that was about imigrants and their naturalization.
BTW, I do think that it was rather regrettable on Imperial Germany's part not to have an easy path to immigration and naturalization for talented immigrants. It could have stripped various other parts of Europe of a lot of their cognitively talented people, after all.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by GregSingh » 11 Nov 2021 04:01

And here we have official numbers of German citizens with mother's language other than German in some areas:

1.jpg

Foreigners living in Germany by their nationality:

2.jpg
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henryk
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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by henryk » 11 Nov 2021 20:59

Re: right two columns. I am guessing these are for the Austrian part of Austro-Hungary (ie excludes Hungary).
Why does it exclude Galicia?

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by Futurist » 11 Nov 2021 23:09

henryk wrote:
11 Nov 2021 20:59
Re: right two columns. I am guessing these are for the Austrian part of Austro-Hungary (ie excludes Hungary).
Why does it exclude Galicia?
How do you know that Galicia is excluded?

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by AliasDavid » 11 Nov 2021 23:24

Futurist wrote:
11 Nov 2021 23:09
henryk wrote:
11 Nov 2021 20:59
Re: right two columns. I am guessing these are for the Austrian part of Austro-Hungary (ie excludes Hungary).
Why does it exclude Galicia?
How do you know that Galicia is excluded?
Both statistics refer to a census whose key date was March 22th, 1934. Footnote ** of the first statistic explicitly states that the territory considered was Austria in the borders of the same date.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by Futurist » 11 Nov 2021 23:36

AliasDavid wrote:
11 Nov 2021 23:24
Futurist wrote:
11 Nov 2021 23:09
henryk wrote:
11 Nov 2021 20:59
Re: right two columns. I am guessing these are for the Austrian part of Austro-Hungary (ie excludes Hungary).
Why does it exclude Galicia?
How do you know that Galicia is excluded?
Both statistics refer to a census whose key date was March 22th, 1934. Footnote ** of the first statistic explicitly states that the territory considered was Austria in the borders of the same date.
OK, but then Galicia wouldn't be the only 1914 Austrian territory being excluded here. Also excluded would be Dalmatia, Slovenia, South Tyrol, Czechia, and Bukovina.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by GregSingh » 12 Nov 2021 05:23

These tables came from early 1939 edition of German statistical yearbook.
They refer to Germany as of mid-1938 (including Austria proper after Anschluss).

Those territories you guys mentioned were not in Germany borders in 1938, so for any details there you have to look at yearbooks of Poland, Czechoslovakia, Yugoslavia, etc.
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George L Gregory
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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by George L Gregory » 12 Nov 2021 09:29

I wonder, were Reich citizens of non-German ancestry allowed to be members of the Hitler Youth before 1939?

The Second Execution Order to the Law on the Hitler Youth ("Youth Service Regulation") (March 25, 1939) stated:
§ 6
German Subjects of Non-German National Origin
(1) Juveniles of German citizenship, whose parents or father belong according to their own statement to the Danish or Polish ethnic groups, are to be exempted from membership in the Hitler Youth on request of those who are charged with their care. If several persons have the right and duty to care for the juvenile person, and not everyone of them makes the request, the juvenile may be exempted from membership in the Hitler Youth on request of those who are charged with their care, if the mother belongs according to her own statement to the Danish or Polish racial groups; they are to be exempted if the guardian agrees to the request.
So already in March 1939 the Nazis were segregating “Germans” and “non-Germans” children who held the same citizenship and therefore the same rights.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by Hans1906 » 12 Nov 2021 11:35

Fittingly, this feature film from 1990 is worth mentioning:

"Hitlerjunge Salomon" / "Europa Europa"

German https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitlerjunge_Salomon
English https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_Europa

Ich war Hitlerjunge Salomon - Sally Perel im Interview / I was Hitler's boy Salomon - Sally Perel in interview

Sally Perel, who was born in Peine in 1925, survived the National Socialist era as a Jew and as a member of the Hitler Youth in a boarding school in Braunschweig. He published his autobiography under the title "Ich war Hitlerjunge Salomon", which was also made into a film. Today, he lives in Israel, but is also in Germany from time to time, where he lectures as a contemporary witness, especially in schools, about his experiences. On the occasion of a visit to Magdeburg in 1998, Bettina Wiengarn talked to him about his life in the studio of Offener Kanal.
Herr Sally Perel https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sally_Perel


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wm
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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by wm » 12 Nov 2021 15:35

So giving minorities a choice is segregation?
Actually, the Polish minority demanded the exclusion from mandatory enrolment in the Hitler Youth and similar organizations - because their main goal was the creation of good Germans and they didn't want to be Germans, even if good.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by George L Gregory » 12 Nov 2021 16:19

wm wrote:
12 Nov 2021 15:35
So giving minorities a choice is segregation?
Actually, the Polish minority demanded the exclusion from mandatory enrolment in the Hitler Youth and similar organizations - because their main goal was the creation of good Germans and they didn't want to be Germans, even if good.
They were hardy given a “choice”.

What is your source that the Polish minority “demanded” to be excluded from the Hitler Youth?

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wm
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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by wm » 12 Nov 2021 19:44

It is from the pre-war right-wing weekly "Prosto z Mostu." They had a huge article about it.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by George L Gregory » 13 Nov 2021 09:02

wm wrote:
12 Nov 2021 19:44
It is from the pre-war right-wing weekly "Prosto z Mostu." They had a huge article about it.
Can you try and get a link?

Thanks.

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by henryk » 13 Nov 2021 22:53

AliasDavid wrote:
11 Nov 2021 23:24
Futurist wrote:
11 Nov 2021 23:09
henryk wrote:
11 Nov 2021 20:59
Re: right two columns. I am guessing these are for the Austrian part of Austro-Hungary (ie excludes Hungary).
Why does it exclude Galicia?
How do you know that Galicia is excluded?
Both statistics refer to a census whose key date was March 22th, 1934. Footnote ** of the first statistic explicitly states that the territory considered was Austria in the borders of the same date.
AliasDavid
Thank you for for your answer to my question.
Henryk

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Re: Polish minority in Germany in the 1930s

Post by George L Gregory » 16 Nov 2021 19:44

Full text of "German Imperial and State Citizenship Law. July 22, 1913":

https://archive.org/stream/jstor-221231 ... 1_djvu.txt

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