Tiger II

Discussions on the vehicles used by the Axis forces. Hosted by Christian Ankerstjerne
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Y Ddraig Goch
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Tiger II

Post by Y Ddraig Goch » 13 Mar 2002 17:09

Just how bad was the Tiger II armour :?: I have heard that its armour was not to the same quality of previous Panzers due to the lack of raw materials.
/ Mike

"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"
Friedrich Nietzsche

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Christian Ankerstjerne
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Post by Christian Ankerstjerne » 13 Mar 2002 17:13

Well, the armour was not nearly as hard as the one used on the Tiger and Panther tanks. Still, the frontal armour was literally impossible to penetrate during the war, unless an extreme amount of medium and high calibre shots were fired at it. One Tiger II has survived almost, if not over, a hundred grenades at various places.

Also see (for other Tiger II stats):
http://www.panzerworld.net/TigerIIcomp.htm

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Y Ddraig Goch
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Thanks

Post by Y Ddraig Goch » 13 Mar 2002 17:50

Tanks alot :wink:
/ Mike

"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"
Friedrich Nietzsche

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Erich
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Tiger 2 armor thickness....

Post by Erich » 13 Mar 2002 18:21

F.P. :

Can you check what armor thickness in mm for the Tiger 2 turret and front glacis plate please ?

I have seen the front of the Tiger plating hit by T-34 85mm's and a 4 inch dent was made but did not pierce through......via photos. so I am wondering if the Tiger could easily take hits like this and survive except at close quarters and only hits from.... say 100m-122mm were suficient to take on the tiger 2 from longer distances.

E

Ovidius
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Tiger II armor

Post by Ovidius » 13 Mar 2002 19:22

1. The 122mm Soviet cannon on the IS-2 was a primarily high-explosive launcher, and had low penetration power.

2. The front armor of the Tiger II/King Tiger had a thickness of about 100mm in the hull, 150mm in the superstructure and about 180mm in the turret faceplate.

Although the captured vehicles had appeared to be made from low-quality steel, and easily penetrated by AP shells from high-velocity guns, there is no evidence whatsoever that the front armor of the giant was ever penetrated in combat.

3. The Tiger II tanks in the twilight of the Reich achieved huge kill ratios - sometimes 30:1 or even 60:1 in encounters with Soviet tanks.

~Regards,

Ovidius

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Erich
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Post by Erich » 13 Mar 2002 19:41

Danke Schön Ovidius !

Yes, I can believe it. Schwere SS Pz Abt. 503 achieved incredible scores in 1945.........400 plus Soviet Panzers and numerous soft skinned vehicles, as one example.

E

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Oleg Grigoryev
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re

Post by Oleg Grigoryev » 13 Mar 2002 20:54

I assume we are talking German claims here. - not the confirmed Soviet loses.

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Oleg Grigoryev
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THE ARMOR PENETRATION CURVES OF THE SOVIET AND ALLIED TANK

Post by Oleg Grigoryev » 13 Mar 2002 20:58


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Erich
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intersting curves

Post by Erich » 13 Mar 2002 21:05

Oleg :

yes, of course claims, did I say confirmed kills ? Like your graph which is very nice. This is for set stationary vehicles correct ?

E

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Oleg Grigoryev
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re

Post by Oleg Grigoryev » 13 Mar 2002 21:16

Thanks for confirming my guess 8) . The reason I asked was that it seems to me that even German command usually divided claims by factor of two.
Yes I believe the data is for stationary vehicles - most likely from Kubinka testing ground.

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Erich
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Too high ?

Post by Erich » 13 Mar 2002 21:23

Oleg :

I have accounts that this was in association of the Stug Abt. of the 11th SS Pz. Gr. Abt as well as the Schw. SS Pz Abt. 503. High ? could very well have been considering the total chaos during the latter part of 1945. Sorry this is not my specialty as most of my interst lies with the Luftwaffe and the Defence of the Reich battles. Even here it is difficult to get a total grasp about the air battles from both sides since you always have two given views that are reported as fact. In this special case; Luftwaffe pilots versus US Heavy bomber crews and US fighter pilots. Getting back to the Ost Front it has to be quite similiar as both German and Soviet forces were taking each side to task and confirmation at first was done individually by the commanders involved, until the battle could be cleared well enough to count the losses.

E

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Christian Ankerstjerne
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Post by Christian Ankerstjerne » 14 Mar 2002 19:03

I believe the frontal armour was 200mm, not 100 as Ovidius wrote...

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Erich
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Post by Erich » 15 Mar 2002 00:33

Ferdinand :

You now have my curious way up, I'll do some digging through my sources.

E

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Takao
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According to Jentz

Post by Takao » 15 Mar 2002 04:35

The Driver's Front Plate(Glacis) armor thickness was 150mm thick and sloped at 50 degrees. The Hull Front Lower armor thickness was 100mm thick and sloped at 50 degrees. Other books I have provide the same information.

"Tigers in Combat II" by Wolfgang Schneider credits Schw. SS Pz Abt. 103/503 with more then 500 tanks destroyed for the loss of 39 Tiger IIs.

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Christian Ankerstjerne
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Post by Christian Ankerstjerne » 15 Mar 2002 22:25

The Driver's Front Plate(Glacis) armor thickness was 150mm thick

You're completely right - I used memory in stead of reference, silly me :)

Still, Ovidius and I made an average of 150 - doesn't that count :lol:

FP

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