Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

Discussions on the vehicles used by the Axis forces. Hosted by Christian Ankerstjerne
YAN
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Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#1

Post by YAN » 06 Feb 2013, 15:37

Hi, the Sd.Kfz 250 & 251 were produced in large numbers 250 (6.600 source Wiki) 251 (15.250 source Wiki), and were made in a number of variants;

Sd.Kfz 250 = 250/1 to 250/12 + Sd.Kfz 252 & 253
Sd.Kfz 251 = 251/1 to 251/23

Did the German Military keep any records of the amount made of each variant?

Yan.

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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#2

Post by NagaSadow » 06 Feb 2013, 17:55

Hello!

AFAIK the sub-variants were only separately reported from 1943 onwards.
Lexikon der Wehrmacht has some numbers:
http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Waf ... rzeuge.htm

Sd.Kfz.252: 54 in 1940, 359 in 1941 = 413 total
Sd.Kfz.253: 85 in 1940, 200 in 1941 = 285 total


YAN
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#3

Post by YAN » 08 Feb 2013, 12:02

Thank you very much Nagasadow, that link is a great help.
Seems strange that only 69 x Sd.Kfz. 250/8 were built, that’s if I have read the totals right, the last column says ‘’balance on the 1/3/45'' so I guess this means the vehicles left in service.

Yan.

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tigre
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#4

Post by tigre » 23 Mar 2016, 01:44

Hello to all :D; a little more....................

The medium armored personnel carrier (mittlerer gepanzerter Mannschaftstransportwagen) Sd. Kfz. 25/1.!

This vehicle was built answering a demand from the German army to have a vehicle personnel carrier with some protection and able to transport a rifle squad (schützen-gruppe) so as to maintain the pace of operations within a armored division (panzer).

Due to problems in obtaining armored plates a serie of 305 vehicles without armor were built first (until December 1939) called (mittlere ungepanzerte Mannschaftstransportwagen) whose plates resisted impacts of bullets of small arms and small artillery shrapnel. Then followed the version A (Ausf. A) which appeared in mid-1939 and whose production was allocated to Schützen-Regiment 1 (SR 1) of the 1. Pz Div. To my knowledge only about 232 vehicles of this series were built.

From June to September 1939 the production amounted to:

Armored 11 (June); 32 (July); 25 (August) and 42 (September) - No armored 4 (June); 64 (July); 26 (August) and 55 (September).

Does anyone have any idea if the SR 1 was equipped with armored vehicles only or a mixture of with/without armor? And the other schützen-regiment (SR2 and SR 3)?

Sources: http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/n ... anomag.php
http://odkrywca.pl/transportery-w-wehrm ... 29495.html

Cheers. Raul M 8-).
Attachments
image020.jpg
A column of Sd Kfz 251/1 Ausf. A (apparently) by the hatches in the rear of the vehicle running in Poland 1939 ...........................
image020.jpg (31.95 KiB) Viewed 5393 times
image022.jpg
Posing for the photo in a Sd Kfz 251/1 Ausf. A (it seems)............................................
image022.jpg (33.46 KiB) Viewed 5393 times

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tigre
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#5

Post by tigre » 28 Nov 2016, 22:27

Hello to all :D; a little more....................

Sd Kfz 251 with platform.

A standard design platform was fitted over the driver compartment to an unknown number of Sd. Kfz. 251 Ausf. A (and I believe Ausf. B too). These modified vehicles were assigned to the Platoon leader and also to senior commanders. In some photos it is observed that the front section of this special superstructure was cut in such a way that the machine gun with its armor could be used without limitation ..................

Sources: http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/Homepage_ ... iants.html
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/or ... 5efee3.jpg

The one in the photo is a Sd Kfz 251 Ausf. B (I think). This special variant is confused with the Sd Kfz 251/18 mittlerer Beobachtungspanzerwagen, but AFAIK this version was produced on the Ausf. D from October 1944. Cheers. Raul M 8-).
Attachments
image017.jpg
A Sd Kfz 251 with platform at the Aiviekste railway station (Latvia) - 1941 ............................................
image017.jpg (33.92 KiB) Viewed 4887 times

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tigre
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#6

Post by tigre » 24 Mar 2017, 00:32

Hello to all :D; a little more....................

Sd Kfz 251 Ausf. C.

The Ausf.C (produced in late 1941) introduced a new flat plate for the nose of the engine, 14.5 mm (0.57 inches) thick, without an access trap. Attention was also given to the engine, with the removal of the cooling hood from the front cowl and the side access traps, replaced by large open ventilation compartments. The storage boxes were moved further back. The rearview mirror was relocated from the driver side view slot to a lower position. The headlamps were now attached directly to the chassis and the bumpers were removed and replaced by the tow hooks. The unit cost was DM 22,560.

Sources: http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/n ... anomag.php
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/ ... age+44.jpg

Cheers. Raul M 8-).
Attachments
image097.png
Various Sd Kfz 251 Ausf. C of the 24. Pz Div during Operation Blue in 1942.............................
image097.png (193.36 KiB) Viewed 4430 times

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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#7

Post by gebhk » 31 Mar 2017, 16:04

Dear Tigre

We were recently discussing the likely numbers of SdKfz 251s in 1st Panzer Division in Poland (my particular interest was 4th September). Little hard data is available.

I understand your production figures are from LDW? Do you know here they got their numbers from?

Best wishes
K

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tigre
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#8

Post by tigre » 02 Apr 2017, 23:16

Hello K :D; thanks for your wishes :wink:..............................

Production statistics Sd. Kfz. 251.

I've got that figures from this table with the monthly production statistics....................

http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/Homepage_ ... stics.html

but I could not find where (or how) they got those numbers.

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).

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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#9

Post by gebhk » 04 Apr 2017, 21:17

Thanks for your prompt response. :thumbsup:
Either LDW copied their data from KfzDW or both copied from another source. Alas, since neither gives any reference, we are no closer to a reliable answer. :roll: However one of these sites (can't remember which!) states unarmoured MTWs were used by SR1 in 1939. The reported ease with which vehicles of SR1 were 'bagged' by 2nd Tank Battalion on 4th September seems to support this thesis......

Best wishes
K

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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#10

Post by verdenpark » 02 Dec 2017, 04:36

Hello,
I am currently kitbashing a model of a 251/1 into a 251/2, but need to know the correct location of the mortar. Does anyone have an overhead photo of one, or know exactly where the mortar was sited?

Regards,
A.
Those who live by the sword...... get shot.

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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#11

Post by SIS 5 » 03 Dec 2017, 12:02

Hi A.,

that´s the only pic I could find. Source of the pic: "SdKfz 251" by Janusz Ledwoch with the subtitle "Możdzierz sGrWr 34 kal. 80 mm w Sd Kfz 251/2 (Tank Museum, Bovington, England).

Regards

Bert
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251-2.gif
251-2.gif (238.68 KiB) Viewed 3479 times

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uncle
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#12

Post by uncle » 03 Dec 2017, 12:47

Hi A.
here drawing.
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01.jpg
01.jpg (39.1 KiB) Viewed 3471 times

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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#13

Post by verdenpark » 04 Dec 2017, 10:29

Hello,
Thankyou Bert for the photo, and to Uncle for the drawing. Both are wonderfully detailed.

Regards,
A.
Those who live by the sword...... get shot.

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tigre
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#14

Post by tigre » 10 Jan 2021, 19:07

Hello to all :D; more...................

Chassis of the vehicle.

The chassis consisted of a pair of front wheels and a rear section of chains (tracks). The front steer axle was suspended by a large, transverse leaf spring. According to some sources, the front wheels were not equipped with brakes at all. So the track part consisted of seven sheet metal scroll wheels with round relief holes on each side. Each wheel consisted of two discs. The odd-numbered wheels had discs on the axle side by side, while the discs of the second, fourth, and sixth wheels were split. The odd wheels then fit into the space between the two halves of the even wheels. Therefore, the even wheels partially covered the odd wheels when viewed from the side. The last wheel was raised slightly above the level of the others and also served as a tension wheel.

Sources: chasis para SdKfz 251 Bundesarchiv_Bild_101I- 750-0001A-10ª
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/stra ... sy/251.php

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
Attachments
image209.jpg
View of the vehicle's chassis........................................
image209.jpg (42.25 KiB) Viewed 1963 times

SIS 5
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Re: Sd.Kfz 250 & 251

#15

Post by SIS 5 » 11 Jan 2021, 16:20

Hi A.,

by chance I could find another pic the "SdKfz 251" with a sGrWr 34 kal. 80 mm in action (source: www.histomil.com).

Regards

Bert
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SPW GrWf.png
SPW GrWf.png (363.53 KiB) Viewed 1883 times

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