Panzerjager 1939

Discussions on the vehicles used by the Axis forces. Hosted by Christian Ankerstjerne
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jony663
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Panzerjager 1939

#1

Post by jony663 » 26 Feb 2017, 04:48

I am reading a memoir and the office Ian 1939 commanded a panzerjager company in Poland, but as the Stug only entered service in 1940 what was he using in Poland?

GregSingh
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#2

Post by GregSingh » 26 Feb 2017, 05:17

They used motor towed 37mm PAK guns.
I think Stug's were initially mainly used as support artillery, not in anti-tank role.


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sitalkes
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#3

Post by sitalkes » 26 Feb 2017, 05:36

The Stugs were part of the artillery branch and carried artillery sights, also the early versions had short 7.5cm guns with little ant-tank capability. The Panzer Jager 1 also didn't enter service until 1940.

jony663
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#4

Post by jony663 » 26 Feb 2017, 14:59

GregSingh wrote:They used motor towed 37mm PAK guns.
I think Stug's were initially mainly used as support artillery, not in anti-tank role.
So I assumed towed but Opel trucks, or was it something else?

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Sheldrake
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#5

Post by Sheldrake » 26 Feb 2017, 15:41

jony663 wrote:
GregSingh wrote:They used motor towed 37mm PAK guns.
I think Stug's were initially mainly used as support artillery, not in anti-tank role.
So I assumed towed but Opel trucks, or was it something else?
What is your interest?

A 3 tone Opel truck would have been overkill. The heavy cross country passenger vehicles - Schwerer geländegängiger PKW seems to have been used by some units.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einheits- ... Hitler.jpg
A parade ground image of 1st panzer Division seems to shop the same vehicle as 37mm gun tractor.

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Christian Ankerstjerne
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#6

Post by Christian Ankerstjerne » 26 Feb 2017, 20:01

The 1937 K St N lists the Kfz 12 as the towing vehicle for the 3,7 cm Pak:
http://www.wwiidaybyday.com/kstn/kstn1841okt37.htm

SIS 5
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#7

Post by SIS 5 » 27 Feb 2017, 20:40

Hi Jony,

in the book "Die deutsche Panzerjägertruppe 1935 - 1945" is the information, that the light truck Krupp type L 2 H 43 (6x4) or L 2 H 143 (Kfz. 69) was used as a tractor for the 3,7cm Pak in the AT battalions from 1934 on: Here a pic of such a truck (Krupp L 2 H 143, 1./Panzerjägerabteilung 90, 10. Panzerdivision) out of this book. But there were used also other light trucks, Opels too.

Regards

Bert
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Kfz.-69.gif
Kfz.-69.gif (337.04 KiB) Viewed 1111 times

john_g_kearney
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#8

Post by john_g_kearney » 28 Feb 2017, 11:29

Here are Kfz 12 (in this case based on the Horch 830) as a towing vehicle for the 3,7 cm Pak. Note the farm cart yoked to the nearest gun - it is loaded with an Esso oil or petrol drum.
Kfz 12 3,7 cm Pak.jpg
And here are Kfz 69 (Krupp 6x4 in this case) getting ready to leave the barracks at the Grafenwöhr training area in order to practice gunnery out on the range.
Kfz 69 3,7 cm Pak.jpg
John.

Alanmccoubrey
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#9

Post by Alanmccoubrey » 28 Feb 2017, 11:47

Lets not forget the SdKfz 10 which was widely used to tow the 3.7cm Pak plus all the Bedford and Morris Umbau which were used in Barbarossa as well as the Renault UE carriers used at the same time.
Alan

SIS 5
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#10

Post by SIS 5 » 28 Feb 2017, 11:54

Hi,

and here two pics with light Opel "Blitz" trucks towing a 3,7cm-Pak in France 1940. Sources of the pics: nr. 1: "Von Lemberg bis Bordeaux" by L. Leixner, nr. 2: Bundesarchiv).

Regards

Bert
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Opel---1.gif
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Opel---2.gif
Opel---2.gif (349.61 KiB) Viewed 1065 times

SIS 5
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#11

Post by SIS 5 » 28 Feb 2017, 18:45

Hi,

here two other pics with Kfz 12 (first Adler 3 Gd, second I cannot ID) towing the 3,7 cm Pak.

Regards

Bert
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Adler-3-Gd.gif
Adler-3-Gd.gif (274.89 KiB) Viewed 1025 times
Kfz.-12.gif
Kfz.-12.gif (243.44 KiB) Viewed 1025 times

john_g_kearney
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#12

Post by john_g_kearney » 28 Feb 2017, 19:08

In Bert's Adler photograph, are the men Gebirgsjäger? They seem to be wearing mountain boots.

John.

SIS 5
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#13

Post by SIS 5 » 28 Feb 2017, 21:11

Hi John,

You are right. It is a vehicle of the 2nd or 3rd mountain division in Norway in 1940. Excuse me, please, that I didn´t give this information (source of the pic: "Die Panzerabwehrkanone 3,7cm (Teil 2)" in Steelmasters Nr. 14.

Regards

Bert

SIS 5
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#14

Post by SIS 5 » 01 Mar 2017, 19:39

Hi,

here two other pics with Kfz 12 (first Mercedes-Benz type 269 "Stuttgart", second Wanderer type W 11) towing the 3,7 cm Pak, both during the campaign in Poland 1939. Source pic 1: Tankograd - Wehrmacht Spezial № 4002 "Deutsche Fahrzeugraritäten (2)" by Henry Hoppe; pic 2: "Personenkraftwagen der Wehrmacht" by Reinhard Frank.

Regards

Bert
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MB-260.gif
MB-260.gif (234.3 KiB) Viewed 951 times
Wanderer-W-11.gif
Wanderer-W-11.gif (291.74 KiB) Viewed 951 times

Alanmccoubrey
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Re: Panzerjager 1939

#15

Post by Alanmccoubrey » 07 Mar 2017, 11:07

SIS 5 wrote:Hi,

and here two pics with light Opel "Blitz" trucks towing a 3,7cm-Pak in France 1940. Sources of the pics: nr. 1: "Von Lemberg bis Bordeaux" by L. Leixner, nr. 2: Bundesarchiv).

Regards

Bert
Bert, I'm sure I'm not alone in always forgetting about the 1.5t Opels and always thinking of the big 3 tonners ! I watched a television documentary on Barbarossa a couple of weeks ago in which there was film of a Ford car Umbau towing a 37mm Pak, so really the permutations are many.
Alan

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