21 PD according to Samuel W. Mitcham

[Rein]

from the book retreat to the reich, Samuel W. Mitcham, Jr.

Because Hitler had rejected Rommel’s pleas to position the panzer divisions near the coast, only 1 was available, and it was the worst: the 21st Panzer Division. Although its human material was excellent, one of its two tank battalions was equipped with 80 obsolete Czech tanks that were too light for modern warfare and had not been manufactured since 1941. Its other tank battalion had 40 PzKw IVs, but they were also obsolete and were fitted with short-barreled guns. (Both battalions were controlled by the 100th Panzer Regiment, which had four additional panzers in its staff company.) The division’s two panzer grenadier regiments (the 125th and 192nd) were also equipped with inferior and obsolete
equipment.

Does Mitcham describe here the 21 PD on 6 june 1944, or on an earlier stadium??
I cant trace those obsolete czech tanks, and all PzKw IV's had short barreled guns seems not correct to me??

[Christian Ankerstjerne]

21. Panzer-Divisions made very detailed notes about their equipment. On 1 June 1944, it had the following:

• 47 assault guns (43 combat ready, 7,5 cm Pak 40 and 10,5 cm le F H on Hotchkiss chassis)
• 4 combat-ready Pz Kpfw III's
• 104 Pz Kpfw IV's (98 combat ready, of which 92 were long-barreled)
• 50 self-propelled guns on Lorraine chassis (45 combat ready)
• 27 Somua S35 (23 combat ready)
• 12 self-propelled anti-tank guns (all combat ready)
• 9 command tanks (6 combat ready, of which 2 were Pz Kpfw III-based and 3 were Somua based - can't find the last one)
• 10 observation tanks (9 combat ready)
• 7 ammunition carrier tanks (all combat ready)
• 50 Somua prime movers (49 combat ready)
• 18 self-propelled 20 mm anti-aircraft guns (17 combat ready)
• 304 miscellaneous armored and tracked vehicles (297 were combat ready, including 24 le F H and 12 s F H on Lorraine chassis)

Because 21. Panzer-Division had a large allotment of captured French equipment, some of its equipment was not as modern as state-of-the-art German equipment. Because it had a large number of Unic P107 half-tracks, it had a higher level of mechanization than what was normal for German tank divisions, having two rather than one mechanized infantry battalion (one with m S P W, and one with Unic P107).

Saying the unit was as poorly equipped is the quote you posted suggests is demonstrably wrong.

[Rein]

but no czech tanks at all...
And even the short barreled pzkpfw IV was rather exception then standard.
thnx

[Jan-Hendrik]

See the post by Martin Block on the unit's equipment.

Jan-Hendrik

[yantaylor]

Jan, it says in that link that the 21 Panzer had Flak 38s, would these be leSPW U304 (f) mounting a 2cm Flak 38?
It seems like almost every formation in the 21st Panzer had a Flak unit, the vehicles I can nail down are;

leSPW U304 (f)
Sd. Kfz 10/4
Sd. Kfz 7/1

What were the vehicles in 22. Panzer regiment as some sources say this unit had 12 x Flak 38s.

Thanks
Yan.

[Sid Guttridge]

Hi Rein,

About 30 years ago I bought a book by Samuel W. Mitcham entitled Hitler's Legions. It was often wildly innaccurate and I have avoided the author's work ever since. It looks as though I was well justified in doing so, judging by the replies to your question above!

Cheers,

Sid.

[Sheldrake]

21. Panzer-Divisions made very detailed notes about their equipment. On 1 June 1944, it had the following:

• 47 assault guns (43 combat ready, 7,5 cm Pak 40 and 10,5 cm le F H on Hotchkiss chassis)
• 4 combat-ready Pz Kpfw III's
• 104 Pz Kpfw IV's (98 combat ready, of which 92 were long-barreled)
• 50 self-propelled guns on Lorraine chassis (45 combat ready)
• 27 Somua S35 (23 combat ready)
• 12 self-propelled anti-tank guns (all combat ready)
• 9 command tanks (6 combat ready, of which 2 were Pz Kpfw III-based and 3 were Somua based - can't find the last one)
• 10 observation tanks (9 combat ready)
• 7 ammunition carrier tanks (all combat ready)
• 50 Somua prime movers (49 combat ready)
• 18 self-propelled 20 mm anti-aircraft guns (17 combat ready)
• 304 miscellaneous armored and tracked vehicles (297 were combat ready, including 24 le F H and 12 s F H on Lorraine chassis)

Because 21. Panzer-Division had a large allotment of captured French equipment, some of its equipment was not as modern as state-of-the-art German equipment. Because it had a large number of Unic P107 half-tracks, it had a higher level of mechanization than what was normal for German tank divisions, having two rather than one mechanized infantry battalion (one with m S P W, and one with Unic P107).

Saying the unit was as poorly equipped is the quote you posted suggests is demonstrably wrong.

I am familiar with the list but have not seen any evidence from the documents or photographs of SOMUA in action fighting in Normandy in 1944. I have seen several mentions that more Pz IV were on the way. What happened to the SOMUA?

[Christian Ankerstjerne]

I am familiar with the list but have not seen any evidence from the documents or photographs of SOMUA in action fighting in Normandy in 1944. I have seen several mentions that more Pz IV were on the way. What happened to the SOMUA?

I would imagine that the division commander would resist sending his crews into combat in hopelessly outdated tanks before the desperation of the final days of the Third Reich had set in.

[Sheldrake]

I am familiar with the list but have not seen any evidence from the documents or photographs of SOMUA in action fighting in Normandy in 1944. I have seen several mentions that more Pz IV were on the way. What happened to the SOMUA?

I would imagine that the division commander would resist sending his crews into combat in hopelessly outdated tanks before the desperation of the final days of the Third Reich had set in.

1. If this was the equipment of 21st Panzer division there was no reason to leave it in reserve for "the longest day." A lot of the opposition were lightly armed paratroops and commandos
2. Obsolescence didn't stop the German pz Bn 100 from using old french tanks in the Cotentin.

My hypothesis is that the Somua were replaced by Pz IV before the 6th, but the Somua must have gone somewhere.

[jpz4]

Sheldrake, if I'm not mistaken there supposedly is evidence that (most of) the Somuas were sent away in the early days of June (before the Invasion). It's about time someone proves this once and for all. I don't like rumors and this is an old one.

There was some sort of plan to transfer 10 Somuas from the division to Pz.Abt.206 to replace 10 Hotchkiss tanks. As far as I know this never happened, but it shows the divisions was not supposed to keep them much longer. This plan may help explain what happened to the Somuas of the 21.P.D.
I suspect they were sent to the area of Paris and would be re-allocated from there, but transfers in this period are hard to follow. Photos show that around D-Day certain units had vehicles they had not listed before.

[Manuferey]

using old french tanks in the Cotentin.

The Gliederung of Pz.Ers.u.Aus. Abt. 100 dated May 18, 1944 shows tanks such as B1bis (produced since 1936), Hotchkiss 39 (adopted in the French Army in late 1938), Somua S 35 (produced since 1936), R 35 (also produced since 1936). These tanks were less than 8 years old in 1944, hardly "old" then. And some of these tanks could have even been manufactured as late as June 1940, making them 4 years old in June 1944.

Emmanuel

[Sid Guttridge]

Hi Manufrey,

Leaving aside whether the French designs were conceptually modern in 1940, even if newly built, given the pace of technical advance in those four years, "old" seems a reasonable description. I don't think the Germans were producing any of the armoured vehicles they were building in 1940 in unimproved form in 1944.

Cheers,

Sid.

[yantaylor]

Did the panzer regiment change its number before the 6th of June?
Some sites name it as the 22. Pz Regt and some as the 100. Pz Regt.

Yan.

[JARDIN DAVID]

My question in exactly the same !
And another one concerning this Pz. Rgt. some months later, in Lorraine.
H von OPPELN-BRONIKOWSI left his command about beginning of september 44. Which officer was his deputy ? I have a testimony that evokes an Oberstleutnant. I would like to find his name.
Thanks
JD