Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
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Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Yan, you'll find that those two units had several different makeups during 1942 so you might need to decide on a month ! You will definitely find that both had SdKfz 250's armed with French 25mm ATG and German 7,5cm leIG 18's, without the shields in the latter case.
Alan
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Thanks Alan, that is what I find so fascinating about these two battalions, but you are totally correct, it is a big task which requires breaking down into segments to determine what they had at a particular stage in that year.
I am surprised at the SdKfz 250's, I thought that these were rather rare in desert and those that did make it were usually used as command vehicles.
I remember asking on another thread, the amount of SdKfz 250's and SdKfz 251's available to the DAK, and if I recall the numbers were quite small.
Most of the infantry traveled in trucks rather than APCs.
Thanks
Yan.
I am surprised at the SdKfz 250's, I thought that these were rather rare in desert and those that did make it were usually used as command vehicles.
I remember asking on another thread, the amount of SdKfz 250's and SdKfz 251's available to the DAK, and if I recall the numbers were quite small.
Most of the infantry traveled in trucks rather than APCs.
Thanks
Yan.
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Alan, are those 75mm versions the Sd.Kfz. 250/8?
Or some field conversion mounting a 75mm IG minus its shield?
Regards
Yan.
Or some field conversion mounting a 75mm IG minus its shield?
Regards
Yan.
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Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Yan, they were 250's with the little 7,5cm leIG 18 on them, a field mod. Sadly I just cannot find the photographs that I have of them.
Alan
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Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Thanks Alan.
Good God, the length of that 25mm barrel is so long, just compare it to the 3.7mm PaK 36 on the right. But is it a Hotchkiss or a Puteaux?
Think it may be a Canon Antichar de 25 SA-L Modèle 1937, which was a Puteaux gun and had a barrel length of 1.925mm (L/77).
The 25mm French weapon could penetrate 29mm @ 500m @ 30°, with the PaK 36 being slightly better at 31mm @ 500m @ 30°.
Regards
Yan
Good God, the length of that 25mm barrel is so long, just compare it to the 3.7mm PaK 36 on the right. But is it a Hotchkiss or a Puteaux?
Think it may be a Canon Antichar de 25 SA-L Modèle 1937, which was a Puteaux gun and had a barrel length of 1.925mm (L/77).
The 25mm French weapon could penetrate 29mm @ 500m @ 30°, with the PaK 36 being slightly better at 31mm @ 500m @ 30°.
Regards
Yan
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Another vehicle with very scant data is the 5cm PaK 38 (sf) Auf Zugkraftwagen 1t. I can't any data on numbers built or the units who used them, in fact all I can find is that it could have been a field conversion which was only used by the SS in Russia.
Regards
Yan.
Regards
Yan.
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Yan,
5cm PaK 38 (sf) Auf Zugkraftwagen 1t does interest me as well. I have two books with the same photo of this vehicle. In one of them it is supposed to belong to SS Wiking in winter 1942/43. In another book about the 3rd Battle of Kharkov this vehicle is described as belonging to SS Leibstandarte division. ?
5cm PaK 38 (sf) Auf Zugkraftwagen 1t does interest me as well. I have two books with the same photo of this vehicle. In one of them it is supposed to belong to SS Wiking in winter 1942/43. In another book about the 3rd Battle of Kharkov this vehicle is described as belonging to SS Leibstandarte division. ?
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Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Here some more pictures of this conversion.
Regards
Armin
Regards
Armin
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Hi Zbynek, hi Armin,
the conversion on pic 4 Armin posted is a vehicle of the 16 PzGrenDiv., 3rd company Pz.Jg.Abt. 228 (source: Waffen-Arsenal Band 129: "Leichte Zugkraftwagen der Wehrmacht im Einsatz" by Reinhard Frank.
Regards
Bert
the conversion on pic 4 Armin posted is a vehicle of the 16 PzGrenDiv., 3rd company Pz.Jg.Abt. 228 (source: Waffen-Arsenal Band 129: "Leichte Zugkraftwagen der Wehrmacht im Einsatz" by Reinhard Frank.
Regards
Bert
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
ho Zbynek,
here another pic of the vehicle You are interested in. Maybe the same vehicle (source: Waffen-Arsenal Band 170 "Die 5-cm-Panzerjägerkanone 38" by Wolfgang Fleischer). I think that this vehicle belongs to SS Leibstandarte division, because the vehicles in the background fit to the battle of Kharkov in the winter 1943.
Regards
Bert
here another pic of the vehicle You are interested in. Maybe the same vehicle (source: Waffen-Arsenal Band 170 "Die 5-cm-Panzerjägerkanone 38" by Wolfgang Fleischer). I think that this vehicle belongs to SS Leibstandarte division, because the vehicles in the background fit to the battle of Kharkov in the winter 1943.
Regards
Bert
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Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
SIS 5 thank you for the information.
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Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
I have seen these in a couple of videos. One is from a recon unit. If I see them again, I will post a link.
Re: Sdkfz 233 Stummel - information needed
Thanks everyone, great photos too!
Was this just a field conversion as there is no total for numbers produced, any vehicles built in German factories would be numbered.
I would have thought that this vehicle would be useful in light units like recon battalions, they could be in the heavy company of recon infantry companies along with Sd.Kfz. 250/7s and Sd.Kfz. 250/8s.
Yan.
Was this just a field conversion as there is no total for numbers produced, any vehicles built in German factories would be numbered.
I would have thought that this vehicle would be useful in light units like recon battalions, they could be in the heavy company of recon infantry companies along with Sd.Kfz. 250/7s and Sd.Kfz. 250/8s.
Yan.