Pz IV's they had the two blue lights

[admfisher]

On the early Pz IV's they had the two blue lights to warn the gunner when he was shooting out past the profile of the tank.

What was the reason for this.
Was it so they would not fire sideways when on an incline? I know the early tanks they really were not to sure of the recoil and other actions of firing the main gun, but this adds to my questions.

Thanks

[Andy H]

Excuse my ignorance but where were the lights on the tank?

Andy from the Shire

[admfisher]

They were mounted for the gunner to see when the gun was firing over the side of tank.

[Aufklarung]

I have never heard about these lights before but when I read your post I immediately thought of the short 75mm on the early marks of Pz IV. Perhaps in certain degrees of traverse, it was possible to shoot it's own hull. Just a guess.

[admfisher]

Nope, sorry.

The main gun could not hit the sides of tank. My guess is that in the early panzer production we see almost a fear of the main gun sizes.
For example, the 3.7 firing, would the muzzle blast effect the driver or maybe it was when they were considering the 5 cm L/60. Most likley the L/60 as it was the first long gun the Germans used.
But to make my point further on the PzIV, the tank sitting on an angle and firing over the side, may well of tipped her over. Now this is not for certain but it is a good guess.

[Aufklarung]

Like I said, just a guess. So where exactly were these lights? In the turret? On the hull? On the turret? In the hull? WHERE?
A

[admfisher]

They were mounted where the gunner would be able to see them. It doesn't say where, the book is Panzer IV and its Variants, by Walter Spielberger.

[Andy H]

Found this in Osprey's book on the Mk IV Ausf E

"The driver was provided with a gun warning indicator in the form of two BLUE LAMPS mounted on either side of the compartment. When the gun was traversed over the side of the vehicle a switch tripped automatically and the corresponding lamp lit up, warining him to allow extra room if the tank was passing between trees or buildings. Failure to do this could result in the barrel striking an obstruction and causing damage to the gun mounting. This device was not fitted to laetr models"

Andy from the Shire

[admfisher]

Excellant.

Thank ever so much. This has been a mystery to me for some time now.

Grant

[Aufklarung]

I have had a barrel strike a tree in a Leo 1. Merely a tap but there is no traverse warning system in our vehs today. Turret savvy is the norm even tho' one can still manage to have the tank going one way, the turret traversing the other and a tree between!!

As far as the blue lights............and now you know............ the rest of the story.

[admfisher]

While then you will be happy to know that I include your info in my PzIV page today. I just started updating the Pz IV section and have finished the techincal of the Ausf A.

Thanks again.

[Andy H]

By answering one question it opens up another. If this system wasn't fitted to models after the Ausf E what did they use/have fitted?

Andy from the Shire

[admfisher]

As time went by the training showed that these were not necassary. The tank crews were trained to watch for this type of thing. Dont for get that the blue lights were only on the Ausf A. So this was before the war.
One could say with war experiance they found that the gunner and commander could watch out for the gun better.
In the end it is better to have the gunner aware of the gun position all the time so this blue light set up would only make the gunner more lazy.

[Andy H]

Hi there, as per my previous post regarding the Blue Lamps, the info which came from the Osprey book gave the info pertaining to Ausf E model, so in use long after the Ausf A

Andy from the Shire

[Aufklarung]

...and then came the F and F2 with a different turret. This would seem the logical time such a system was no longer a showroom option!!