Vehicle identity requests
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Hi,
sorry, it´s me again, but this time with an own question.
Here a pic with a well camouflaged truck. But I cannot ID the truck and it seems to be not a Wehrmacht´s one. Maybe some of You can help. Thanks in advance.
Regards
Bert
sorry, it´s me again, but this time with an own question.
Here a pic with a well camouflaged truck. But I cannot ID the truck and it seems to be not a Wehrmacht´s one. Maybe some of You can help. Thanks in advance.
Regards
Bert
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Re: Vehicle identity requests
AmericanSIS 5 wrote:Hi,
sorry, it´s me again, but this time with an own question.
Here a pic with a well camouflaged truck. But I cannot ID the truck and it seems to be not a Wehrmacht´s one. Maybe some of You can help. Thanks in advance.
Regards
Bert
Soft top CCKW with trailer
Branches camo seems to indicate captured by Wehrmacht and fear of air attack
the color bar bumper markings are for Normandy and the sequence of colors the divisional sub unit. The markings are seen in 1st ID, 4th ID, 29th ID, 2AD
"There are two kinds of people who are staying on this beach: those who are dead and those who are going to die. Now let’s get the hell out of here".
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Hi LineDoggie,
thank You very much for Your reply. Very interesting. Soft top CCKW is an excellent solution. But I cannot imagine that the Germans could capture American or British trucks in the Normandy.
Regards
Bert
thank You very much for Your reply. Very interesting. Soft top CCKW is an excellent solution. But I cannot imagine that the Germans could capture American or British trucks in the Normandy.
Regards
Bert
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Re: Vehicle identity requests
SiS5
This is a GMC of the postwar Austrian Army. Red-white-red Flags on the bumper and sign of JgB4 der 1.Brig.
This is a GMC of the postwar Austrian Army. Red-white-red Flags on the bumper and sign of JgB4 der 1.Brig.
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Thank you very much about the reply, Bert. There is indeed a great similarity - but what about the antennas on the sides?SIS 5 wrote:Hi Ivan,
the car on Your pic could be a Stoewer type M 12 RW. Here apic of this car (source: "German Military Vehicle Rarities (2) by Henry Hoppe).
Regards
Bert
Cheers,
Ivan
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Ivan,
I think the antennae are in fact width markers mounted on the front wings, to gauge the width of the vehicle for passing through restricted gaps.
Kerry.
I think the antennae are in fact width markers mounted on the front wings, to gauge the width of the vehicle for passing through restricted gaps.
Kerry.
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Ah, is that so!? Thanks for helping again - and see you soon. You guys are excellentkerryboo wrote:Ivan,
I think the antennae are in fact width markers mounted on the front wings, to gauge the width of the vehicle for passing through restricted gaps.
Kerry.
Cheers,
Ivan
PS
Two more photos of that mountain car we previously mentioned (possibly even the very same car):
http://www.kriegsberichter-archive.com/ ... ategory/62
http://www.kriegsberichter-archive.com/ ... ategory/62
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Hi,
what kind of truck on this photo?
Image from local Russian site
what kind of truck on this photo?
Image from local Russian site
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Re: Vehicle identity requests
Well it is a US CCKW truck with trailerSIS 5 wrote:Hi LineDoggie,
thank You very much for Your reply. Very interesting. Soft top CCKW is an excellent solution. But I cannot imagine that the Germans could capture American or British trucks in the Normandy.
Regards
Bert
It has the style of bumper marking used for Overlord
US forces would have no reason to camouflage a truck so heavily when the Allied Air Forces had full Air Superiority, but German forces did use camo like this on vehicles in Normandy
IIRC besides numerous POW from the 82nd, 101st, 1st, 2nd, 4th, 8th, 29th div the 90th Div lost almost an entire Bn POW to the germans
Jeeps, M8 armored cars were captured so why not soft skin trucks?
"There are two kinds of people who are staying on this beach: those who are dead and those who are going to die. Now let’s get the hell out of here".
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach
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Re: Vehicle identity requests
Is that basically saying be quiet, no lights? Would that be a common phrase on these trucks, or would that phrase being on the side be due to them thinking it was an L1400, which was used as radio trucks?peeved wrote:Re: the Borgward's bedside banter cf. https://www.google.fi/?gws_rd=ssl#q=%22 ... dunkelt%22 ; Your text includes verdunkeln so verb instead of adjective verdunkelt but either should IMO be lower case.
Markus
Re: Vehicle identity requests
Hi all:
This is my first post so let me start by stating that I have learned a lot from all of you, particularly in this thread. I was referred to this forum by Clive, who I know from a different forum. I had seen a small, blurry picture of what appeared to be Panzer IAs with a dummy superstructure and turret, and I needed more information about this. I did find the information on this thread, so thanks again to all of you.
After going over the rest of the thread, I found the following post by SIS5 (Bert) and the replies from TadPortly and Alanmccoubrey, and decided to add my take on it.
(Disclaimer: Under normal circumstances, I would not bring back old posts like these, certainly not on a first post. However, because Tad's answer was correct and was challenged, I wanted to set the record straight. Disclaimer #2: Alan, I'm not picking on you!)
1) The blue circles show the location of the turn indicators: (a) 253 on the fenders; (b) 252 higher up, under the side visors.
2) The green oblique lines represent the 252's sharp slope, which is absent in the 253 (if the vehicle were a 252, the tarp would be floating in mid-air).
3) The red circles show the location of the 253's antenna casing (under the tarp on the left picture and absent on the 252 due to the slope).
I think that these differences are sufficient to establish that the halftrack with the Panzer IA turret is a 253. What may have thrown Alan off, is that the antenna trough was removed. This was most likely to make space for the turret or, maybe, if this vehicle didn't have the extra radios (and antenna) normally used in the 253.
There is another possibility. This could be an SdKfz 250 with an added roof plate, in the same way used to create the 250/9 with the Kwk 38 on a revolving turret. Although the typical 250 is easily distinguished from the 253, there was a small number of early 250s built by Gebrüder Böhler & Co. AG, the company that built most of the 253s. They were authorized to build 250s using a modified 253 superstructure. The Geb. Böhler superstructure was designated 250/Z, while the "standard" one was the 250E.
I still think that the picture posted by Bert is of a 253 because neither of the 250 superstructures had the antenna casing, which should be what is under the tarp.
For a better explanation of the 250/Z vs. 250E superstructures, go to Holger Erdmann's site http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/Homepage_ ... __spw.html
and check the 3rd and 4th entries under the "Production models" section.
Edwin
This is my first post so let me start by stating that I have learned a lot from all of you, particularly in this thread. I was referred to this forum by Clive, who I know from a different forum. I had seen a small, blurry picture of what appeared to be Panzer IAs with a dummy superstructure and turret, and I needed more information about this. I did find the information on this thread, so thanks again to all of you.
After going over the rest of the thread, I found the following post by SIS5 (Bert) and the replies from TadPortly and Alanmccoubrey, and decided to add my take on it.
(Disclaimer: Under normal circumstances, I would not bring back old posts like these, certainly not on a first post. However, because Tad's answer was correct and was challenged, I wanted to set the record straight. Disclaimer #2: Alan, I'm not picking on you!)
SIS 5 wrote:Hi all,
You know I´m no expert in armored vehicles. But I´m interested to know what type of armored vehicle is on that pic? A special version of Sd.Kfz. 250 or a prototype of an armored reconnaissance car? Thanks for any answer.
Regards
Bert
TadPortly wrote:It could be an Sdkfz 253 modified to mount a Panzer I turret. I have seen only one other picture of this modification.
Well, it is an SdKfz 253 (with the antenna trough removed), as explained below.Alanmccoubrey wrote:Bert, that isn't an SdKfz 253, it is the SdKfz 252 ammunition carrier. If you look at the rear of the superstructure where the tarp is bundled up you'll see that the superstructure slopes downwards sharply and also there is no antena trough running along the right side of the roof as in the 253.
1) The blue circles show the location of the turn indicators: (a) 253 on the fenders; (b) 252 higher up, under the side visors.
2) The green oblique lines represent the 252's sharp slope, which is absent in the 253 (if the vehicle were a 252, the tarp would be floating in mid-air).
3) The red circles show the location of the 253's antenna casing (under the tarp on the left picture and absent on the 252 due to the slope).
I think that these differences are sufficient to establish that the halftrack with the Panzer IA turret is a 253. What may have thrown Alan off, is that the antenna trough was removed. This was most likely to make space for the turret or, maybe, if this vehicle didn't have the extra radios (and antenna) normally used in the 253.
There is another possibility. This could be an SdKfz 250 with an added roof plate, in the same way used to create the 250/9 with the Kwk 38 on a revolving turret. Although the typical 250 is easily distinguished from the 253, there was a small number of early 250s built by Gebrüder Böhler & Co. AG, the company that built most of the 253s. They were authorized to build 250s using a modified 253 superstructure. The Geb. Böhler superstructure was designated 250/Z, while the "standard" one was the 250E.
I still think that the picture posted by Bert is of a 253 because neither of the 250 superstructures had the antenna casing, which should be what is under the tarp.
For a better explanation of the 250/Z vs. 250E superstructures, go to Holger Erdmann's site http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/Homepage_ ... __spw.html
and check the 3rd and 4th entries under the "Production models" section.
Edwin
Re: Vehicle identity requests
A disclaimer: Have only faint memories from a couple of Schuldeutsch classes so would wait for native speakers' opinions. In my mind the literal translation of Auch das Mundwerk verdunkeln (note lower case v in verdunkeln) would be Black out the mouth too and your interpretation a good similar slogan in English. I would make the word-for-word translation of Auch das Mundwerk verdunkelt! in Lepage's book interchangeably The mouth blacks out also! or The mouth also blacked out!; Rather more introvert than the Borgward's banter.panzergruppesud wrote:Is that basically saying be quiet, no lights?peeved wrote:Re: the Borgward's bedside banter cf. https://www.google.fi/?gws_rd=ssl#q=%22 ... dunkelt%22 ; Your text includes verdunkeln so verb instead of adjective verdunkelt but either should IMO be lower case.
Dunno; The Lepage book at least doesn't seem to give a clear indication on how common the similar slogan was. If however as Lepage wrote the slogan Feind Hört mit! (although I believe hört should have a lower case h) was displayed on radio equipment it seems more appropriate for radio lorries also.panzergruppesud wrote:Would that be a common phrase on these trucks, or would that phrase being on the side be due to them thinking it was an L1400, which was used as radio trucks?
Markus
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Re: Vehicle identity requests
This car was represented as an Alfa-Romeo, and while I see similarities to some 6C models the reverse curvature top of the radiator and the square radiator badge don't look like Alfa to me. Also I'm curious about the ownership. The IZ plate seems to indicate Rhine Province. Are these pre-TR provincial police or...?
Cheers,
Max
Max
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Re: Vehicle identity requests
Hi, what kind of vehicle used by this general? Akira Takiguchi collection on WAF