Vehicle identity requests

Discussions on the vehicles used by the Axis forces. Hosted by Christian Ankerstjerne
Post Reply
SIS 5
Member
Posts: 5894
Joined: 22 Nov 2006, 18:27
Location: Germany

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5956

Post by SIS 5 » 05 Dec 2014, 20:28

Hi,

sorry, it´s me again, but this time with an own question.
Here a pic with a well camouflaged truck. But I cannot ID the truck and it seems to be not a Wehrmacht´s one. Maybe some of You can help. Thanks in advance.

Regards

Bert
Attachments
not-ID---113.gif
not-ID---113.gif (248.81 KiB) Viewed 1417 times

LineDoggie
Member
Posts: 1275
Joined: 03 Oct 2008, 21:06

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5957

Post by LineDoggie » 05 Dec 2014, 20:54

SIS 5 wrote:Hi,

sorry, it´s me again, but this time with an own question.
Here a pic with a well camouflaged truck. But I cannot ID the truck and it seems to be not a Wehrmacht´s one. Maybe some of You can help. Thanks in advance.

Regards

Bert
American
Soft top CCKW with trailer
Branches camo seems to indicate captured by Wehrmacht and fear of air attack

the color bar bumper markings are for Normandy and the sequence of colors the divisional sub unit. The markings are seen in 1st ID, 4th ID, 29th ID, 2AD
"There are two kinds of people who are staying on this beach: those who are dead and those who are going to die. Now let’s get the hell out of here".
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach


SIS 5
Member
Posts: 5894
Joined: 22 Nov 2006, 18:27
Location: Germany

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5958

Post by SIS 5 » 05 Dec 2014, 23:28

Hi LineDoggie,

thank You very much for Your reply. Very interesting. Soft top CCKW is an excellent solution. But I cannot imagine that the Germans could capture American or British trucks in the Normandy.

Regards

Bert

User avatar
Maxschnauzer
Financial supporter
Posts: 6003
Joined: 24 Jan 2014, 08:36
Location: Philippines

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5959

Post by Maxschnauzer » 06 Dec 2014, 04:14

Can anyone ID this Luftwaffe tractor?
Attachments
$_57.JPG
eBay photo
Cheers,
Max

techsam04
New member
Posts: 1
Joined: 06 Dec 2014, 10:43
Location: Austria

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5960

Post by techsam04 » 06 Dec 2014, 11:08

SiS5
This is a GMC of the postwar Austrian Army. Red-white-red Flags on the bumper and sign of JgB4 der 1.Brig.

User avatar
Ivan Ž.
Host - Music section
Posts: 8467
Joined: 05 Apr 2005, 13:28
Location: Serbia

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5961

Post by Ivan Ž. » 06 Dec 2014, 12:05

SIS 5 wrote:Hi Ivan,
the car on Your pic could be a Stoewer type M 12 RW. Here apic of this car (source: "German Military Vehicle Rarities (2) by Henry Hoppe).
Regards
Bert
Thank you very much about the reply, Bert. There is indeed a great similarity - but what about the antennas on the sides?

Cheers,
Ivan

kerryboo
Member
Posts: 2079
Joined: 08 Nov 2008, 13:29

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5962

Post by kerryboo » 06 Dec 2014, 12:21

Ivan,
I think the antennae are in fact width markers mounted on the front wings, to gauge the width of the vehicle for passing through restricted gaps.
Kerry.

User avatar
Ivan Ž.
Host - Music section
Posts: 8467
Joined: 05 Apr 2005, 13:28
Location: Serbia

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5963

Post by Ivan Ž. » 06 Dec 2014, 12:40

kerryboo wrote:Ivan,
I think the antennae are in fact width markers mounted on the front wings, to gauge the width of the vehicle for passing through restricted gaps.
Kerry.
Ah, is that so!? :) Thanks for helping again - and see you soon. You guys are excellent :)

Cheers,
Ivan

PS
Two more photos of that mountain car we previously mentioned (possibly even the very same car):
http://www.kriegsberichter-archive.com/ ... ategory/62
http://www.kriegsberichter-archive.com/ ... ategory/62

Oleg_ZH
Member
Posts: 7
Joined: 18 Sep 2014, 15:23
Location: Smolensk, Russia

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5964

Post by Oleg_ZH » 06 Dec 2014, 12:46

Hi,
what kind of truck on this photo?
Image from local Russian site
Image

LineDoggie
Member
Posts: 1275
Joined: 03 Oct 2008, 21:06

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5965

Post by LineDoggie » 06 Dec 2014, 21:31

SIS 5 wrote:Hi LineDoggie,

thank You very much for Your reply. Very interesting. Soft top CCKW is an excellent solution. But I cannot imagine that the Germans could capture American or British trucks in the Normandy.

Regards

Bert
Well it is a US CCKW truck with trailer

It has the style of bumper marking used for Overlord

US forces would have no reason to camouflage a truck so heavily when the Allied Air Forces had full Air Superiority, but German forces did use camo like this on vehicles in Normandy

IIRC besides numerous POW from the 82nd, 101st, 1st, 2nd, 4th, 8th, 29th div the 90th Div lost almost an entire Bn POW to the germans

Jeeps, M8 armored cars were captured so why not soft skin trucks?
"There are two kinds of people who are staying on this beach: those who are dead and those who are going to die. Now let’s get the hell out of here".
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach

panzergruppesud
Member
Posts: 14
Joined: 04 Dec 2014, 01:20
Location: United States

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5966

Post by panzergruppesud » 06 Dec 2014, 21:45

peeved wrote:Re: the Borgward's bedside banter cf. https://www.google.fi/?gws_rd=ssl#q=%22 ... dunkelt%22 ; Your text includes verdunkeln so verb instead of adjective verdunkelt but either should IMO be lower case.

Markus
Is that basically saying be quiet, no lights? Would that be a common phrase on these trucks, or would that phrase being on the side be due to them thinking it was an L1400, which was used as radio trucks?

EdwRom
Member
Posts: 10
Joined: 03 Aug 2011, 12:33

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5967

Post by EdwRom » 06 Dec 2014, 22:33

Hi all:
This is my first post so let me start by stating that I have learned a lot from all of you, particularly in this thread. I was referred to this forum by Clive, who I know from a different forum. I had seen a small, blurry picture of what appeared to be Panzer IAs with a dummy superstructure and turret, and I needed more information about this. I did find the information on this thread, so thanks again to all of you.

After going over the rest of the thread, I found the following post by SIS5 (Bert) and the replies from TadPortly and Alanmccoubrey, and decided to add my take on it.
(Disclaimer: Under normal circumstances, I would not bring back old posts like these, certainly not on a first post. However, because Tad's answer was correct and was challenged, I wanted to set the record straight. Disclaimer #2: Alan, I'm not picking on you!)
SIS 5 wrote:Hi all,

You know I´m no expert in armored vehicles. But I´m interested to know what type of armored vehicle is on that pic? A special version of Sd.Kfz. 250 or a prototype of an armored reconnaissance car? Thanks for any answer.

Regards

Bert
TadPortly wrote:It could be an Sdkfz 253 modified to mount a Panzer I turret. I have seen only one other picture of this modification.
Alanmccoubrey wrote:Bert, that isn't an SdKfz 253, it is the SdKfz 252 ammunition carrier. If you look at the rear of the superstructure where the tarp is bundled up you'll see that the superstructure slopes downwards sharply and also there is no antena trough running along the right side of the roof as in the 253.
Well, it is an SdKfz 253 (with the antenna trough removed), as explained below.
252-253 Explanation.jpg
1) The blue circles show the location of the turn indicators: (a) 253 on the fenders; (b) 252 higher up, under the side visors.
2) The green oblique lines represent the 252's sharp slope, which is absent in the 253 (if the vehicle were a 252, the tarp would be floating in mid-air).
3) The red circles show the location of the 253's antenna casing (under the tarp on the left picture and absent on the 252 due to the slope).

I think that these differences are sufficient to establish that the halftrack with the Panzer IA turret is a 253. What may have thrown Alan off, is that the antenna trough was removed. This was most likely to make space for the turret or, maybe, if this vehicle didn't have the extra radios (and antenna) normally used in the 253.

There is another possibility. This could be an SdKfz 250 with an added roof plate, in the same way used to create the 250/9 with the Kwk 38 on a revolving turret. Although the typical 250 is easily distinguished from the 253, there was a small number of early 250s built by Gebrüder Böhler & Co. AG, the company that built most of the 253s. They were authorized to build 250s using a modified 253 superstructure. The Geb. Böhler superstructure was designated 250/Z, while the "standard" one was the 250E.

I still think that the picture posted by Bert is of a 253 because neither of the 250 superstructures had the antenna casing, which should be what is under the tarp.

For a better explanation of the 250/Z vs. 250E superstructures, go to Holger Erdmann's site http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/Homepage_ ... __spw.html
and check the 3rd and 4th entries under the "Production models" section.

Edwin

User avatar
peeved
Member
Posts: 9109
Joined: 01 Jul 2007, 08:15
Location: Finland

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5968

Post by peeved » 06 Dec 2014, 23:27

panzergruppesud wrote:
peeved wrote:Re: the Borgward's bedside banter cf. https://www.google.fi/?gws_rd=ssl#q=%22 ... dunkelt%22 ; Your text includes verdunkeln so verb instead of adjective verdunkelt but either should IMO be lower case.
Is that basically saying be quiet, no lights?
A disclaimer: Have only faint memories from a couple of Schuldeutsch classes so would wait for native speakers' opinions. In my mind the literal translation of Auch das Mundwerk verdunkeln (note lower case v in verdunkeln) would be Black out the mouth too and your interpretation a good similar slogan in English. I would make the word-for-word translation of Auch das Mundwerk verdunkelt! in Lepage's book interchangeably The mouth blacks out also! or The mouth also blacked out!; Rather more introvert than the Borgward's banter.
panzergruppesud wrote:Would that be a common phrase on these trucks, or would that phrase being on the side be due to them thinking it was an L1400, which was used as radio trucks?
Dunno; The Lepage book at least doesn't seem to give a clear indication on how common the similar slogan was. If however as Lepage wrote the slogan Feind Hört mit! (although I believe hört should have a lower case h) was displayed on radio equipment it seems more appropriate for radio lorries also.

Markus

User avatar
Maxschnauzer
Financial supporter
Posts: 6003
Joined: 24 Jan 2014, 08:36
Location: Philippines

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5969

Post by Maxschnauzer » 07 Dec 2014, 04:33

This car was represented as an Alfa-Romeo, and while I see similarities to some 6C models the reverse curvature top of the radiator and the square radiator badge don't look like Alfa to me. Also I'm curious about the ownership. The IZ plate seems to indicate Rhine Province. Are these pre-TR provincial police or...?
Attachments
$_57 (1).JPG
eBay photo
Cheers,
Max

User avatar
AlifRafikKhan
Member
Posts: 8002
Joined: 15 Sep 2007, 20:02
Location: Sukabumi, Indonesia
Contact:

Re: Vehicle identity requests

#5970

Post by AlifRafikKhan » 07 Dec 2014, 15:55

Hi, what kind of vehicle used by this general? Akira Takiguchi collection on WAF
Attachments
Generalleutnant Hermann-Meyer Rabingen KR04-PKW-Dia22Awa.jpg

Post Reply

Return to “The Ron Klages Panzer & other vehicles Section”