5 Panzer Regt Records

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shane1967
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5 Panzer Regt Records

Post by shane1967 » 22 May 2007 12:13

Dear colleagues

Can anyone provide me with information regarding achival holdings of 5 Pz Regt records?

cheers

Shane Lovell
Canberra, Australia

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William Russ
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Existing 5th Panzer Regiment records?

Post by William Russ » 25 May 2007 15:14

Hi Shane,
Just for clarification, do you mean the 5th Panzer Regiment when it was under the 3rd Panzer Division or when it was under the 21st Panzer Division? The only survivng records I know are the divisional records at the National Archives on microfilm. I do not believe most of the regimental records survived the war.

Best regards, Bill

shane1967
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5 Pz Regt Records

Post by shane1967 » 30 May 2007 12:52

Bill

Thanks for the response. I'm looking for the the records of 5 Pz Regt whist part of 21 Pz Div. I was hoping they might be held on microfilm at the NARA.

cheers

Shane Lovell
Canberra, Australia

Andreas
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Post by Andreas » 30 May 2007 15:14

Regimental records as far as I know were destroyed in a bombing attack in 1944. I do not think any records are being held on 5. Panzerregiment (I looked in the online holdings of BA Freiburg, which should be identical to the NARA holdings). Your best bet might be the divisional history - if it is well written it may contain info from KTBs/notes/material held by former members of the division.

All the best

Andreas

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William Russ
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21st Panzer Division Records at the NARA....

Post by William Russ » 30 May 2007 18:09

Hi Shane,
I looked up what was available on the 21st Panzer Division at the National Archives. They have on 3 microfilm rolls the war diaries #2-8 (plus Anlagen) covering the time period of November 1941 through March 1943. There is no copy of war diary #1. :(
I have found from the divisional rolls I have gotten in the past cover regimental activities fairly well. I do not think you could go wrong in getting them. Your next source would be, as Andrea has said, are post-war books written by former members of the division.

Hope this helps, Bill

PS: The rolls in the series T315/ roll numbers 767-769

shane1967
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Pz Regt 5 records

Post by shane1967 » 31 May 2007 10:47

Gentlemen

Thanks very much for you information. I have found two documents on 5 Pz Regt, both held in the EDS collection of the Imperial War Museum

Group A AL 922/2 5 Pz Regt War Diary 17 November 1941 - 15 December 1941

Group A6 AL1413/2 II./Pz regt 5 draft war diary 21 March 1941 - 6 July 1941

I contacted the IWM regarding the second document and was advised that it ran to some 300 pages. Unfortunately, the cost of getting a photocopy was prohibitive and I have not done any more about this.

Something I have not seen refered to on any of the forums is the translations of German war diaries done in the post war period. A lot was done in South Africa and some was done in New Zealand.

cheers

Shane

Andreas
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Post by Andreas » 31 May 2007 10:52

Never heard of that. very interesting. Do you have examples?

All the best

Andreas

shane1967
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Dominion translations

Post by shane1967 » 31 May 2007 11:26

Andreas

I have just been searching the New Zealand Archives and found the following:

WAII11 War History Branch, unregistered papers

Papers created and kept by the War History Branch in the period. Includes correspondence, notes, chronologies, diaries, material used in compiling draft narratives, and translations of German and Italian documents.

Unfortunately the actual items are not identified, however I have seen copies of some of their translation held by the Australian War Memorial. For example:

[Military History Section (War Records) - Special Histories, Interviews and Narratives:] War History Branch, Department of Internal Affairs, Wellington, New Zealand, German - Italian Forces in Africa, September-October 1942 Translation of appendices to PZ Afrika, War Diary Translator W D Dawson completed, June 1949

[Military History Section (War Records) - Special Histories, Interviews and Narratives:] War History Branch, Department of Internal Affairs, Wellington, New Zealand, German Italian Forces in Africa, December 1941; Translation of War Diary of German Wireless intercept company and appendices, Translation of important Documents, Translation of appendices to Pz Grp Africa, War Diary, and of PZ Grp Intelligence Diary

Examples from South Africa:

[Military History Section (War Records) - Special Histories, Interviews and Narratives:] Union War Histories Translation No 2B, War Diary of 21 Panzer Division, 14 June 1942 - 28 July 1942

[Military History Section (War Records) - Special Histories, Interviews and Narratives:] Union War Histories Translation No 2A, War Diary of 21 Panzer Division, 16 May 1942 - 13 June 1942

cheers

Shane Lovell
Canberra, Australia

Andreas
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Post by Andreas » 31 May 2007 11:42

That's excellent info. Thanks a lot!

All the best

Andreas

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Richard Hargreaves
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Post by Richard Hargreaves » 01 Jun 2007 20:26

The EDS section at the IWM is a goldmine and one surprisingly untapped by a lot of historians. It's catalogued in a rather higgledy-piggledy way - there's no real logic to the numbers given files. However, the EDS team very kindly sorted material out by subject/theatre of war.

It's by no means as comprehensive as the NARA collection or BA-MA. But on the plus side, it's all on paper photocopies (not wretched microfilms!) and there are numerous translations floating about. The British being British they copied the files pertinent to them, so you'll find comprehensive files on the Western Front 1939-1944 (which I mined for my book!) and especially for the war in North Africa.

And the reading room is a fab place to work (except in winter when it's very cold...)

A word of caution. Photocopies at the IWM are very pricey. They do the copies themselves and, if it's a book, they photocopy one page at a time, regardless of whether it's a spread! It's 33p (US 66c) per sheet. :-(

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Richard Hargreaves
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Post by Richard Hargreaves » 01 Jun 2007 20:30

Forgot to mention. The National Archives in Kew also has countless translations from France and North Africa in the CAB 146 series. This is a list I made about 10 years ago. The "X" means I didn't use the material in the file in the end.

CAB 146 EDS Section

1 Axis plans and operations in the Mediterranean 1939-1941 
2 German plan of attack in the West 1939-1940 X
3 Notes on the Norwegian campaign 
6 Operation Sealion X
10 The War in North Africa February 1941-December 1942, I 
11 The War in North Africa February 1941-December 1942, II 
12 The War in North Africa February 1941-December 1942, III 
13 The War in North Africa February 1941-December 1942, IV 
14 The War in North Africa February 1941-December 1942, V 
15 The War in North Africa February 1941-December 1942, VI 
18 The War in the Mediterranean, high-level planning November 1941-July 1942 
19 The Supply Situation in North Africa, February 1941-December 1942, I X
20 The Supply Situation in North Africa, February 1941-December 1942, II 
21 The Supply Situation in North Africa, February 1941-December 1942, III 
22 The War in Africa 1942-1943, I
23 The War in Africa 1942-1943, II X
24 The War in Africa 1942-1943, III 
25 The War in Africa 1942-1943, IV
26 The War in Africa 1942-1943, V 
27 The War in Africa 1942-1943, VI
28 The War in Sicily and Italy, May 1943-September 1943, I
29 The War in Sicily and Italy, May 1943-September 1943, II 
30 The War in Sicily and Italy, May 1943-September 1943, III 
31 The War in Sicily and Italy, May 1943-September 1943, IV 
32 The War in Sicily and Italy, May 1943-September 1943, V
33-46 The War in Italy September-December 1943
33 The War in Italy September-December 1943, I 
34 The War in Italy September-December 1943, II 
35 The War in Italy September-December 1943, III 
36 The War in Italy September-December 1943, IV 
37 The War in Italy September-December 1943, V 
38 The War in Italy September-December 1943, VI 
39 The War in Italy September-December 1943, VII 
40 The War in Italy September-December 1943, VIII 
41 The War in Italy September-December 1943, IX
42 The War in Italy September-December 1943, X
43 The War in Italy September-December 1943, XI
47 The War in Italy January-March 1944, I
48 The War in Italy January-March 1944, II
49 The War in Italy January-March 1944, III
50 The War in Italy January-March 1944, IV 
51 The War in Italy January-March 1944, V 
52 The War in Italy January-March 1944, VI 
53 The War in Italy January-March 1944, VII X
54 The War in Italy January-March 1944, VIII X
55-59 The War in Italy April-June 1944
55 Closed until 2001
62-65 The War in Italy June-July 1944
81-84 The War in Italy January-April 1945
299 Personal papers of OKH officers X
300 Miscellaneous OKH/OKW Papers X
315 Miscellaneous Italian Documents X
316 Miscellaneous Italian Documents Closed until 2001
317 Documents on the Western Campaign 1939-1940 X
318 Documents on the Western Campaign 1939-1940 X
319 The Halt Order X
320 Norway 1940 
330 The West Wall X
331 Notes on Market Garden X
334 Western Front, pre D-day X
335 Western Front, pre D-day X
336 Western Front, pre D-day 
337 OB West War Diary June-July 1944 
338 Documents relating to the Western Campaign 1944 
339 Documents relating to the Western Campaign 1944 
341 July 20th Plot 
342 Avranches counter-attack 
343 Directives relating to the Western Front 1944 
344 Withdrawal from Southern France 
348 Personalities 1944 X
349 Dieppe Raid X
350 The National Redoubt 
351 Raids on Dresden Closed until 2001
383 Records of the trials following the July 20th Putsch X
394 Himmler papers Closed until 2001
403 OKW Diary X
404 OKW Diary Closed until 2001
405 Halder Papers X
406 Halder Papers X
407 Notes on OKW War Diary
408 Greiner papers
409 Jodl Papers X
432 Operation Eclipse 
433 Rommel documents X
434 Rommel documents X
435 Minutes of Hitler’s situation conferences X
444 Study by Luftwaffe officers on the War in the Mediterranean, 1943-1944 
454 German plans for Fall Rot, 1940 
455 Conduct of Fall Rot, 1940 
474 Canadian report on Dieppe 
475 Canadian report on Sicilian Campaign 
476 Canadian report on the Italian Campaign 
477 Canadian report on the Italian Campaign 
478 Canadian report on the Italian Campaign 
479 Canadian report on the Italian Campaign 
480 Canadian report on the Italian Campaign 
481 Canadian report on the Western Campaign 
482 Canadian report on the Western Campaign X
483 Canadian report on the Western Campaign 
484 Canadian report on the Western Campaign 
485 Canadian report on the Western Campaign 

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Richard Hargreaves
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Post by Richard Hargreaves » 01 Jun 2007 20:36

And finally, for all things nautical, a visit to the Naval Historical Branch in Portsmouth is a must. It's a complete microfilm record of all extant Kriegsmarine files from KTB SKL to U-boat diaries and ship's logs...

shane1967
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Post by shane1967 » 02 Jun 2007 04:03

Halder

Thanks greatly for your contribution. Are you currently visiting the IWM? I'm interested in getting more information on the following two documents:

Group A AL 922/2 5 Pz Regt War Diary 17 November 1941 - 15 December 1941

Group A6 AL1413/2 II./Pz regt 5 draft war diary 21 March 1941 - 6 July 1941

cheers

Shane Lovell
Canberra, Australia

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Richard Hargreaves
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Post by Richard Hargreaves » 02 Jun 2007 06:58

This is a list of some of the IWM EDS AL files I have

316 P F German operations at Anzio
510/1/2 P F Army Group B weekly situation reports, May-October 1944
528/1/2 P F Seventh Army telephone log, June 6th-30th 1944
596 P F KTB 7th Panzer Division, May 9th-25th 1940
608/1-9 P F KTB AOK 10, September 13th 1943-1944
700 Army Group B daily reports, October 1944
711 P F Account of the Battle of Stalingrad
761 P F KTB Skl 1939-1944
765 P F KTB AOK 4, April 26th-May 31st 1940
766 Partial translation: Der Feldzug in Nord Afrika, 1941-1943
767 P F OKW Directives 1939-1941
768 P F OKW Directives 1942-1945
772 General Messe: The Battle of Mareth, March 16th-31st 1943
773/1-2 P KTB 90th Light Division, May 8th-August 20th 1942
785/1 P T KTB OB West, July 1944
785/2 P T KTB OB West, August 1944
785/3 KTB OB West, September 1944
785/4 KTB OB West, October 1944
785/5 KTB OB West, November 1944
785/6 KTB OB West, December 1944
786 P OB West: A Study in Command
795 P F KTB Army Group A, appendices October 1939-February 1940
833/1-3 P F KTB Afrika Korps, May-August 1942
834/1 P F KTB Afrika Korps, August 3rd-November 22nd 1942
842/E1 P F Halder Diary
866/6 P T E Panzerarmee Afrika orders, May 25th-July 27th 1942
879/1-4 P F KTB 90th Light Division, September 5th-December 31st 1942
880/1-6 KTB 90th Light Division, January 1st-April 20th 1943
898/4 P F KTB Panzerarmee Afrika, August 20th-October 10th 1942
899/7 P F Von Mackensen: Operations by First Panzer Army in the Donetz
918 P T E KTB 21st Panzer Division, June 14th-July 28th 1942
925 P F KTB 21st Panzer Division, August 24th-September 10th 1942
926/1-8 KTB 21st Panzer Division, October 23rd 1942-March 30th 1943
973/2 P F Seventh Army telephone log, July 31st-August 31st 1944
974/1-2 P F KTB AOK 7, June 6th-August 16th 1944
976 P F Seventh Army telephone log, July 31st-September 17th 1944
1023/1 P F KTB Afrika Korps, February 6th-April 14th 1941
1028/1-3 P F KTB Afrika Korps, November 25th-December 31st 1942
1043/1 P T KTB Army Group A, June 26th-October 15th 1940
1044 P F KTB 5th Gebirgs Division, May 1941
1092 P F Fall Gelb: Armoured strength
1330 P F OB Südwest situation reports, December 1st-28th 1944
1331 P F KTB 16th Panzer Division, November 14th-28th 1943
1332 P F KTB 16th Panzer Division, November 1943-January 1944
1341/c P T FrHO Files 1939-1942
1346 P KTB LXXVI Panzer Corps, November 1943-January 1944
1347 P F XIV Panzer Corps situation reports, spring 1944
1349/1-11 P Rommel: personal papers and reports 1941-1943
1354 P T E F KTB AOK 6, May 9th-31st 1944
1356/1-2 P F KTB LI Gebirgs Corps, May 8th-June 7th 1944
1360/1-2 P F KTB AOK 14, July 17th-August 20th 1944
1367 P T E FrHO Lageberichte Ost, July 1940-June 1941
1372 P F KTB Army Group B appendices, May 9th-June 4th 1940
1397 P KTB Panzergruppe 1, February 2nd-July 10th 1941
1402/1-3 P KTB Afrika Korps, January 1st-February 28th 1943
1405 P T E F Army Group B Situation reports May-June 1940
1426 The ‘Marcks Plan’
1427 P Hossbach: Operations of Fourth Army in East Prussia
1428 P F KTB Army Group A, May 9th-31st 1940
1430/1-2 P T E F KTB Gruppe XXI, April 9th-26th 1940
1433 P F KTB Army Group B, May 9th-June 4th 1940
1434 P T E F KTB XV Panzer Corps May 10th-July 4th 1940
1440 P T E F KTB XIX Panzer Corps May 9th-June 24th 1940
1489 P F OKH Study: Military-political situation, March 1942
1502 P T E F KTB XXXIX Corps, May 13th-14th 1940
1517 P F Extracts from German war diaries in North Africa, 1941
1520 P T E Execution of British PoWs by SS Totenkopf Division, 1940
1528/3 P T Reports by OB West, Army Group B and FrHW 1944
1531/3 P T Army Group B daily reports, June-August 1944
1538/1-2 P T KTB LXXXI Corps, reports and telecons August-October 1944
1547/1-2 P T KTB Panzer Lehr Division, January-July 1944
1581/7 P T OKW Directives: Wacht am Rhein, November 1944-January 1945
1601/1-3 OB West Tagesmeldungen July-September 1944
1654/1 KTB 15th Panzer Division, November 19th-December 16th 1941
1656 P F KTB 15th Panzer Division, August 29th-December 18th 1942
1657/1 P F KTB 15th Panzer Division, October 23rd-November 11th 1942
1669 P T FrHW Correspondence 1940-1943
1672 P T FrHW Correspondence 1943-1945
P Italian reports on conferences with the Germans December 1942
1697/3 P T E Rommel’s Normandy Papers
1761 P T E F OB Süd Tagesmeldungen, January-June 1943
1789 P T Reports by the German General in Italy, January-May 1943
1809/a Report by Bastico on operations, November 1942-February 1943
1875 P T KTB X Corps, September 1940-July 1941
1899/1-2 KTB 10th Panzer Division, March 5th 1943
1901/1-6 P T E KTB PzAOK 5, June-October 1944
1933 P Canaris papers, September 9th 1939-June 5th 1943
1960/1-7 OB Südwest Tagesmeldungen 1/1-31/1/45
2509 P Weidling: Der Endkampf in Berlin
2520/1 Jodl’s study on the Ardennes offensive
2778/2 P Beck’s papers, 1935-1938
2778/3 P Fritsch’s papers 1938
2831 P Schörner, personal papers
2855 Admiral Krancke: Post-mortem of the Normandy landings
2863 Negotiations for the surrender of German forces in Italy 1945

shane1967
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Post by shane1967 » 02 Jun 2007 10:18

Halder

Thanks for listing what you have. Am I correct in assuming that KTB refers to Order of battle? Could you please advise what is on the following.

1517 P F Extracts from German war diaries in North Africa, 1941
1023/1 P F KTB Afrika Korps, February 6th-April 14th 1941

cheers

Shane

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