Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Discussions on all (non-biographical) aspects of the Luftwaffe air units and general discussions on the Luftwaffe.
User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 17 Oct 2011 09:28

Does anyone have payload/range charts for the Ju 52 standard transport plane?

What I'm looking for is something like this:

Image

Many thanks!
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 17 Oct 2011 11:10

In actual fact, I think it might be useful to add as much other technical information as possible here, to shed some more light on the venerable Auntie Ju.
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

User avatar
Snautzer05
Member
Posts: 312
Joined: 25 May 2011 21:15

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Snautzer05 » 17 Oct 2011 11:23

there were many versions of this plane. but this is generally correct for the type
Clipboard01.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 17 Oct 2011 11:45

Thanks. I am particularly interested in range/payload, because that is a measure of effectiveness to me. I have seen standard ranges of 1,000/1,100km, extendable to 1,300 with aux tanks, but the latter would presumably eat into payload. But was the former with max payload, or a reduced load?

The version I am most interested in is the 1941 production standard.
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

User avatar
phylo_roadking
Member
Posts: 17489
Joined: 30 Apr 2006 23:31
Location: Belfast

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by phylo_roadking » 17 Oct 2011 13:00

That would be the Ju52/3mg7e. The LW started the war with a mixed fleet of 3mg3e's and 3mg4e's, the 3mg5e was starting to appear for Norway, the 3mg6e and 7e appeared for April/May 1941.
Twenty years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs....
Lord, please keep Kevin Bacon alive...

User avatar
phylo_roadking
Member
Posts: 17489
Joined: 30 Apr 2006 23:31
Location: Belfast

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by phylo_roadking » 17 Oct 2011 15:36

I am particularly interested in range/payload, because that is a measure of effectiveness to me.
For the militarised /3mge aircraft, Nowarra gives a cargo weight capacity of 4100 kgs, and an all-up flying weight of 10,000 kg...and an empty weight of 5900 kg. Maximum range from Junker's paperwork is 1500km (but see below!!!), with 1370 litres of fuel in four wing tanks and one gravity tank in the fuselage.

However - that 4100 Kgs maximum cargo capacity isn't all in the fuselage - it's a combination figure that includes the passenger area, the cargo hold rear area, the light luggage holds (not often used, and not available at all in float planes), and the four cargo holds between pairs of frame supports. The float plane versions each also had 6 2.5 cubic meter cargo spaces in 3 holds per float partly replacing the "light luggage holds" that weren't available in the Wasser version, as this was where the struts mounted.

Maximum speed 300 km/hr, max cruising speed 285 km/hr, best economy cruising speed (at 2500m) 270 Km/hr.

Fuel consumption at that "best economy cruising" was 113 litres per every 100 kilometers....or in reality ~1200km range.
Twenty years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs....
Lord, please keep Kevin Bacon alive...

User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 17 Oct 2011 16:03

Even less, once you take into account warming up, taxi, and take-off.

Many thanks!
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

User avatar
phylo_roadking
Member
Posts: 17489
Joined: 30 Apr 2006 23:31
Location: Belfast

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by phylo_roadking » 18 Oct 2011 01:18

As an aside - later marks had an extra, small third tank in the outer wing bay of each wing, but the range figures I've seen for these marks...~810 miles...would indicate only an additional 50 litres in each.
Twenty years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs....
Lord, please keep Kevin Bacon alive...

User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 18 Oct 2011 09:28

Interesting, thanks. But still, nobody seems to be able to clearly answer if the 1,000km range was @ max payload. :(
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

Jon G.
Member
Posts: 6647
Joined: 17 Feb 2004 01:12
Location: Europe

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Jon G. » 18 Oct 2011 10:48

An image from Vom Original zum Modell: Junkers Ju 52 p 24, by Erfurth & Miertsch, a delightfully Nowarra-free title, and additionally a book right down my alley since it's full of numbers:

Image
...or 2,400 litres of fuel distrubuted in a series of main tanks ('Hauptbehälter') and two auxiliary tanks ('Zusatzbehälter') in addition, 68 litres of lubricants were kept in a fuselage tank. I wonder how much this fuel layout could be tweaked with?

The cargo door dimensions are given as 1230 x 1800 mm, not quite enough for a Tiger tank. I'm sure that's bad news in the what-if section.

User avatar
Snautzer05
Member
Posts: 312
Joined: 25 May 2011 21:15

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Snautzer05 » 18 Oct 2011 13:25

Clipboard01.jpg
Clipboard03.jpg
Clipboard04.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
phylo_roadking
Member
Posts: 17489
Joined: 30 Apr 2006 23:31
Location: Belfast

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by phylo_roadking » 18 Oct 2011 13:48

...or 2,400 litres of fuel distrubuted in a series of main tanks ('Hauptbehälter') and two auxiliary tanks ('Zusatzbehälter') in addition, 68 litres of lubricants were kept in a fuselage tank. I wonder how much this fuel layout could be tweaked with?
Jon....which mark of Ju52??? There's definitely a jump in range (and I presume therefore fuel capacity) somewhere around the middle of its development history...there were 14 militarised marks of the 52. My figure for the four-main tanks/single auxiliary refer to the early 3mge's.
Twenty years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs....
Lord, please keep Kevin Bacon alive...

User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 18 Oct 2011 13:57

Many thanks!

So the workshop Auntie had a max payload at max fuel of 2.59 metric tons. But would this also give the max range (one reason why it might not have been is that a lot more fuel would be burned during take-off and climb, I guess)?

Questions, could fuel be traded for payload? Or were there structural limits to how much could be packed into the plane?
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

User avatar
Urmel
Member
Posts: 4442
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 09:34
Location: The late JBond

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by Urmel » 18 Oct 2011 13:58

Jon G. wrote:The cargo door dimensions are given as 1230 x 1800 mm, not quite enough for a Tiger tank. I'm sure that's bad news in the what-if section.
Not just Tigers. What they also found was that the Zis-3 gun could not be transported by air to North Africa. The Pak 38 could, however. Maybe two of them?
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

User avatar
phylo_roadking
Member
Posts: 17489
Joined: 30 Apr 2006 23:31
Location: Belfast

Re: Ju 52/3M payload/range charts

Post by phylo_roadking » 18 Oct 2011 14:17

Or were there structural limits to how much could be packed into the plane?
Yes, and where; the maximum permissible load between ribs 3 and 5 was 400 Kg/m2, between ribs 5 and 8 it was 350 Kg/m2...and the maximum in the lower luggage holds was 350 Kg/m2.

To go back to an earlier point I raised - From Nowarra...
The experience gained in the West and in Norway with the Ju52/3mg3e and g4e resulted in further development work and the g5e version. This version was similar in part to the g4e and could be modified from landing gear to floats, but was not suitable for dropping paratoops since it could not be fitted with conversion unit F. All other versions could be fitted with the following conversion units:
E - loading device for crate transport
R - seating for 16 passengers
H - flying lecture room
St - fittings to move ground personnel
S - interior equipment to use as ambulance
F - interior fittings for paratroopers.
And if not fitted - you sat on the floor! :lol:

The g5e was followed by the g6e that could only use wheels or skis (not floats), and had a different radio - and the g7e that had a longer loading hatch.
Last edited by phylo_roadking on 18 Oct 2011 14:48, edited 1 time in total.
Twenty years ago we had Johnny Cash, Bob Hope and Steve Jobs. Now we have no Cash, no Hope and no Jobs....
Lord, please keep Kevin Bacon alive...

Return to “Luftwaffe air units and Luftwaffe in general”