"Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

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Trommelfeuer
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"Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#1

Post by Trommelfeuer » 23 Apr 2003, 18:03

I read some articles about the "Haunebu" / "Vril", now I wonder if this is a joke / myth / silly science-fiction stuff.... ?

Image
(...click the pic..)

One thing is very curious....why should they be able to built flying saucers but on the other hand they cannot come up with a good photo of it ? :P

Is there a good english source on this crazy stuff ?

With friendly greetings, Sven

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#2

Post by Christian Ankerstjerne » 23 Apr 2003, 18:31

Definately some kind of a joke. Besides the fact that the design woudl be almost impossible to get airborne, even more difficult to stabilize once airborne and impossible to be able to reach the speeds claimed, I don't recall the SS being involved in any kind of research of aircrafts, or even vehicles altogether...

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...

#3

Post by Trommelfeuer » 23 Apr 2003, 19:19

:D Right! Thank you for your answer Christian!

With friendly greetings, Sven

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#4

Post by odellus » 25 Aug 2008, 16:33

I hate to seem contrary, but flying saucers are indeed possible and it is in all likelihood true that the Germans had devised and constructed Flying Discs.

I know they look unlike anything you have ever ridden on, but that is because flying discs don't move through space the way a normal aircraft does. They use wireless electromagnetic principles(radar and microwaves), degaussing coils, soliton(localized) wave guides, and it all works to move the luminiferous aether around the vessel instead of directly through the matter which constitutes the ship in a process similar to supercavitation in fluid dynamics.

This approach eliminates any inertial forces one would feel on the disc, unlike the way you press into your seat when your fight takes off on today's commercial chemical-propulsion aircraft. This is so because electromagnetic propulsion circumvents the problem of the Lorentzian time-dilation/length-contraction factor associated with normal momentum because without supercavitation, superfine aether particles "bump" into the charges of the mass. With this method of travel, speeds faster than light are easily attainable, as there is no change in the inertia(mass) of the ship as it gains speed.

Thus one could hypothetically go from 0 to 300,000,00 meters a second in the blink of an eye without spilling your coffee using such a means of propulsion.

I saw one do that one time out in Hawai'i. Pretty cool. It left a faint red plasma wake in the air which was visible at night, and it was gone quicker than I had time to look at it in the first place. You actually put a picture of a disc just like it up in this article.

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#5

Post by Ironmachine » 25 Aug 2008, 16:55

It seems that a new comedian is born! :lol:

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#6

Post by Kocur » 25 Aug 2008, 17:26

odellus wrote: it all works to move the luminiferous aether around the vessel
The same aether that was thought to be the "substance" of light before even idea of electromagnetic field was thought, let alone Einstein's formed his wave–particle duality theory, and which... doesn't exist? If so, it's all clear now :wink:

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#7

Post by Michael Emrys » 26 Aug 2008, 02:34

odellus wrote:Thus one could hypothetically go from 0 to 300,000,00 meters a second in the blink of an eye without spilling your coffee using such a means of propulsion.
Ummm, in that case, why did Germany lose the war?

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#8

Post by phylo_roadking » 26 Aug 2008, 04:20

Michael - because THEY were trying it with acorn coffee, of course!!!

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#9

Post by odellus » 26 Aug 2008, 08:00

I honestly don't know.

Maybe the United Soviet States gave them a good out. It's not like the U.S.S. didn't have something that would knock the Nazis out of the sky. A radar can be used to do pretty amazing things, given as it is that everything is composed of electrical materials.

I wouldn't want to be in a Flying Saucer someone was Death Raying. Have you ever put metal in the microwave?

And God only knows what is true and what is false regarding the Philadelphia Experiment.

Maybe the Germans handed over what they knew about Flying Machines to the U.S. in return for a slap on the wrist for the death camps and a new home in Argentina. Operation Paperclip?

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#10

Post by odellus » 26 Aug 2008, 08:11

Image
Neuschwabenland
Image
Cool, huh?

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#11

Post by SES » 26 Aug 2008, 10:28

odellus wrote:I hate to seem contrary, but flying saucers are indeed possible and it is in all likelihood true that the Germans had devised and constructed Flying Discs.



Thus one could hypothetically go from 0 to 300,000,00 meters a second in the blink of an eye without spilling your coffee using such a means of propulsion.
Can you please explain how exactly the crew would sustain the several 1.000 G during such a maneuver?
SES

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#12

Post by LWD » 26 Aug 2008, 16:41

odellus wrote:...I know they look unlike anything you have ever ridden on, but that is because flying discs don't move through space the way a normal aircraft does. They use wireless electromagnetic principles(radar and microwaves), degaussing coils, soliton(localized) wave guides, and it all works to move the luminiferous aether around the vessel instead of directly through the matter which constitutes the ship in a process similar to supercavitation in fluid dynamics.
That looks like a bunch of more or less random technical terms thrown together. "wireless eltectromagnetic principles" is a rather meaningless term. If you mean how electromagnetic waves propogate it has nothing to do with propelling a plane of any type in the 20th century. Degaussing coils and wave guides are completly different objects and again not related to vehicle propulsion. If the aether is luminiferous (glowing iron?) why can't we see it. Normal physics implies if you go from point a to point be you have to pass through the distance between them and any intervening matter. My first impression is that this was an attempt at humer and not intent to be take seriously latter post led me to question that.
This approach eliminates any inertial forces one would feel on the disc,...
There are no such thing as inertial forces. Inertia is a fundemental property of matter.
...This is so because electromagnetic propulsion circumvents the problem of the Lorentzian time-dilation/length-contraction factor associated with normal momentum because without supercavitation, superfine aether particles "bump" into the charges of the mass. With this method of travel, speeds faster than light are easily attainable, as there is no change in the inertia(mass) of the ship as it gains speed.
You do realize that what you are proposing requires throwing out at least one of the three fundamental principles of modern physics?
Thus one could hypothetically go from 0 to 300,000,00 meters a second in the blink of an eye without spilling your coffee using such a means of propulsion.
In an alternate universe with different physics.
I saw one do that one time out in Hawai'i. Pretty cool. It left a faint red plasma wake in the air which was visible at night, and it was gone quicker than I had time to look at it in the first place. You actually put a picture of a disc just like it up in this article.
Maybe my first impression was right.

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#13

Post by odellus » 26 Aug 2008, 17:49

Basically, the Gs never affect the crew because they sit inside an "electromagnetic bottle."

As you are well aware, the resistance a pilot feels while turning is his body's momentum wanting him to go in a straight line at a constant speed. Any variation from the straight line at a constant speed is felt as a force which immediately grips his body, but this is just the ship pushing on him as it turns.

Inside this bubble of electrical and magnetic fields, the ship never moves. The ship sits right where it was in space before it was turned on. The machinery of the ship creates a field around the vessel that essentially causes the very essence of space, the ether, to flow around the ship's "electromagnetic bottle" in whichever velocity (speed and direction) the pilot chooses. None of the forces that act on a piece of matter that is moving through the ether effect the substances inside the bottle, thus the ship's crew never actually moves through any ether independently of the ship. So they could hit the brakes, or turn at a million miles and hour, and all it would not affect the crew because they hadn't developed any momentum during the filght, as if sitting in another reality.

Because the ether moves around the ship, there is no Lorentz Length Contraction, so the ship could go as fast as it wanted to without any time dilation effects. The crew essentially sits in a magnetic pocket and moves the world around them. Does that make sense? If we knew with 100% certainty the mechanics of the cosmos, we could design a compass that pointed toward the center, no matter where we were in creation. This would allow us to know our absolute speed through the ether. This is necessary equipment for the operation of Flying Machines, and a problem which plagued Physics at the turn of the 20th century which Einstein was hoisted on our shoulders for telling us not to consider.

i) I am not joking. Electrodynamics is my favorite area of research.
ii) I am throwing away anything which bring rise to a contradiction, as Relativity does in its description of the Homopolar Generator (Faraday Disk).
iii) I don't care if no one believes me, because the Flying Machine I saw in Hawai'i wasn't the first one I ever saw, nor the last. If you have never seen one, you will. Trust me. You will.

I apologize in my jargon seems poorly put together. I don't always like the word "Electrical', because Maxwell unified Electricity and Magnetism, making them different aspect of the same field. Thus if I am speaking of the physical principles Nikola Tesla exploited during his experiments in the wireless transmission of electrical power, please give me the benefit of the doubt. Or don't. Reductio ad Absurdum is a common logical fallacy, and one I am all to used to dealing with.

The vacuum has a dielectric constant, and can therefore be polarized. The Wireless Principles I referred to are the techniques used to create a region of high polarity in the ether surrounding the ship, in whatever direction the ship needs to move. Don't argue with me about space being a vacuum. Modern Physics has my back on the Zero Point Radiation, as does Einstein, Casmir's Effect proves it, and space can be polarized. The degaussing is necessary to make sure that the fields the ship is creating outside the hull stay outside the hull (reminiscent of Meissner Effect ). We now have a situation where we have created two oppositely charged plasmas on either side of the craft, and excluded any field lines from penetrating the hull of the ship. Any slight change in the electrostatic field of the ship's hull would generate a enormous force on space, and space would respond with an enormous push/pull on the ship. The plasma which we used to propel the ship would be carried along while the aether inside the ship remained unaffected. This would make the changing the direction of space's polarization akin to turning a pair of steering wheels, and changing the electrostatic field of the vessel would be equivalent to pressing the accelerator (which sign of charge, + or -, would determine if you went forward or in reverse).

If I sound like I know what I am talking about, it is just from force of habit. I am not sure exactly how a flying disc works. I just cannot stand to not think about the most interesting thing I have ever seen from a critical standpoint because I am a physicist. Therefore I am open to any criticisms and I have no problem explaining any of my positions. You can even cuss me and talk about my mama. I don't mind.

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#14

Post by phylo_roadking » 26 Aug 2008, 18:19

Guys I'm REALLY sorry about this. I can't help it. It's a natural reaction. I know you won't mind..I hope....
i) I am not joking. Electrodynamics is my favorite area of research.
ii) I am throwing away anything which bring rise to a contradiction, as Relativity does in its description of the Homopolar Generator (Faraday Disk).
iii) I don't care if no one believes me, because the Flying Machine I saw in Hawai'i wasn't the first one I ever saw, nor the last. If you have never seen one, you will. Trust me. You will.

I apologize in my jargon seems poorly put together. I don't always like the word "Electrical', because Maxwell unified Electricity and Magnetism, making them different aspect of the same field. Thus if I am speaking of the physical principles Nikola Tesla exploited during his experiments in the wireless transmission of electrical power, please give me the benefit of the doubt
If I sound like I know what I am talking about, it is just from force of habit.
...NOW we know what Paul Harker's next project is... :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: "Haunebu" & "Vril" flying saucers

#15

Post by LWD » 26 Aug 2008, 18:23

odellus wrote: ...Inside this bubble of electrical and magnetic fields, the ship never moves. The ship sits right where it was in space before it was turned on.
Movement isn't the problem. Indeed we are all moving with respect to something. Acceleration is the problem and to go anywhere you have to accelerate. Bottle or not this doesn't change at least in the real world.
...So they could hit the brakes, or turn at a million miles and hour, and all it would not affect the crew because they hadn't developed any momentum during the filght, as if sitting in another reality.
Have you ever consider how much energy this would take?
Because the ether moves around the ship,
There is no ether... that theory was discarded a long time ago.
there is no Lorentz Length Contraction, so the ship could go as fast as it wanted to without any time dilation effects.
Lorentzian contraction and time dilation are effects of relative velocity they are independent of acceleration. So the above is nonsensical.
.... Does that make sense?
Not in the slitest.
If we knew with 100% certainty the mechanics of the cosmos, we could design a compass that pointed toward the center, no matter where we were in creation.
Possibly and possibly not. It may not even have a center.
This would allow us to know our absolute speed through the ether.
There is no such thing as "absolute speed"
i) I am not joking. Electrodynamics is my favorite area of research.
Then you need to study more.
ii) I am throwing away anything which bring rise to a contradiction, as Relativity does in its description of the Homopolar Generator (Faraday Disk).
If I read this right you are throwing away anything that you don't agree with/doesn't fit your world veiw. In which case you are not even making a pretence of science.
iii) I don't care if no one believes me, because the Flying Machine I saw in Hawai'i wasn't the first one I ever saw, nor the last. If you have never seen one, you will. Trust me. You will.
I don't doubt you are seeing things. I doubt I'll see any flying saucer though.
I apologize in my jargon seems poorly put together. I don't always like the word "Electrical', because Maxwell unified Electricity and Magnetism, making them different aspect of the same field. Thus if I am speaking of the physical principles Nikola Tesla exploited during his experiments in the wireless transmission of electrical power, please give me the benefit of the doubt. Or don't. Reductio ad Absurdum is a common logical fallacy, and one I am all to used to dealing with.

The vacuum has a dielectric constant, and can therefore be polarized. The Wireless Principles I referred to are the techniques used to create a region of high polarity in the ether surrounding the ship, in whatever direction the ship needs to move.
Your point is?
Don't argue with me about space being a vacuum.
In some sences it's obvously not. I'm just not sure how you are using the terms or what you mean.
...If I sound like I know what I am talking about, it is just from force of habit.
Don't worry you don't.
I am not sure exactly how a flying disc works.
That I believe.

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