Why was the Luftwaffe ineffective late in the war?

[PanzerKing]

Everyone's heard that Germany's main problem with the Luftwaffe late in the war was the lack of trained pilots. Is that the real reason? How were the allies able to gain air superiority and when did the tide really turn for the Luftwaffe?

Thanks!

PS - Does anyone have any numbers or statistics about the Luftwaffe's performance in 1944 and 1945?

[Eightball]

I'd say the Luftwaffe started going sour after the Battle of Britain.

[Sgt. Reese]

not enough pilots.

[ChristopherPerrien]

No gas to train pilots. No gas to fly missions.

[tonyh]

By the time the combined bombing offensive got really going in 1943 the Luftwaffe was at war for nearly 4 years. It was a shadow of its former self. It had suffered a steady stream of losses, especially in Russia. Although people tend to think that the Jadgwaffe had it "easy" in Russia. Its actually not the case. While the ratio of kils/losses weigh in favor of the Luftwaffe, every loss the Germans had hit harder than the losses for the VVS.

By 1943 these losses on all fronts had weakened the Luftwaffe considerably.

Also while the average Luftwaffe pilot had three years of traning in 1938-1941, the training programs had be gradually cut so that the program of 1943 was radically different to the program of 1940, resulting in undertrained young pilots being rushed to the frontgeschwader.

Another point is while there were enough planes, there were not enough pilots, or fuel.

The last point is that the allies had far, far more aircraft than the Luftwaffe possesed. The USAAF alone outnumbered the Jadgwaffe completely. Also the jadgwaffe were under orders to attack the bombers, thus being forced to ignore the fighters. This meant that the US and British fighter aircraft could select their targets at will, as the concentration was on downing the bomber.

So...

Numbers.
Target orders.
Pilot numbers and training
Fuel.

Tony

[Caldric]

There is also skill of the allies in air combat.

[Kugelblitz]

The Luftwaffe was unable to perform well due of the following points:

1) The USAF gain air superiority over Europe.
2) The LW was unable to stop the bomber raids due of the big amount of bomber in the formations and the constant attack to factories close the oportunity of the Germans to made a strong force to attack the bombers.
3) The LW lost very important "Experten" in those battles.
4) No fuel in adecuate quantity.

The USAF pilots wasn`t better trained than German ones, basically they got air superiority and this is very important to do team work
An air force don`t success with some aces fighting individually, that was the success that the German had in the Battle of Britain, but as I said before, in order to do team work you need fighters to make a good team

[Hans N]

The Luftwaffe was unable to perform well due of the following points:

1) The USAF gain air superiority over Europe.
2) The LW was unable to stop the bomber raids due of the big amount of bomber in the formations and the constant attack to factories close the oportunity of the Germans to made a strong force to attack the bombers.
3) The LW lost very important "Experten" in those battles.
4) No fuel in adecuate quantity.

The USAF pilots wasn`t better trained than German ones, basically they got air superiority and this is very important to do team work
An air force don`t success with some aces fighting individually, that was the success that the German had in the Battle of Britain, but as I said before, in order to do team work you need fighters to make a good team

Coulden´t agree more

[Erich]

I agree with most of what has been said except for the sentance about too many bombers. As several day fighter Luftwaffe aces have told me in interviews, the bombers did not concern them as they could slaughter them at will, it was the overabundance of Allied escort fighters, especially the P-51D that was superior to all German fighters in 44-45, and the German pilots were overwhelmed to the point that on many an occassion they could not even set up an attack from the rear with their Gefechtsverband.......only to disperse and be jumped with a ratio of 7/8 to 1.

~E

[Kugelblitz]

I agree with most of what has been said except for the sentance about too many bombers. As several day fighter Luftwaffe aces have told me in interviews, the bombers did not concern them as they could slaughter them at will, it was the overabundance of Allied escort fighters, especially the P-51D that was superior to all German fighters in 44-45, and the German pilots were overwhelmed to the point that on many an occassion they could not even set up an attack from the rear with their Gefechtsverband.......only to disperse and be jumped with a ratio of 7/8 to 1.

~E

The point was that there was a lot of bombers to shot down, hundreds of them was in each bombing mission, is imposible to destroy all of them, even the half, specially when they had escort.
For example in Schweinfurt the bomber flight was from 250+ planes and they was unescorted, the LW perform very well against them destroying a lot, but the target was reached by an important number of survivors and it was bombed. Imagine do the same against the late war 1000 bombers formations , probably Galland´s plane of the Big Blow could be very interesting against it, but the plane reserves was used on operation Bodenplate

[tonyh]

>>The USAF pilots wasn`t better trained than German ones<<

Not true. By 1943, the US pilot training period was increasing, while the Luftwafe pilot training program was having corners continuiously cut off of it. By 1944, the gluf between the programs was quite large. In 44 and 45, the US and RAF pilots were far better trained than their Luftwaffe counterpart.

Tony

[gabriel pagliarani]

From "the 1st and the last" David Baker's Adolf Galland Biography 2nd issue (1988). Original in English by Windrow Green Ltd, Italian translation by Ermanno Albetrelli Editore 1998. ISBN-88-85909-90-6. Chapter XXI.
Translation from italian is mine. Sorry in advance for gaps laps and beans...
May 5th 1945 Americans found Galland wearing a complete high ranking General uniform of Luftwaffe but with the right leg of the uniform cut by cause of a plaster casting. Any other thing he had gained before has been brought away (..he was confined at home waiting an order of suicide directly from Adolf Hitler..) After 15 years of incredible efforts spent in the attempt to lift up Germany from the terrible sufferings eye-witnessed when he was a child, Galland had no reply to too many sacrifices done and seen. About 97000 men of Luftaffe were reported KIA, MIA, WIA and 20300 of those were Fighter pilots. These fighters pretended a very high prices from enemies: 70000 of 120000 foes shot down by Luftwaffe were shot down from fighters. Individual scores were incredible and surely not to be increased in any future; 2 pilots of those braves , Hartmann and Barkhorn shot down more than 300 enemies each; 13 pilots killed 200/300 enemies; 92 killed 100/200 enemies; totally 467 pilots killed more than 40 enemy each (..the best result for Allied..)These were the figures of Jagdwaffe. Galland had the honour to lead in combat this Elite: large part of them were normal german youngs without any political idea, but hopeful in their Country and their own possibilities. The fate of Jagdwaffe's pilots was to fly and fight till death: the difference with Angloamericans was in the reward for victories obtained. Their own reward was in being left to the front for struggle again, a premium ticket to death."
Victory rate was 3:1.What else about Jagdwaffe's figures? :roll:

[Cantankerous]

The Luftwaffe was unable to perform well due of the following points:

1) The USAF gain air superiority over Europe.
2) The LW was unable to stop the bomber raids due of the big amount of bomber in the formations and the constant attack to factories close the oportunity of the Germans to made a strong force to attack the bombers.
3) The LW lost very important "Experten" in those battles.
4) No fuel in adecuate quantity.

The USAF pilots wasn`t better trained than German ones, basically they got air superiority and this is very important to do team work
An air force don`t success with some aces fighting individually, that was the success that the German had in the Battle of Britain, but as I said before, in order to do team work you need fighters to make a good team

Even though this thread is 19 years old, I wanted to ask what role the USAAF air raids on the oil fields at Ploesti, Romania, played in impairing the ability of the Luftwaffe to obtain additional fuel supplies to keep its aircraft up and running in its fight against USAAF and RAF warplanes, because there is the possibility that Hermann Göring's addiction to drugs most likely affected the Luftwaffe's decisions regarding the conduct of its air war against the Eighth Air Force, which is why Hitler blamed incompetent Luftwaffe officers for letting the Eighth Air Force outmaneuver the Bf 109s, Fw 190s, Bf 110s, and Me 410s in the skies over Germany.