"bubble cockpit" ?

Discussions on all (non-biographical) aspects of the Luftwaffe air units and general discussions on the Luftwaffe.
Post Reply
User avatar
Uninen
Member
Posts: 676
Joined: 21 Feb 2004, 20:26
Location: Festung Europa, Finnland

"bubble cockpit" ?

#1

Post by Uninen » 29 Dec 2004, 02:52

Which fighter aircraft had the first "bubble cockpit" with 360 (or nearly) degree view? Was it FW 190 and whos invention was the "bubble cockpit type"?

User avatar
K-9
Member
Posts: 480
Joined: 24 Sep 2003, 18:40
Location: Romania

#2

Post by K-9 » 29 Dec 2004, 03:02

I think it was the american P-51 "Mustang"...


User avatar
Uninen
Member
Posts: 676
Joined: 21 Feb 2004, 20:26
Location: Festung Europa, Finnland

#3

Post by Uninen » 29 Dec 2004, 03:28

Wasnt FW 190 there way before P-51?

http://www.bibl.u-szeged.hu/bibl/mil/ww ... w190_1.jpg

And it does have high-visibility cockpit as you can see..
The Fw 190 prototype first flew on June 1,1939 and production deliveries began in late 1940.
North American Aviation originally designed the Mustang in response to a British specification. They agreed to produce the first prototype only 4 months after signing the contract in April 1940. By the end of 1941 North American had delivered the first Mustang to England for test flights.
And as far as i can recall, only the late Mustangs had high-visibility cockpits, early and mid series models having similar to those of early Bf 109 and Spitfire being build of multiple panels..

User avatar
Uninen
Member
Posts: 676
Joined: 21 Feb 2004, 20:26
Location: Festung Europa, Finnland

#4

Post by Uninen » 29 Dec 2004, 03:36

P-51 had only from the D-model so called "bubble cockpit" and that was from June 44 onwards..

http://www.acepilots.com/planes/p51_mustang.html
http://www.acepilots.com/planes/p51d_mustang.html

Before that this is how P-51 cockpits were:

ImageImage
"Birdcage" / "bulbous Malcolm hood"

And only in June 1944 with the D-model

Image
"Bubble canopy"

So who did originaly invent it? Was it the Germans or Britts?
The 190 was also one of the first fighters to feature a clear rear canopy, allowing pilots to keep an excellent lookout for enemy fighters.
http://www.aviation-history.com/focke-wulf/fw190.html

User avatar
Tim Smith
Member
Posts: 6177
Joined: 19 Aug 2002, 13:15
Location: UK

#5

Post by Tim Smith » 29 Dec 2004, 04:37

No, no, no...

First WWII fighter with 360 degree vision was:

Japanese Ki-27 'Nate' fighter from 1937. Still operational in China and Burma front, 1941-1942.

http://www.ijaafpics.com/JB&W2/Ki-27-23.jpg

User avatar
Cantankerous
Member
Posts: 1277
Joined: 01 Sep 2019, 22:22
Location: Newport Coast

Re: bubble cockpit

#6

Post by Cantankerous » 25 Dec 2022, 00:13

Uninen wrote:
29 Dec 2004, 03:28
Wasnt FW 190 there way before P-51?

http://www.bibl.u-szeged.hu/bibl/mil/ww ... w190_1.jpg

And it does have high-visibility cockpit as you can see..
The Fw 190 prototype first flew on June 1,1939 and production deliveries began in late 1940.
North American Aviation originally designed the Mustang in response to a British specification. They agreed to produce the first prototype only 4 months after signing the contract in April 1940. By the end of 1941 North American had delivered the first Mustang to England for test flights.
And as far as i can recall, only the late Mustangs had high-visibility cockpits, early and mid series models having similar to those of early Bf 109 and Spitfire being build of multiple panels..
Even though this thread is 18 years old, I should note that the Miles M.20 was the first fighter aircraft built with a bubble cockpit canopy, and it first flew on September 15, 1940. Two prototypes were built, and the M.20 was intended as an emergency fighter design in case that Luftwaffe air raids on the UK disrupted production of the Hawker Hurricane and Supermarine Spitfire. However, Luftwaffe air raids on Hawker and Supermarine factories failed to seriously affect production of the Hurricane and Spitfire, so the Miles M.20 was not ordered into production.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_M.20

User avatar
Pips
Member
Posts: 1280
Joined: 26 Jun 2005, 09:44
Location: Country NSW, Australia

Re: "bubble cockpit" ?

#7

Post by Pips » 25 Dec 2022, 00:26

I believe the Mitsubishi A6M Zero was the first operational fighter fitted with a Bubble canopy.

The prototype first flew on 1 April, 1939. It was first employed on operations in July 1940 when 15 were shipped to China. It's first combat occurred in August 1940 over Chungking.

User avatar
ShindenKai
Member
Posts: 670
Joined: 29 Jan 2012, 06:43
Location: USA

Re: "bubble cockpit" ?

#8

Post by ShindenKai » 30 Dec 2022, 22:13

Pips wrote:
25 Dec 2022, 00:26
I believe the Mitsubishi A6M Zero was the first operational fighter fitted with a Bubble canopy.

The prototype first flew on 1 April, 1939. It was first employed on operations in July 1940 when 15 were shipped to China. It's first combat occurred in August 1940 over Chungking.
I believe you're correct. Though the Ki-27 in later versions did also have a "bubble-top", it was not initially designed with such, as the Zero was.

User avatar
Grzesio
Member
Posts: 981
Joined: 11 Jul 2005, 15:55
Location: Poland
Contact:

Re: "bubble cockpit" ?

#9

Post by Grzesio » 30 Dec 2022, 23:07

I think, the "bubble cockpit" refers to a one piece canopy without bracing and in this case Miles M.20 seems to be first indeed.
In case of teardrop canopies with bracing, the Zero was clearly not the first aircraft with such a feature, as e.g. Westland Whirlwind was first flown in 1938 already.

User avatar
ShindenKai
Member
Posts: 670
Joined: 29 Jan 2012, 06:43
Location: USA

Re: "bubble cockpit" ?

#10

Post by ShindenKai » 30 Dec 2022, 23:30

Grzesio wrote:
30 Dec 2022, 23:07
I think, the "bubble cockpit" refers to a one piece canopy without bracing and in this case Miles M.20 seems to be first indeed.
In case of teardrop canopies with bracing, the Zero was clearly not the first aircraft with such a feature, as e.g. Westland Whirlwind was first flown in 1938 already.
You're indeed correct https://www.merriam-webster.com/diction ... e%20canopy

-I've always loved the Westland Whirlwind, such a great looking aircraft. Its a shame that it had such a short service life.

-Its also a bummer that the M.20 never went any further.

-Here's a cool full-size Whirlwind replica project- https://www.whirlwindfp.org/

LineDoggie
Member
Posts: 1275
Joined: 03 Oct 2008, 21:06

Re: "bubble cockpit" ?

#11

Post by LineDoggie » 31 Dec 2022, 03:40

Grzesio wrote:
30 Dec 2022, 23:07
I think, the "bubble cockpit" refers to a one piece canopy without bracing and in this case Miles M.20 seems to be first indeed.
In case of teardrop canopies with bracing, the Zero was clearly not the first aircraft with such a feature, as e.g. Westland Whirlwind was first flown in 1938 already.
One could say the Seversky- P-35 had one of the first


Image
"There are two kinds of people who are staying on this beach: those who are dead and those who are going to die. Now let’s get the hell out of here".
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach

Post Reply

Return to “Luftwaffe air units and Luftwaffe in general”