The Generals of 1945

Discussions on the personalities of the Wehrmacht and of the organizations not covered in the other sections. Hosted by askropp and Frech.
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Stauffenberg II
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by Stauffenberg II » 28 Jun 2019 05:43

askropp wrote:
27 Jun 2019 22:52

What a lousy Taschenspielertrick to claim that technically no Austrian served in the Wehrmacht after 27 April 1945! This argumentation is invalid anyway because there were virtually no promotions dated 1 May. As the source confirms, they were announced on 20 April, so Holzinger was already a Wehrmacht Oberst on 27 April. I read there is also a discussion whether he was transferred (not only kommandiert) to the Waffen-SS.
Yes, right you are. Imagine what would have happened to an Austrian between 27.04. and 08.05. who was not willing to play around with his German comrades ...

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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 06 Aug 2019 15:41

Some new info on Gustav Enke: in March 1945, when he was in the FR of WK III (he was ill since September 1944), the HPA tried to establish his whereabouts.

"3.3.45 Es ist zu melden, ob Tauglichkeitsgrad und Aufenthalt jetzt bekannt."
16.3.45 W.Kr. III meldet, Nachforschungen bisher ohne Erfolg. Zuletzt am 29.01.45 in Landsberg / Warthe vom Hauptfeldwebel gesehen worden. Seitdem fehlt jede Spur."

This does not sound like someone who would have been promoted to GM a few weeks later.
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 20 Oct 2019 20:57

Two documents regarding the case of Arnold Burmeister. Although the earlier message calls him a GL and the later a GM, I still believe his promotion to have been valid. Krebs was probably distracted by the Soviets in front of his bunker.

test.jpg

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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 04 May 2020 12:20

The promotion of Josef Dahme has been confirmed now (see here).
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by Stauffenberg II » 25 Sep 2021 20:44

askropp wrote:
07 Oct 2018 11:21
Generale mit RDA vom 20.04.1945 (Teil 4)

Generalmajore (bevorzugte Beförderungen)
Hubert Ritter von Heigl
Emanuel von Kiliani - Order Nr. 1272
Robert Bader
Bruno Schatz - Order Nr. 1265
Georg Scholze - Order Nr. 1277
Hans Kohlsdorfer
Karl-Richard Koßmann - Order Nr. 1275
Rudolf Langhaeuser - Order Nr. 1262
Gerhard Lindner - Order Nr. 1268
Maximilian Roßkopf - Order Nr. 1284
Ernst Merk
Curt-Ulrich von Gersdorff
Rolf Scherenberg - Order Nr. 1276
Karl Klotz - Order Nr. 1238
Ivo-Thilo von Trotha - Order Nr. 1231
Friedrich Holzhäuer
Werner Neumann - Order Nr. 1267
Johann Steets - Order Nr. 1274
Max Lemke
Erhard Berner - Order Nr. 1271
Bernhard Ueberschär - Order Nr. 1261
Hinrich Warrelmann - Order Nr. 1266
Willy Langkeit - Order Nr. 1273
Ottomar Hansen
Josef Rauch - Order Nr. 1281
Ernst Biehler
Friedrich Drescher
Walter Scheunemann

Erich Bärenfänger

Generalmajor d.R.
Gerd von Below - Order Nr. 1279

And, of course, we have a whole bunch of unconfirmed claims listed below (note that none of those officers are listed by Absolon): Wilhelm Zuber, Siegfried Heine, Hellmuth Dorn, Volkmar Schöne, Theodor Pilling, Ottomar Babel, Carl Stollbrock, Gustav Tigör, Hans Meiser, Gustav Knabe, Lothar Berger, Max Stiotta (Edler von Hockenjos), Max Schirmeister, Werner Frotscher, Alfred Kuhnert, Dietrich Beelitz, Fritz von Arnim, Fritz Fullriede, Walter Drück, Horst von Usedom, Ernst Klasing, Fritz Poleck, Johannes Hölz, Franz Bäke (d.R.) and Helmuth von Ilsemann (z.V.)
I don´t know if you are already aware of Bäke´s Soldbuch. I think this is a further good evidence, that Bäke´s last rank was Oberst d. Res. 01.05.1944. I am sure that as a Pz. Div. Commander he would have entered his promotion in his Soldbuch:

https://www.lot-tissimo.com/de-de/aucti ... b900b6bd55

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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by Stauffenberg II » 23 Mar 2022 07:37

I think thanks to Albert the full Generals with late 1945 appointments, as well as Westphal and Winter, are now well documented with either order numbers, HPA Orderanweisung to Ag P 1 or confirmations from personnel files:

Name DoB Ern. DoD

Kessel von Guido Ernst Alfred Constantin Mortimer (Pz. Tr.) (O. Nr. 707) 25.05.1893 01.03.1945 08.01.1981
Petsch Theodor (Inf.) (O. Nr. 651) 27.06.1884 01.03.1945
Hitzfeld Otto (Inf.) (O. Nr. 709) 07.05.1898 01.03.1945 06.12.1990
Thomaschki Siegfried (Art.) (O. Nr. 710) 20.03.1894 01.03.1945 31.05.1967
Abraham Erich (Inf.) [L. P.] (O. Nr. 711) 23.07.1895 01.03.1945 07.03.1971
Mauchenheim Freiherr von, gen. Bechtolsheim (Art.) Anton-Reichard Hermann Friedrich Maria (O. Nr. 712) 09.07.1896 01.03.1945 09.02.1961
Schwalbe Felix (Inf.) (O. Nr. 713) 25.03.1892 01.03.1945 12.06.1974
Jauer Georg (Pz. Tr.) (O. Nr. 909) 26.09.1896 15.03.1945 05.08.1971
Mellenthin von Horst Alexander Alfred Paul (Art.) (O. Nr. 1095) 31.07.1898 16.03.1945 08.01.1977
Tettau von Hans (Inf.) (O. Nr. 1097) 30.11.1888 16.03.1945 30.01.1956
Fangohr Friedrich (Inf.) (O. Nr. 1282) 12.08.1899 16.03.1945 17.04.1956
Gareis Martin (Inf.) (O. Nr. 1004) 06.10.1891 01.04.1945 26.02.1976
Schwerin Gr. v. Gerhard (Gerd) Helmut Detloff (Pz. Tr.) (O. Nr. 1005) 23.06.1899 01.04.1945 29.10.1980
Grimmeiß Max (Art.) (O. Nr. 1052) 27.02.1893 01.04.1945 31.03.1972
Niehoff Hermann (Inf.) (HPA Orderanweisung an Ag P 1 07.04.1945) 03.04.1897 01.04.1945 05.11.1980
Kinzel Hans Eberhard (Inf.) (O. Nr. 1230) 18.10.1897 20.04.1945 25.06.1945 FT
Hauck Friedrich-Wilhelm (O. Nr. 1283) 10.01.1897 20.04.1945 15.04.1979
Hofmann Rudolf (Inf.) 04.09.1895 20.04.1945 13.04.1970
Meyer-Buerdorf Heinrich (Art.) (Personalakt) 13.12.1888 20.04.1945 01.05.1971
Schack Friedrich August (Inf.) (4 x FMS, Personalakt Meyer-Buerdorf) 27.03.1892 20.04.1945 24.07.1968
Thoholte Karl (Art.) (2x FMS, Personalakt) 14.09.1893 20.04.1945 21.03.1954

The only thing that puzzles me is that we don´t have any confirmation re Rudolf Hofmann, do we? Does his award papers of the KC (07.05.1945) give his rank, maybe in Scherzer´s book, anybody knows?
Last edited by Stauffenberg II on 23 Mar 2022 09:18, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 23 Mar 2022 08:34

Hofmann's promotion is noted on his Karteikarte.
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by Stauffenberg II » 08 Jan 2023 11:34

askropp wrote:
07 Oct 2018 18:44
Generale mit RDA vom 01.05.1945

There shouldn't be any, because 20 April was to be used instead of 1 May, but after Hitler's death this could have been ignored. Although all those claims are rather unlikely, at least one promotion is confirmed.

Generaloberst
Carl Hilpert

Hilpert was promoted during his last hours of command, if not after the surrender. A RDA of 01.05.1945 is given by Bradley, but not confirmed by original sources. Absolon does even list him as "unconfirmed" (but we have a Karteikarte and post surrender documents that confirm his promotion).
Dear Albert,

as per as Bundesarchiv (BA Invenio) and his personnel file incl. enclosures Hilpert was promoted to Gen. Oberst on 08.05.1945, but with effect and RDA of 20.04.1945.
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 09 Jan 2023 20:25

Great find! Thank you, Jürgen.
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Wilhelm Fox

Post by JakeV » 04 Mar 2023 18:11

Hello,

I saw this today:
PERS_6_1245_0071.jpg
Are we therefore to say that:

15.04.1945 Generalmajor mit Wirkung und RDA vom 20.04.1945 (8)

Or are there reasons to dispute this claim?

Regards
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 14 Mar 2023 17:36

For the sake of convenience, I don't list appointment dates which were earlier than the Wirkung. So I will simply list him as:
20.04.1945 Generalmajor (8)

Obviously, BA-MA must have had a batch of late war GM appointments that NARA did not have. They may have been added to the PA later. So it seems (unsurprisingly) that Absolon's Nachtrag is correct in most cases. There may still be some doubt on the Ordnungsnummern, especially those added later to backdated promotions and not listed in the PA. I will update this thread after checking the newly available documents.
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 19 Mar 2023 13:33

Wilhelm Nagel is a primary example for the problems of Absolon's practice of assigning non-original Ordungsnummern. The planmäßige Beförderungen to rank from 1 April 1945 are now confirmed, they end with Nordheim who was the (12). A short time later (nearly simultaneously), a batch of five bevorzugte Beförderungen was added (Strahammer to Baron von Behr). Absolon assigned them numbers from (14) to (18), placing them in the usual round brackets and thus indicating they were original. Although I wasn't able to confirm that yet, this may well be the case as the (13) is missing and this would be consistent with the late war practice of leaving a gap between the planmäßige and bevorzugte promotions. Several officers got additional, backdated bevorzugte Beförderungen even later during April, among them Nagel, Schury, Niemack, Giese and possibly others. Now Absolon gave Schury the [16a] and Niemack the [17a], but he gave Nagel the vacant [13], and that is wrong. He would have gotten the [13a] as the open slot would have been kept in existence.

Not to mention the problems of the bevorzugte promotions to rank from 20 April 1945 where Absolon added numbers in square brackets but omitted officers who he assumed to have received unconfirmed promotions (since confirmed).
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 30 Mar 2023 19:47

Generalmajore

01.01.1945
(1) Erwin Lahousen Edler von Vivremont
(2) Joseph Rupprecht
(3) Hartmann Freiherr von Ow auf Wachendorf
(4) Adolf Westhoff
(4a) Arthur Zierold
(5) [nicht vergeben]
(6) Hans-Joachim Gravenstein
(7) Peter Körte
(8) Friedrich Kittel
(9) Rolf Menneking
(10) Hans Hüttner
(11) Georg Koßmala
(12) Wilhelm Viebig
(13) Georg Reinicke
(14) Erwin Kaschner
(15) Arnold Burmeister
(16) Heinz Kokott
(17) Walter Nagel
(18) Eberhard Thunert
(19) Helmut Kleikamp
(20) Rudolph Huebner
(21) Rudolf Bader
[21a] Hanns-Horst von Necker
(22) Christian Landau
(23) Martin Bieber
(24) Oldwig von Natzmer
(25) Rudolf Lippert
(26) Erich Schmidt
(27) Hanns Laengenfelder
(28) Alfred Philippi

30.01.1945
(1) Johann Manussi Edler von Montesole
(1a) Ulrich Bormann
(1b) Johann Mirow
(2) Wilhelm Strecker
(3) Julius Coretti
(4) Othmar Krüpl
[4a] Karl Patzak
(5) Alfred Hyden
(6) Viktor Luschnig
(6a) Carl Jakwerth
(7) Johann Simmler
(7a) Josef Dahme
(8) Helmut Hipp
(9) Ernst Graewe
(10) Kurt Lottner
(11) Alfred Kuzmany
(12) [nicht vergeben]
(13) Anton Eberth
(14) Anton Glasl
(14a) Wilhelm Conze
[14b] Hans von Ahlfen
(15) Walter Kühn
(16) Hermann von Oppeln-Bronikowski
[16a] Herbert Gundelach
(17) Carl Anders
[17a] Ernst Gonell
(18) Kurt Hähling
(19) Joachim Schwatlo-Gesterding
[19a] Helmut Bechler
(20) Hans Kissel
(21) Robert Macher
[21a] Erich Seidel
[21a1] Rudolf-Christoph Freiherr von Gersdorff
[21b] Ludwig Kirschner
(22) Wilhelm Söth
(22a) Wilhelm Bleckwenn
(23) Hellmuth Mäder
(24) Hans-Joachim Deckert
[24a] Alois Weber
(25) Hermann Harrendorf
(26) Hans-Joachim Kahler
(27) Ernst König
(28) Otto Ernst Remer
(29) Theodor Tolsdorff

01.03.1945
(1) Gustav Dürrstein
(2) Friedrich Werther
(2a) Werner von Boltenstern
(3) Paul Block
(4) Rudolf Petersen
(5) Josef Meuther
(6) Hermann Grothe
(7) Kurt Paape
(8) Hermann Konitzky
(8a) [Ernst Knebel] +
(9) [nicht vergeben]
[10] Claus Kühl
[10a] Hugo Dempwolff
[10b] Eugen Kurz
[11] Erich Geißler
[11a] Franz Haas
[12] Konrad Barde
[13] Hermann Schulte-Heuthaus
[14] Richard Schmidt
[15] Alexander Möckel
[15a] Hellmuth Laegeler
[15b] Peter von der Groeben
[15c] Rudolf Wulf
[16] [Karl Göbel] +
[17] Rudolf Demme
[17a] Burkhart Müller-Hillebrand
[17b] Meinrad von Lauchert
[18] Wolf Ewert

16.03.1945
Georg Seegers

01.04.1945
(1) Wilhelm Jolas
(2) Joseph Brüning
(3) Werner von Hillebrandt
(4) Bernhard Neßlinger
(5) Karl Adolf von Bodecker
(6) Hubert Strohmaier
(7) Kurt Adam
(8) [Alfred Heisig] +
(9) Kuno Dewitz
(10) Karl Klockenbring
(11) Rudolf Pühringer
(12) Heinrich von Nordheim
(13) [nicht vergeben]
[13a] Wilhelm Nagel
[13b] Erich Hampe
[14] Martin Strahammer
[15] Heinrich Hax
[16] Theodor Kretschmer
[16a] Otto Schury
[17] Heinrich Voigtsberger
[17a] [Helmuth Hufenbach] +
[17b] Horst Niemack
[18] Heinrich Baron von Behr
[19] Karl Giese

17.04.1945
Hermann-Heinrich Behrend

20.04.1945
(1) Gustav Enke
[2] Johannes Böhaimb
(3) Walter Vogel
[4] Walter Stud
(5) Erich Kohlhauer
(6) Richard Bulcke
[7] Paul von Mayer
(8) Wilhelm Fox
[9] Hellmuth Dorn
(10) [nicht vergeben]
Hubert Ritter von Heigl
Siegfried Heine
Emanuel von Kiliani
Robert Bader
Bruno Schatz
Georg Scholze
Hans Kohlsdorfer
Karl-Richard Koßmann
Rudolf Langhaeuser
Gerhard Lindner
Maximilian Roßkopf
Ernst Merk
Curt-Ulrich von Gersdorff
Rolf Scherenberg
Karl Klotz
Ivo-Thilo von Trotha
Friedrich Holzhäuer
Werner Neumann
Johann Steets
Max Lemke
Erhard Berner
Bernhard Ueberschär
Hinrich Warrelmann
Willy Langkeit
Ottomar Hansen
Josef Rauch
Ernst Biehler
Friedrich Drescher
Walter Scheunemann
Erich Bärenfänger
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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by Stauffenberg II » 03 Apr 2023 15:05

Thanks for your hard work. Gundelach however was promoted after capitulation if I recall correctly. I do not consider it valid at all.

BR
Jürgen

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Re: The Generals of 1945

Post by askropp » 03 Apr 2023 15:45

The formal basis of the "Dönitz reign" remained the same between 1 and 23 May, it was not affected by the surrender. So if Dönitz was able to issue valid promotions on 2 May, he must have been able to do so on 22 May. If he was not, how could the surrender signed in his name be valid? I never understood those nitpickers who say his appointment as Reichspäsident by Hitler was illegal. Yes it was, but the whole Nazi regime was based on Hitler's illegal actions after the Reichstagsbrand, especially his own illegal usurpation of the presidency and supreme command in 1934, and I never heard someone questioning the validity of his appointments and promotions.
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