Fallschirmjäger RKTs - pics and career data

Discussions on the personalities of the Wehrmacht and of the organizations not covered in the other sections. Hosted by Dieter Zinke, askropp and Frech.
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Ingo
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Post by Ingo » 13 Aug 2006 08:56

Here is Viktor Vitali.
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Doktor Krollspell
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Post by Doktor Krollspell » 13 Aug 2006 10:08

Hello Fangio!

-Mj Gerhardt MERTENS (Was this a RKT? I can't find him at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de )


Gerhard Mertins recieved the RK on 06.12.1944 as a Hauptmann and Fhr. Fsch.Pi.Btl. 5.

-Obstlt Werner Herbert SCHMIDT (can't find this one either)


Werner Schmidt recieved the RK on 05.04.1944 as a Major and Kdr. Fsch.MG-Btl. 1.

I can't find any reference to a Werner-Herbert Schmidt that was supposed to be Fallschirmjäger RKT...


Source for both RKT: Veit Scherzer "Ritterkreuzträger" (2005).


Regards,

Krollspell

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FANGIO
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Post by FANGIO » 14 Aug 2006 00:52

Thanks for the pic Ingo and for the corrections Doktor Krollspell.
Maybe another forum member has a pic of the other RKTs?
Best,

FANGIO

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FANGIO
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Post by FANGIO » 16 Aug 2006 21:33

HELP PLEASE!!!
A friend of mine send me these three scans with a list of Fallschirmjägers who won the RK. (Book: "7th Flieger Division - Student's Fallschirmjäger Elite" - Chris Ellis - Spearhead - Ian Allan Publishing).
No problems with the names that appear on the first scan, but I have several questions regarding the names listed on the second and third scans (the names appear in alphabetical order).

1) I couldn't find the following names at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de so my question here is: did these men really receive the RK?
- Hartmut von Berg
- Constantin Hahn
- ??? Kampmann
- Walter Kluge (but there is a Waldemar Kluge from FschPzGrRgt 2 "HG", maybe it's him?)
- Hans von Majer
- Friedrich Meyer-Schewe
- Wilhelm Süssmann
- Wofgang Zander

2) The following ones appear at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de as members of the Heer but the pics show them in Luftwaffe uniform (except for Schreiber where's no pic). Are they or not fallschirmjäger recipients?:
- Hans-Georg Lehmann
( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rch_result / http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rd=lehmann )
- Robert Rebholz ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rch_result / http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rd=rebholz )
- Johannes Scheid ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rch_result / http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... ord=scheid )
- Kurt Schreiber ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rch_result )

3) The list shows Hans Hönscheid as a Kriegsberichter. Why is he on the list then? Was he a Heer member or a LW member. The photo at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de shows him in Heer uniform if I'm not wrong but he's listed as a LW member :?
http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... =honscheid

4) A glider pilot is considered a Fallschirmjäger? I ask this because Elimar Meyer is on the list and if I'm not wrong he's a glider pilot. The same case for Wilhelm Fulda, wasn't he a glider pilot?, and Walter Kiess???
Elimar Meyer http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... word=meyer
Wilhelm Fulda http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... word=fulda
Walter Kiess http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... word=kiess

5) This name is not on the list but I want to know (just to be 100% sure) if he is a FJ RKT or not: GM Friedrich Wilhelm Morzik ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... ord=morzik )

6) Were these really FJs?:
- Edmund Francois http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... d=francois
- Dirk Itzen http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... word=itzen
- Eduard Kiefer http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... ord=kiefer
- Heinrich Schäfer http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... rd=schafer
- Lothar Schirner http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... d=schirner
- Josef Schmid http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... ord=schmid
- Heinrich Witte http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... word=witte

7) Some names are not included in this list:
- Mj Gerhard Pade ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... hword=pade )
- Hptm Leonhard Schmidt ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... 20leonhard )
- Oblnt Viktor Vitali ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... ord=vitali )
- Oblnt Hans Joachim Weck ( http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de/index_sea ... hword=weck )

Shouldn't these men be included as FJ RKTs? And shouldn't Willy Kroymanns be deleted as he did not receive any RK (I remember a post made by Dieter Zinke about this).

8) Last (but not least): any idea about a Mj Ingenhoven? Was he a FJ? Can't find him anywhere.

UUUUFFFFFF!!!! My head is about to blow up... Sorry for so many questions. Please, any help is greatly appreciated.

Best,

FANGIO
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Jan-Hendrik
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Post by Jan-Hendrik » 17 Aug 2006 05:02

Francois , for example , was an officer of the HG-Division ....

Jan-Hendrik

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 17 Aug 2006 05:27

Photo of Fritz Prager from Eric Queen's book: http://www.axishistory.com/index.php?id=5815

Prager died from cancer in December 1940.
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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 17 Aug 2006 05:45

Fangio

Part of the problem with the 7th Flieger Division list is that while those men might have served with the FJ at one time,they were awarded the RK serving elsewhere.

For example Hans-Georg Lehmann served with FJR1 but later transfered to the Sturm Battalion of the Hermann Göring Division,awarded the RK October 1944 with that unit...refer HG Div reference per the list.

So Lehmann was a FJ veteran but in another role when he received the RK.

Regards
Peter

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Peter H
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Post by Peter H » 17 Aug 2006 05:50

Teusen--from Wehrmacht-awards.com
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FANGIO
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Post by FANGIO » 17 Aug 2006 18:06

Thanks a lot for your help Jan and Peter.

In another post, "fallschirmjäger" (forum member from New Zealand) gave me this link:
http://www.eagle19.freeserve.co.uk/winners.htm
This is where I got my first list of FJ RK recipients. But if you compare that list with the one I posted (the three scans), you can see that the one I posted has many more names. What I want to know is which one is correct, the eagle19 one or the three scans I posted.

I'll post again the questions I made but without the links to show things more clear (I hope). I'll take out number 2 and 6 as I consider answered those ones:

1) I couldn't find the following names at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de so my question here is: did these men really receive the RK?
- Hartmut von Berg
- Constantin Hahn
- ??? Kampmann
- Walter Kluge (but there is a Waldemar Kluge from FschPzGrRgt 2 "HG", maybe it's him?)
- Hans von Majer
- Friedrich Meyer-Schewe
- Wilhelm Süssmann
- Wofgang Zander

3) The list shows Hans Hönscheid as a Kriegsberichter. Why is he on the list then? Was he a Heer member or a LW member. The photo at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de shows him in Heer uniform if I'm not wrong but he's listed as a LW member

4) A glider pilot is considered a Fallschirmjäger? I ask this because Elimar Meyer is on the list and if I'm not wrong he's a glider pilot. The same case for Wilhelm Fulda, wasn't he a glider pilot?, and Walter Kiess???

5) This name is not on the list but I want to know (just to be 100% sure) if he is a FJ RKT or not: GM Friedrich Wilhelm Morzik

7) Some names are not included in this list (three scans):
- Mj Gerhard Pade
- Hptm Leonhard Schmidt
- Oblnt Viktor Vitali
- Oblnt Hans Joachim Weck
Shouldn't these men be included as FJ RKTs? And shouldn't Willy Kroymanns be deleted as he did not receive any RK (I remember a post made by Dieter Zinke about this).

8) Last (but not least): there’s a Mj Ingenhoven at http://www.eagle19.freeserve.co.uk/winners.htm . I found a Mj Peter Ingenhoven at http://www.das-ritterkreuz.de who got his RK as stellv. Kdr KGrp z.b.V. 103. Can he be considered a FJ RKT?

Best,

FANGIO

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Fallschirmjäger
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Need this book

Post by Fallschirmjäger » 18 Aug 2006 03:40

FANGIO you need to get this book,i wish i had it as of the other many good FJ books out there too. 8-)

http://www.landmarkmilitarybooks.com/KNIGHT-S-OF-THE-WEHRMACHT-Knight-s-Cross-Holders-of-the-Fallschirmjager-pr-1102.html

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Dieter Zinke
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Post by Dieter Zinke » 18 Aug 2006 08:55

Here is Friedrich-August Meyer (after the war: Meyer-Schewe),
pic out of Franz Kurowski "Fallschirmpanzerkorps 'Hermann Göring'", Biblio-Verlag 1994

Meyer was at last Kdr. Fsch.Pz.Ers. u. Ausb.Brig. "HG".
The proposal for the award from LPA (Luftwaffen-Personalamt) was sent to Adjutantur Reichsmarschall for statement on 03.03.1945. It doesn' t return with comment until the end of the war and consequently it remains undischharged!
According to a radio message of the Chef LPA from 12.05.1945 to the Luftflotte Reich the "Ritterkreuz" was bestowed "mit dem heutigen Tage" (with effect from today). It was consequently de facto awarded but de iure illegal (after the surrender).
Nevertheless the most honorable :P "OdR" acknowledged the bestowal, and the "Grand Master" Fellgiebel himself determined with his own absolute power the 09.05.1945 (and this is also a double illegality:also the Fellgiebel-date is after the capitulation :) )

Dieter Z.
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Fallschirmjäger
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Post by Fallschirmjäger » 19 Aug 2006 06:26

As for pictures of these FJ i must have some in my books,but a lot of them or all say there all copywrited pictures the whole thing and so forth so i dont want to get it trouble or have i dont anyway of contacting the book or it takes to long?.

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FANGIO
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Post by FANGIO » 20 Aug 2006 04:30

Dieter Zinke wrote:Here is Friedrich-August Meyer (after the war: Meyer-Schewe),


Great! Many, many thanks Dieter!!! It seems to be that there are several cases like this, or am I wrong? I mean men who were awarded after the surrender (8.5.45).

Fallschirmjäger wrote:As for pictures of these FJ i must have some in my books,but a lot of them or all say there all copywrited pictures the whole thing and so forth so i dont want to get it trouble or have i dont anyway of contacting the book or it takes to long?.


Don't worry Falllschirmjäger, if they have copyright don't post them. Thanks anyway.

Best,

FANGIO

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What to do?

Post by Fallschirmjäger » 23 Aug 2006 23:12

I wish books would just let you use them,i mean people do im shure,its whether you are actualy caught some how and they fine you i think?,but have people actualy been so,like some pictures i got are off sites who got them of books maybe etc..,so me posting them maybe alright?,not shure confusing sometimes for shure,one thing is to ask the book or person if you can and then its fine,or just dont post any pictures at all that you dont know about,but thats not so fun too realy when you want to show pictures.

Like also some of the pictures in this thread i can make copies right,but then me using them on another site etc..?,would that be wrong,or i am supposed to mentione the source if i can,like from here maybe,and then they can see where i got it,or just this site maybe or the thread,which is better if i have too?,thanks. :?

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Post by Peter H » 25 Aug 2006 04:37

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