21. and 22. SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. - Sept/Oct 1944

[Charles Trang]

14th Feb.43 : Lazarett Poltawa (operated by SS-Stubaf. Dr Gollah).
April - May 43 : Helps create the Korps Genesenden Kompanie within II.SS-Pz.Korps.
May - mid August 43 : Kdr. SS-FEB 2
Mid August - October 43 : Fhr. III./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. "Der Führer"
November 43 - April 44 : Taktiklehrer an der SS-Junkerschule "Tölz"
Mid April 44 - July 44 : Taktiklehrer und Infanterielehrer an der SS-Artillerieschule Beneschau
July 44 : Kdr. I./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt.22
September 44 - Mid October 44 : Kdr. II./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt.22
From mid October 44 : Ausbilder in Goor
January 45 : Kdr. III./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt.21

[Ignacio]

I was aware of Sattler's alternative dates in SS-Totenkopf-Infanterie-Ersatz-Bataillon II. Actually there are at least 3 alternative dates:
1. 01 Jun 1939 - 18 Dec 1940
2. 08 Jan 1940 - 18 Dec 1940
3. ?? Mar 1940 - ?? Jul 1941
The easiest way to find out the right dates would be to know whom did he succeed and who succeeded him. Do you have that information?

Hello Pena and Radevich

Carl Sattler led SS-Totenkopf-Inf.Ers.Btl. II from 12.03.1940 (succeeding Wilhelm Bettenhäuser) to 10.07.1941, when he moved to command SS-Infanterie-Regiment 10 succeeding Martin Kohlroser. Source is his Dienstlaufbahn.

Regards from Madrid

Ignacio

[Kriegsberichter]

Guys, nice info but that is the wrong Sattler...

Iam looking for info on Sturmbannführer SATTLER Karl
Born: 15 Jan 1913
Died: 30 Nov 1996
SS-Nr.: 46 237

special thanks to Pena V

[Charles Trang]

I was just completing Pena V's informations about Richter.

[Pena V]

Thanks guys for the new information.

At last someone was able to say which of Carl Sattler's three date was right.

I have a question to Charles. Are you sure about Richter's dates of command in the case of III/"Der Führer" (Mid August - October 43)? Mark Yerger in his DKiG series Part 1 page 283 writes: "Succeeding Vincenz Kaiser, in August 1943 Kämpfe assumed command of the III./Der Führer and was severly wounded during the October 1943 Chodoroff fighting."

Regards,

Pena V

[Charles Trang]

These informations come from his own Kriegserinnerungen so they might be true ! He had vivid memories from the surgeon who operated him in Poltawa that is why I mentioned his name here.

[Pena V]

Charles,

I often have a feeling that I'm working for a large international corporation and the dept. I'm working for is called "Problem Solving AND Creating".
Now that we have so much details about Richter's career it's not anymore so clear concerning his time in III/"Der Führer.
Here is what I'm thinking now: Helmut Kämpfe was awarded RK on 10 December 1943 for his performance as the CO of III/"Der Führer" so obviously he had to be the CO before that. My list of III/"Der Führer CO*s look like this:
1938 - 14 May 1940............Osbf Wäckerle Hilmar -> WIA
14 May 1940 - 11 Jul 1941....Hsf Kumm Otto (Sbf 01 Sep 1940)
Jul 1941 - Jul 1941.............Hsf Hahn Wilhelm
16 Jul 1941 - 03 Sep 1941.....Hsf Kempin Hans -> WIA
03 Sep 1941 - 06 Jan 1942....Hsf Lingner Hans
06 Jan 1942 - 25 Jan 1942....Sbf Schulz Helmut -> KIA
26 Jan 1942 - 1942.............Bollert Hans
(Jul 1942) - 13 Feb 1943......Sbf Horn Fritz -> WIA
13 Feb 1943 - 13 Feb 1943....Hsf Holzer Friedrich
13 Feb 1943 - Aug 1943.......Hsf Kaiser Vincenz -> WIA (Sbf 20 Apr 1943)
Aug 1943 - Oct 1943...........Hsf Richter Friedrich?
The only "holes" are between Bollert and Horn and after Richter. It's not likely that Kämpfe would have received RK on 10 December 1943 for his performance in early 1942 so it must be a) after Richter or b) Richter is mistaking? In addition Kämpfe was WIA in October 1943. If he was not the CO of III/"Der Führer" where was he?

:roll:

Pena

[Charles Trang]

Helmut Kämpfe was awarded the Knight's Cross for his actions west of the Dniepr in the Schtschutschinska sector. His battalion (III./DF) was thrown against the Russians from the Chodoroff area which it reached on 12th October. My idea is that Richter was in command of III./DF till late September or early October and was replaced by Helmut Kämpfe, former commander of SS-Pz.Aufkl.Abt.2. I don't think that Richter was mistaking. It is true that he seldom gave precise dates in his postwar memories but he often described events in detail and in a chronologic fashion.

[Ignacio]

Hello Pena and Charles

Leading III./DF Wäckerle was wounded on 12.May.1940, succeded the next day by Ottto Kumm.

Bollert led the battalion (pulled from the front and returned to Germany with the regiment in late February) at least into early March 1942, and he was then hospitalized. By mid-April 1942 he had been succeded as vertreter Btl. Fhr. by Hastuf. Ludwig Hödl (moved to the unit as Kompanie Chef from the Polizei-Division). In mid-May 1942 Stubaf. Fritz Horn, who had been appointed commander on 10.May.1942, took over the battalion replacing Hödl.

After Fritz Horn was wounded on 13.February.1943, deputy battalion command was briefly assumed by the Chief of the 9.Kompanie, Hastuf. Alfons Schober (see Weidinger, "Kameraden bis zum Ende"). Kaiser took over command on 19.February.

As Battalion Commander Vinzenz Kaiser was wounded on 13.August.1943, his successor was Helmut Kämpfe according to "Kameraden bis zum Ende", page 181. Most probably Kämpfe was wounded too in late August 1943, being then replaced by Hastuf. Friedrich Richter.

Richter then led III./DF into early October 1943, when Kämpfe returned and resumed his command. Kämpfe was seriously wounded again on 22.October.1943, and the depleted battalion was dissolved a few days later. An SPW company was then formed from the fighting remnants and attached to regiment "Deutschland" while the battalion cadre was pulled from the front.

Regards from Madrid

Ignacio

[Charles Trang]

Thanks a lot Ignacio. I suppose you meant that Kämpfe was seriously wounded on 22 December (and not 22 October) as he was leading his battalion by 13 December for the counter attack which earned him the Knight's Cross.

[Ignacio]

Hello Charles

Kämpfe was wounded on 22.October.1943. Months happened between the feat took place, the proposal of the award was submitted, then forwarded to superior levels and finally approved. Kämpfe´s Knight´s Cross was approved on 10.December.1943, and obviously the feat for which he was recommended took place before wounded on 22.October. And your own post dates the feat on 12.October!.

His battalion (III./DF) was thrown against the Russians from the Chodoroff area which it reached on 12th October.

Regards

Ignacio

[Charles Trang]

Ooops ! Sorry, I made a mistake about the different dates. You are 100% right. Do you know more about this SS-Hstuf. Hödl ? I only have what John P. Moore has noted in his Führerliste.

[Pena V]

Thank you Charles and Ignacio. My "wisdom" has once again grown since you entered this discussion. Here is a summary of Friedrich Richter's assingments which also answers to one of the original questions in this thread:
01 Aug 1941 - 01 Jan 1942.....14./SS-Infanterie-Regiment "Deutschland"
(Jul 1942) - 13 Feb 1943........5./Panzergrenadier-Regiment "Deutschland"
13 Feb 1943......................WIA
May 1943 - mid Aug 1943......SS-Feld-Ersatz-Bataillon 2
mid Aug 1943 - Oct 1943.......III/SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment "Der Führer"
Nov 1943 - Apr 1944............Taktiklehrer/SS-Junkerschule "Bad Tölz"
mid April 1944 - Jul 1944.......Taktiklehrer/SS-Artillerie-Schule "Beneschau"
Jul 1944 - Jul 1944..............I/SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment 22
Jul 1944 - Jul 1944..............I/SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment 21
17 Jul 1944 - 1944..............SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment 22
08 Sep 1944 - mid Oct 1944...II/SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment 21
mid Oct 1944 - Dec 1944.......SS-Feld-Ersatz-Bataillon 10
Jan 1945 - 09(!) May 1945.....III/SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment 21
Still open questions:
1. Assignments before 01 August 1941?
2. Did he really succeed Sbf Wilhelm Schulze for a while as CO of SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment 22 on 17 July 1944? I'm the only one who has mentioned this.
3. Dates of EK II and EK I?
4. Promotion dates to Untersturmführer and Obersturmführer?

Pena V

[radevich]

Friedrich Richter

In 1936/1937 he served with SS-Standarte ‘Germania’ in Radolfzell.
The commander of the column supply Das Reich SS Division: - 06.41

[Pena V]

This is all I have about Hödl:

Hauptsturmführer HÖDL Ludwig
Born: 07 Nov 1912
Died: ?
SS-Nr.: 161 113

Assignments:
(Feb 1940)-Aug 1941.............1./Polizei-Schützen-Regiment 3
mid Apr 1942 - 10 May 1942...III/"Der Führer"
(Jul 1942) - (Jul 1942)..........11./"Der Führer"
(Oct 1943) - (Oct 1943).........15./"Deutschland"

Promotions:
30 Jan 1940 Hauptsturmfuhrer

Major Awards:
?

Pena V