Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

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Sid Guttridge
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Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#1

Post by Sid Guttridge » 17 Jun 2017, 09:51

I am trying to find the identity of some small German occupation units in the far south of France in 1943-44.

There was apparently a battalion HQ and one infantry company at Foix.

There was also another infantry company at Ax (-les-Thermes?).

Can anyone identify the units concerned?

Many thanks,

Sid.

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#2

Post by NagaSadow » 17 Jun 2017, 13:23

Hello!

Res.Jäg.Btl. 38 moved from Tarbes to Foix and Pamiers in June(?) 1944 and remained there until August.


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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#3

Post by CNE503 » 17 Jun 2017, 15:43

Not found a lot, but it may present some interest:
On May 1st, 1944, Deutscher Verbindungsstab 806 was in Foix;
On January 15th, 1943, Feldgendarmerietrupp 806 was in Foix;
On June 1st, 1944, there was in Foix a Grenzpolizei-Kommissariat, and in Ax-les-Thermes a Grenzpolizei-Post.

According to the maps available to me, there were no security units in these towns on June 17th, 1944, the nearest were: an Ukrainian replacement battalion (probably from Freiwilligen-Stamm Division) in Tarbes; Sicherungs-Regimentsstab 194, with IV./Sicherungs-Regiment 194 and Landesschützen Bataillon 726 in Toulouse; Freiwilligen-Stamm Regiment 1 in Castres.

In Spring 1943 (as of April 24th, 1943), some subunits from 29. Infanterie Division (motorisiert) (HQ in Pau) and of 148. Reserve Division (HQ in Toulouse) might have been deployed in the area.
On June 6th, 1944, headquarters for Armeegruppe "G" was in Rouffiac (near Toulouse), for LVIII. Reserve-Panzerkorps was in Montastruc (near Toulouse too), for IV. Luftwaffen-Feldkorps was in Capendu.
At this time, 272. Infanterie Division defended the mediterranean coast from the Spanish border to the north (HQ in Capendu).

The Turkmen Ost-Bataillon 781 seem to be active near Foix in August 1944.

Hope this helps.
Cheers,

CNE EMB
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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#4

Post by Loïc » 17 Jun 2017, 16:52

hello Captain, about the Turkestanisches Ost-Bataillon 781 it was not more in Upper Normandy than in the Pyrénées?

because indeed there was an Ost-Bataillon in august 1944 in Ariège Dept. usually described as «1st Battalion of the Turkestan Legion» but instead of 781 was actually the Turkestanische Feld Bataillon I/370 merged as battalion of the Freiwilligen Stamm Regiment 1 raised early 1944

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Loïc

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#5

Post by CNE503 » 17 Jun 2017, 16:56

(Hello Loïc, it's not more "Captain" but "Major", but I couldn't find how to update my nickname here ;) )

I found this piece of information in "Wehrmacht & SS", a Heimdal book from Borsarello and Palickx. I guess that they speak about the Feld-Bataillon I/370 merged within the Freiwilligen-Stamm Regiment 1. Anyway it seems that there was an Ost-Bataillon from Turkestan in Ariège in August 1944.

Regards!

CNE503
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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#6

Post by Loïc » 18 Jun 2017, 00:00

So Congratulations CDT-EMB :thumbsup: yes you prefer CEN -Chef d'Escadron- instead of CDT,
not taking notice before of this subtil and very inconspicuous recent change from CNE into CEN in some other forum :idea:

the 6. Panzer-Division came also in Ariège fall 1942 but didn't stay there and in France in 1943-1944

the Pioneer Battalion 669 came at Foix but like the Reserve-Jäger-Bataillon 38 of the 189. Reserve Division mentionned above by NagaSadow it was not before the summer 1944...
A Moi Auvergne

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#7

Post by CNE503 » 18 Jun 2017, 00:30

Thank you!

CEN503 ;)
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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#8

Post by Sid Guttridge » 21 Jun 2017, 11:45

Hi Guys,

Thank you very much.

I was asking because I have a book on Andorra that mentions the deployments in my opening post, without specifying their units

It also mentions that the frontier guards were often Austrians because of the mountainous terrain.

Anything else would be gratefully received.

Cheers,

Sid.

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#9

Post by Loïc » 21 Jun 2017, 20:28

Indeed I was wondering where you saw that, I don't find any good source or book with this kind if datas we have for others departments
I have read an article about the Liberation of Ariège (where the author again gives the n° 781 to Schopplein's Turkestan Battalion of Freiwilligen Stamm Regiment 1 instead of I/370, the unit arriving only belatedly in the department) no learning something more about the troops...

there was a permanent presence of above-mentioned german customs Zollgrenzschutz at least 300 men in Foix Saint Girons, and passing troops

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#10

Post by Sid Guttridge » 24 Jun 2017, 09:50

Hi Loic,

I have a book on Andorra titled Passeurs, Fugitifs et Espions by Claude Benet.

It gives a general description of the German forces opposite Andorra in 1943-44 on p.167, but without specifying the units concerned. On that page it says "Parmi ces effectifs, en particuliere ceux de la Douane, il y avait pas mal d'Austrichiens, des hommes murs envoyés dans les Pyrénées en raison de leur expérience en montagne."

Cheers,

Sid.

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#11

Post by Sid Guttridge » 29 Jun 2017, 17:53

Hi Loic,

A related question:

Do you know which GRM platoons were deployed in Andorre over 1936-1940?

It seems that at various times the 182nd, 176th, 178th and 538th were there. Do you know of any others?

Many thanks for any help,

Sid.

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#12

Post by Loïc » 08 Jul 2017, 00:01

you have better french sources than me, I knew only they consisted in 150 GRM during 4 years headed by Colonel Baulard, there was also a detachement of Sappers-Telegraphists from the 28th Engineers (Signals) Regiment and Medical
andorre.jpg
andorre.jpg (119.66 KiB) Viewed 1324 times
Regards
Loïc

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#13

Post by Sid Guttridge » 13 Jul 2017, 13:57

Hi Guys,

All the information I have is that Ost-Bataillon 781 was in Normandy in June 1944. It seems improbable to me that it was in the south of France two months later when reinforcements were heading for Normandy, not away.

However, Ost-Bataillon 681 was in the south of France at this time.

Is it possible that the two are being confused?

Many thanks,

Sid.

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#14

Post by Loïc » 13 Jul 2017, 14:28

As said, I think that is the Turkestanische Feld Bataillon I/370 merged as Battalion into the Freiwillignen Stamm Regiment 1 having its Georgian and Turkestan battalions in this area (Castres Albi Toulouse Saint Sulpice Mazamet Cahors...) the sources, especially french, are often quite confused with the german army organisation, for French people Germany it is not a neighbour but an other galaxy at the image of its army with their bizarre alien names and hieroglyphic structures

the 781 appears in Upper Normandy while the 681 on the Mediterranean Languedocian coast

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Re: Identity of German Army occupation units at Foix and Ax in southern France, 1943-44?

#15

Post by Georges JEROME » 06 Nov 2017, 17:34

who was Kdr Verbindungsstab 806 Foix (Ariège) prior Oberst Krafft von Oelhafen (1944) ? VS was created on dec. 1942.

Thanks
Best regards

Georges

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