Let's build Panzer-Division "Müncheberg" !

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David C. Clarke
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Excellent!!

Post by David C. Clarke » 17 May 2002 19:44

Really excellent Jeff! It wasn't that I doubted you at all, it's just that I think we're all hoping this thread will be so thoroughly documented that the questions which need intensive scrutiny will be obvious. Thanks Again and Best Regards, David :D :D :D

Timo
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Post by Timo » 17 May 2002 20:20

That indeed seems odd. I guess he means Tiger IIs

Cheers,
Timo

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Andy H
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Post by Andy H » 17 May 2002 20:42

Hi David

In Victor Madeja's series "Russo-German War" No 35, it gives 'M' Pz Div 'Battle' strength as approx 3,000men as of May 30th'45.

It then lists it's Panzer strength as April 15th'45 at 30. No breakdown of Type.

:D Andy from the Shire

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David C. Clarke
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Hi Andy!

Post by David C. Clarke » 17 May 2002 20:55

Hello Andy and thanks. I think LeTissier has a breakdown for tank strength on April 15th. I can't wait to get home to the good books! Best Regards My Friend, David :D

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Andy H
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Post by Andy H » 17 May 2002 21:41

Just a snippet from Erickson, regarding the conference held on 28/04/45 by Weilding in which reporting to the Fuhrer he proposed a final breakout to the west, using three echelons, of which the third would consist of the remnants of the 'M' Panzer Division, the 'Bahrenfanger' Kampfgruppe plus 11th SS Nordland and a rearguard supplied by 9th Para.

Jentz for March 15th lists the armoured strength at (Total/Servicable):
Stug (4/4)
PzIVlg (4/3)
PzIV/70 (1/1)
PzV (11/10)
PzVI (11/8)

Also from Mitcham was wounded on May 1st and dissapearing on May 3rd.

:D Andy from the Shire

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Andy H
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Post by Andy H » 17 May 2002 21:47

I ment to say that Mummert was wounded etc and that according to Tieke it was in the Ketzin area of Berlin

:D Andy from the Shire

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David C. Clarke
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We're Rolling...

Post by David C. Clarke » 17 May 2002 23:07

We're rolling right along gentlemen. Andy, that would be Tieke, "Das Ende Zwischen Oder und Elbe, De Kampf um Berlin", right?
Best regards, David :D :D :D

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Mummert

Post by Mark V. » 17 May 2002 23:15

A little more on Mummert

Mummert was awarded KC on recommendation by Otto Kumm, for the heroic battle and actions of his men and for his own significant role in the defense of the DF regiment's sector (Weidinger, Comrades to the end), during the defensive battles near Rzhew in February 1942.


Kommandeur AufklAbt 256
KC: 17.08.1942

Mark

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David C. Clarke
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WOW!

Post by David C. Clarke » 17 May 2002 23:34

Superb Mark V, I didn't know that! I've got to check Weidinger myself this weekend! Very helpfull! Mummert has always been sort of a mystery hero, earning the highest decorations but not getting any publicity. Anyway, here's a little note on other Personalities of the Division.
This note is from Tony LeTissier, “Race for the Reichstag” pages 209-210:

Muncheberg Panzer Division (Maj.-Gen. Werner Mummert)
1st Muncheberg PzGr Regt. (2 Bns.) (Col. Goder)
2nd Muncheberg PzGr Regt. (3 Bns.) (Lt. Col. Werner Rodust)
Muncheberg Pz Regt. (Lt. Col. Kuno von Meyer)
1st Bn. Muncheberg Pz Regt. (Maj. Marquad)
2nd Bn. Muncheberg Pz Regt. (Capt./Maj. Horst Zobel)
Muncheberg Armd Arty Regt. (2 Bns.) (Lt. Col. Martin Buhr)
920th SPG Training Brigade (Maj. Wolfgang Kapp)

Now unfortunately we don't have dates of appointment or service with the Division, but we can safely assume, this being 1945, that these fellows have been around. So, if you recognize any names, give a holler!!! Best Regards, David :D

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JC
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Werner Mummert

Post by JC » 18 May 2002 02:13

Regarding Werner Mummert’s RK. It is interesting that Otto Weidinger (or Otto Kumm) would think that, because, according to the HPA Ritterkreuz conferral cards, Mummert was recommended for the RK in the spring of 1942 but it was not approved. He actually received the award for actions in August 1942 by a combined force he led that destroyed a very menacing Soviet penetration north of Rzhev. By then, Das Reich was relaxing in France.

Jeff

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David C. Clarke
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Well Gentlemen!

Post by David C. Clarke » 18 May 2002 02:33

Well Gentlemen, it seems we have a disagreement about Mummert's Ritterkreuz. I can't help here. For some reason he doesn't appear in
Christian Federl's "Die Ritterkreuztrager der Deutschen Panzerdivisionen", my only reference book on the subject. Cheers, David :(

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David C. Clarke
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Personality

Post by David C. Clarke » 18 May 2002 02:47

Personalities

Well, Federl’s book isn’t totally useless (just not worth what I paid for it, Heh Heh!). on page 339 there is a write-up of Horst Zobel:

Jahrgang 1918
+02.10.99

Ritterkreuz: 14.04.1945
Eingereicht: 25.03.1945
als Hauptmann
Kommandeur
Pz. Abt. “Muncheberg”
Pz. Div. “Muncheberg”
AOK: 9. Armee
Heeresgruppe Weichsel
Vorl. Bess. Zeug. Und Ausz.
Ab 19.04.1945 an: Heeresgruppe Weischsel
EK 2. Klasse: 21.06.1940

You know guys, this could be a long Thread. Very Best Regards, David :D

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David C. Clarke
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And Another Personality

Post by David C. Clarke » 18 May 2002 03:25

Personalities:

Another Ritterkreuz holder, courtesy of Federl, page 201:

Kuno von Meyer

Jahrgang 1913
Diensteintritt: 01.06.1934

Ritterkreuz: 26.11.1944
Eingereicht: 09.11.1944
Als Major
Kommandeur
I./Pz. Rgt. 24
116. Pz. Div.
AOK: 7. Armee
Heeresgruppe B
795. Eichenlaub: 23.03.1945
eingereicht: 14.03.1945
als Oberstleutnant
Kommandeur
Pz. Rgt. “Coburg”
408 Inf. Div.
AOK: 17. Armee
Heeresgruppe Mitte

Vorl. Bes. Zeug. Und Ausz.
Ab: 03.12.1944 an: AOK 7

EK 2. Klasse: 19.10.1939
EK 1. Klasse: 01.07.1940
DkiG : 10.01.1943

For a scratch Panzer Division, Muncheberg contained some highly decorated Commanders. Cheers, David :D

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Post by Andy H » 18 May 2002 10:57

Hi David

It was from "Tragedy of the Faithful" page 333.

I think you have this book but anyway on Page 306 it mentions that 'M' was allocated Sector D (Tempelhof & Steglitz) on April 25th'45.

After a report from Krebs the Nordland & 'M' were ordered by Weidling tp launch a c/a to clean up dangerous penertrations at Tempelhof Airfield & in Neukolln. So during the morning of April 26th 'M' attacked southward from the northwest end of the Tempelhof Airfield with it's last ten tanks, but the attack soon came to a halt due to Russian defensive fire. (Pg307)

Also the "Barenfanger" KG mentioned in an earlier posting was commanded by Gen.Maj Barenfanger and he had been in command of Sectors A & B of Berlin with immobile units, Volksturm and HJ.

By April 27th 'M' was in the Wilmersdorf area of Berlin (Pg312)

Tigers from s.SS Pz.Abt 503 supported both 18th PzG & 'M' at the Westkreuz & Hlensee train stations and on the Kurfursten-Damm. (Pg318)

Gen.Mummert was determined to breakout through Spandau with his division. The Havel bridges were still held by HJ Kampfgruppen. Elements of Nordland at the zoo joined with Mummerts and during the night of May1/2 the breakout was in progress at Weidendammer bridge. By May 2nd the breakout spearhead had reached Staaken (Pg332-333)

Andy

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JC
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Mummert

Post by JC » 18 May 2002 12:42

David,

Upon checking I find that Die Eichenlaubträger 1940-1945, by Franz Thomas has a description of the events attending to the awarding of Mummert's RK (for actions in August 1942, not February). Also, Federl's book is good, but there are many men missing that should be included. I made at list of the missing at one time and found some 24, and that was just the obvious ones (Div, Brig, Rgt, commanders)!

Jeff

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